Rumor What's going on in Portland?

[barfo]

antifa, might be anti-facism but often times people turn into what they hate the most. I'd say Trump wouldn't mind being a fascist authoritative figure, but when antifa is demanding politicians step down so they can replace them with their own people, it sounds like they don't mind the idea of governmental authority, they just want to be the ones to wield it.

I haven't ever heard of anyone in antifa wanting to have governmental authority. And if a politician did step down due to antifa's demand, which is itself highly improbable, there is no mechanism whatsoever to replace that politician with a member of antifa. Or am I missing something?

barfo

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

I haven't ever heard of anyone in antifa wanting to have governmental authority. And if a politician did step down due to antifa's demand, which is itself highly improbable, there is no mechanism whatsoever to replace that politician with a member of antifa. Or am I missing something?

barfo

Antifa is literally running the biggest competitor to Wheeler in Portland.
Sarah Iannarone

 

[barfo]

Antifa is literally running the biggest competitor to Wheeler in Portland.
Sarah Iannarone

Yes, she said she was antifa, but that's a bit like me saying I'm a commie pinko. Real commie pinkos would find me disgustingly bourgeois.

barfo

 

[Lanny]

Yes, she said she was antifa, but that's a bit like me saying I'm a commie pinko. Real commie pinkos would find me disgustingly bourgeois.

barfo

In fact, you're only half that since I don't find you bourgeois at all. As for the other half, welcome to my world.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Yes, she said she was antifa, but that's a bit like me saying I'm a commie pinko. Real commie pinkos would find me disgustingly bourgeois.

barfo

I was not even completely referring to her saying she is 'antifa' comment. Just answering your question about replacing the authority with their own. That is in fact what they want to do.

 

[Lanny]

I was not even completely referring to her saying she is 'antifa' comment. Just answering your question about replacing the authority with their own. That is in fact what they want to do.

You can't say that.
There's no such thing as an ANTIFA. It's just a loose affiliation. It has no formal structure.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

You can't say that.
There's no such thing as an ANTIFA. It's just a loose affiliation. It has no formal structure.

https://rosecityantifa.org/

If you think they're just randomly showing up with no leadership, or organizational structure every night to protest I guess you're free to think that but they seem really freaking good at managing to all show up at certain places, at certain times, with supplies every night...

 

[Lanny]

https://rosecityantifa.org/

If you think they're just randomly showing up with no leadership, or organizational structure every night to protest I guess you're free to think that but they seem really freaking good at managing to all show up at certain places, at certain times, with supplies every night...

Who is their President?
Show me their platform or charter.
Who are their officers?
Who recognizes them?
Give me some evidence that they are structured.

 

[barfo]

I was not even completely referring to her saying she is 'antifa' comment. Just answering your question about replacing the authority with their own. That is in fact what they want to do.

They probably don't even vote, most of them.

barfo

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Who is their President?
Show me their platform or charter.
Who are their officers?
Who recognizes them?
Give me some evidence that they are structured.

I just did.
Whether you want to acknowledge it or not is up to you. ANTIFA does exist, it's not a myth. They may skirt some of the traditional political organizational structures, but they are organized.
Structure, is not dependent on any of the things you mentioned.
Various journalists have called out in advance where antifa plans to meet on nights, and what buildings they plan to attack, and they have been right.
That would lead most people to believe that they're communicating and organizing with each other and it's not just like 10 people... It's sometimes several hundred so call it whatever you want, they exist though and in my opinion it's more than just random buddies showing up to pioneer square on a Thursday...

 

[Lanny]

https://rosecityantifa.org/

If you think they're just randomly showing up with no leadership, or organizational structure every night to protest I guess you're free to think that but they seem really freaking good at managing to all show up at certain places, at certain times, with supplies every night...

That's just a web page. Means nothing. I can create a web page if I want to shell out a few bucks. Of course, mine would only be good while my computer was not shut down for the night.
You've shown nothing that I asked for.

 

[Orion Bailey]

That's just a web page. Means nothing. I can create a web page if I want to shell out a few bucks. Of course, mine would only be good while my computer was not shut down for the night.

but Lanny. Creating a webpage and outlining agendas is organizing. Just because there arent elected officials i na group or party doesn't mean they dont have leadership.

Chaz had a clear leader and he wasnt elected.

 

[Propagandist]

i love how the one like this got is from someone who is never here in portland to see.

nah. We dont have blind followers who will tribal gang here... lol

anyhow i drove all over portland this last weekend? 205, 84 and i5.

