Whats more important...

[Natebishop3]

All this talk about Miller, Roy, and their ability to coexist is really quite ridiculous.

As much as I love Roy, and I truly think he's a great player, he is only one cog in a greater machine. This team will not win a championship based entirely on the merits of Brandon Roy.

In my opinion, this team sorely lacked a true point guard last season. Someone who would get all of our many weapons involved in the offense. Brandon, for all his skills, has never been able to achieve this. It's really the biggest criticism I have for him. He can pass, and at times he can wrack up the assists, but he is not a point guard.

Andre Miller is a true point guard. He is going to run the offense. He is going to dictate the tempo. He is going to push the ball and find the open man. If adding Miller can push Aldridge, speed up our offense, and get Greg Oden involved, then I think that supersedes Brandon Roy and his comfort zone.

I would rather see Andre Miller play, Greg Oden flourish, and Aldridge reach his