The city is trash.

Junk everywhere. Trash piling into the streets in some areas. Tents EVERYWHERE....

two city blocks my ass. Some people just live in a bubble i suppose...

Actual protesting and violence my just be downtown but the ripple effects are city wide...

There have been tents and garbage EVERYWHERE for the last 5 years. Zero has changed from the protests, except for sure there is more graffitti.

 

[Orion Bailey]

There have been tents and garbage EVERYWHERE for the last 5 years. Zero has changed from the protests, except for sure there is more graffitti.

But. A year ago, I was told the city is clean and people tried ot make a fool of me for saying what you just did. So if it was clean then but dirty now.....

I mean I was called names here for claiming the city had a homeless issue all over town. You may have missed it.

 

[Lanny]

but Lanny. Creating a webpage and outlining agendas is organizing. Just because there arent elected officials i na group or party doesn't mean they dont have leadership.

Chaz had a clear leader and he wasnt elected.

Okay, let me say it different. ANTIFA has no official structure or leadership. The new keyword is 'OFFICIAL'. Therefor, as I've said numerous times, it is an unofficial loose affiliation of individuals. with no official structure.

 

[Propagandist]

But. A year ago, I was told the city is clean and people tried ot make a fool of me for saying what you just did. So if it was clean then but dirty now.....

I mean I was called names here for claiming the city had a homeless issue all over town. You may have missed it.

Not to do the in-my-day thing, but I remember when out-of-towners once remarked on the cleanliness of the city... Now, this place is fucked. Hands down my least favorite part of this city, and this country for that matter (Christian as it is), is the collective shrug in the face of the homeless crisis.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Okay, let me say it different. ANTIFA has no official structure or leadership. The new keyword is 'OFFICIAL'. Therefor, as I've said numerous times, it is an unofficial loose affiliation of individuals. with no official structure.

what would constitute official?

most parties don't start out instantly organized and official.
Antifa is a political movement and can toss their support to any candidate regardless of being official or having an official spokesperson.
Im not sure why they need to have to be official in order to change votes?

 

[Orion Bailey]

Not to do the in-my-day thing, but I remember when out-of-towners once remarked on the cleanliness of the city... Now, this place is fucked. Hands down my least favorite part of this city, and this country for that matter (Christian as it is), is the collective shrug in the face of the homeless crisis.

yeahs its one of two maim reasons why we moved out.
The other was increasing crime in our area.

 

[jonnyboy]

What he is saying is the tents are not because of the protests. There has been a homeless problem for a long time in Portland and it has been compounded by the coronavirus. A lot of people lost their jobs and homes and we are seeing that in a dramatic rise of the number of tents around Portland.

I dont think he is questioning your take on antifa or what is going on downtown. He is just saying a lot of the tents and trash outside downtown are because of a rise in homeless not the protests.

This raises an interesting question.

When you lose your job, health insurance and are homeless, are the effects of coronavirus likely to be better or worse?

That’s a question for the ‘shut shit down’ posse.

 

[Lanny]

what would constitute official?

most parties don't start out instantly organized and official.
Antifa is a political movement and can toss their support to any candidate regardless of being official or having an official spokesperson.
Im not sure why they need to have to be official in order to change votes?

Official is something recognized by the government or a court of law. Try suing ANTIFA.
ANTiFA cannot support one candidate or another because someone else in the loose affiliation could support someone else just as easily. Then, who would ANTIFA officially support? No, a group of people who call themselves ANTIFA, with no official membership could support this person or that and there would not be any kind of official support other than a group of people who happen to like Joe Blow.

 

[Propagandist]

I'm with @Lanny. This equating antifa with a political party or some sort of organized group is super misleading. It's a Trumpism. Antifa proper is primarily a small group of people that spend most of their time and money doxing, ie exposing, nazis to their employers and the public. I'd wager, literally, 99% of the people breaking shit and wreaking havoc are just people wearing black. If I headed down tonight and tossed a tomato at the police, would I be antifa? Are my daughter and her friends antifa? It's just silly talk.

It's PEOPLE. People are angry, and they are caught up in the movement. Just like everything in life, moderation is probably best, but not everyone can dial it down, and those are the people we see, the people blinded by their passion. Now, do they serve antifa's purpose? That's a different question. Maybe. For me, it's always the spirit of the thing that matters--the intent. The intent is to make things better.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

I'm with @Lanny. This equating antifa with a political party or some sort of organized group is super misleading. It's a Trumpism. Antifa proper is primarily a small group of people that spend most of their time and money doxing, ie exposing, nazis to their employers and the public. I'd wager, literally, 99% of the people breaking shit and wreaking havoc are just people wearing black. If I headed down tonight and tossed a tomato at the police, would I be antifa? Are my daughter and her friends antifa? It's just silly talk.

It's PEOPLE. People are angry, and they are caught up in the movement. Just like everything in life, moderation is probably best, but not everyone can dial it down, and those are the people we see, the people blinded by their passion. Now, do they serve antifa's purpose? That's a different question. Maybe. For me, it's always the spirit of the thing that matters--the intent. The intent is to make things better.

Ok... Sorry but if ANTIFA is just some ambiguous group, of loosely affiliated carbon bodies then how would you know what, Antifa proper does? You’re on one hand saying we cant define it by a structure then trying to define it by that groups intent and what they do...
Whether those claiming ‘antifa’ as their own are in a structured organized group, or politically affiliated isnt really the point. The point is that 150-200 on most evenings who claim to be ANTIFA are organized enough to pick locations, targets, have supplies ready, which means that their either self-funded or have some help btw. Its not a matter of trumpism, its a matter of calling it what it is. They are a group of largely the same people who get together on a mostly nightly basis to go protest politics. Thats all fine and good and they can do what they want, but that group exists, and they do in fact have political things they are protesting.

 

[Lanny]

Ok... Sorry but if ANTIFA is just some ambiguous group, of loosely affiliated carbon bodies then how would you know what, Antifa proper does? You’re on one hand saying we cant define it by a structure then trying to define it by that groups intent and what they do...
Whether those claiming ‘antifa’ as their own are in a structured organized group, or politically affiliated isnt really the point. The point is that 150-200 on most evenings who claim to be ANTIFA are organized enough to pick locations, targets, have supplies ready, which means that their either self-funded or have some help btw. Its not a matter of trumpism, its a matter of calling it what it is. They are a group of largely the same people who get together on a mostly nightly basis to go protest politics. Thats all fine and good and they can do what they want, but that group exists, and they do in fact have political things they are protesting.

I give up.

 

[Propagandist]

Ok... Sorry but if ANTIFA is just some ambiguous group, of loosely affiliated carbon bodies then how would you know what, Antifa proper does? You’re on one hand saying we cant define it by a structure then trying to define it by that groups intent and what they do...
Whether those claiming ‘antifa’ as their own are in a structured organized group, or politically affiliated isnt really the point. The point is that 150-200 on most evenings who claim to be ANTIFA are organized enough to pick locations, targets, have supplies ready, which means that their either self-funded or have some help btw. Its not a matter of trumpism, its a matter of calling it what it is. They are a group of largely the same people who get together on a mostly nightly basis to go protest politics. Thats all fine and good and they can do what they want, but that group exists, and they do in fact have political things they are protesting.

I just think this is a watching from distance thing. People in my life are deep in this stuff. All there is is social media, IG, telling people what's up; I could look at my feed right now and know where people want to meet and who is bringing what. They are college kids and baristas and tattoo artists...just people. Passionate people looking out for one another. I mean, I'm always hearing grassroots this and grassroots that; this is actual grassroots. The notion that there are roaming antifa militias or whatever is just fear (and fear mongering) talking...

Folks might be adopting the name antifa, but they ain't Rose City Antifa. It just isn't like that. And if it isn't a Trumpism, it is only because he willed them into existence. Haha.

Clearly it is hard for people to accept, and I'm kind of confused what the obsession is even about--this need to categorize or whatever it is. Do yourself a favor and start a correspondence with RCA and ask them all your questions. I'm positive they'll make more sense than me...

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

I just think this is a watching from distance thing. People in my life are deep in this stuff. All there is is social media, IG, telling people what's up; I could look at my feed right now and know where people want to meet and who is bringing what. They are college kids and baristas and tattoo artists...just people. Passionate people looking out for one another. I mean, I'm always hearing grassroots this and grassroots that; this is actual grassroots. The notion that there are roaming antifa militias or whatever is just fear (and fear mongering) talking...

Folks might be adopting the name antifa, but they ain't Rose City Antifa. It just isn't like that. And if it isn't a Trumpism, it is only because he willed them into existence. Haha.

Clearly it is hard for people to accept, and I'm kind of confused what the obsession is even about--this need to categorize or whatever it is. Do yourself a favor and start a correspondence with RCA and ask them all your questions. I'm positive they'll make more sense than me...

Every group always consists of 'people', normal people who do normal things most of the time and then get together for a certain cause. What you're describing isn't really any different than anything else though... Blazer fans are all just normal people, who decide to get together to scream for a while at how badly managed the team is. Does it mean Blazer fans don't exist because there's not a place you could sue them, or that they don't have a structured who's the official Blazer fan president?
Does it mean that if two Blazer fans go burn down a building that all blazer fans are arsonists? No of course it doesn't mean that.

The thing is and I'm speaking exclusively about the people out protesting every night. I see it, I have seen it. They call themselves antifa, and they are organized to at least some extent, and from arrest records and all that it's typically the same groups of people out there most nights. Now, are they affiliated with 'rose city antifa? I doubt it, but I'm sure there are some members of rose-city-antifa who are involved but it's just conjecture.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Official is something recognized by the government or a court of law. Try suing ANTIFA.
ANTiFA cannot support one candidate or another because someone else in the loose affiliation could support someone else just as easily. Then, who would ANTIFA officially support? No, a group of people who call themselves ANTIFA, with no official membership could support this person or that and there would not be any kind of official support other than a group of people who happen to like Joe Blow.

Okay, but there are republicans who don't support Trump. That doesn't make sense. Just because they don't all politically align on all things doesn't mean they don't have a unified political agenda and can use that to influence voting, etc. The only thing that matters is they are aiding to push people away from a just movement with the tactics they use, so in reality they have already started influencing voters. just the opposite of what they strive for. There is no sweeping movement of support for Antifa like there is BLM. BLM's tactics have been much more peaceful overall, though they also have their extremists. At any rate Antifa is absolutely a political entity with influence.

I'm with @Lanny. This equating antifa with a political party or some sort of organized group is super misleading. It's a Trumpism. Antifa proper is primarily a small group of people that spend most of their time and money doxing, ie exposing, nazis to their employers and the public. I'd wager, literally, 99% of the people breaking shit and wreaking havoc are just people wearing black. If I headed down tonight and tossed a tomato at the police, would I be antifa? Are my daughter and her friends antifa? It's just silly talk.

It's PEOPLE. People are angry, and they are caught up in the movement. Just like everything in life, moderation is probably best, but not everyone can dial it down, and those are the people we see, the people blinded by their passion. Now, do they serve antifa's purpose? That's a different question. Maybe. For me, it's always the spirit of the thing that matters--the intent. The intent is to make things better.

Then why are they trying to set federal buildings on fire on a regular basis? You are saying those are just anarchist standing along side Antifa? dress the same as antifa?
I get what you are saying about the spirit of things, but hasn't history proven you cant begat violence with violence? Doesn't violence always leave one side feeling...abused... wronged... etc? Doesn't that almost always lead to a want of revenge?

What happened to Black people in this country is absolutely tragic and one of man's historical atrocities. He have slowly been trying to fix it and now have become glaringly aware of how the institution also needs to change. But it cant all happen at once or it all collapses. And this demand for instant change all of a sudden, to me, is going to undermine all that has improved. More and more people who were in support or on the fence are stepping up and saying this is enough. You lose me if it continues. And I don't speak of peaceful protests. I speak of the ones lighting things on fires.

So two things come to mind. Antifa, needs to call these people out and separate themselves from them, if they truly aren't Antifa. Second, intent is great and all, but if it doesn't make things better, then its just misdirected and wasted energy.

 

[Hoopguru]

When people go into a restaurant and harass others and even intimidate fro politcel reasons

Prison time!

 

[Propagandist]

Every group always consists of 'people', normal people who do normal things most of the time and then get together for a certain cause. What you're describing isn't really any different than anything else though... Blazer fans are all just normal people, who decide to get together to scream for a while at how badly managed the team is. Does it mean Blazer fans don't exist because there's not a place you could sue them, or that they don't have a structured who's the official Blazer fan president?
Does it mean that if two Blazer fans go burn down a building that all blazer fans are arsonists? No of course it doesn't mean that.

The thing is and I'm speaking exclusively about the people out protesting every night. I see it, I have seen it. They call themselves antifa, and they are organized to at least some extent, and from arrest records and all that it's typically the same groups of people out there most nights. Now, are they affiliated with 'rose city antifa? I doubt it, but I'm sure there are some members of rose-city-antifa who are involved but it's just conjecture.

Whatever you say, man. I'm an Avenger.

 

[THE HCP]

Whatever you say, man. I'm an Avenger.

You would probably be the dork with a bow and arrow huh?


You know who THE HCP is FAMS!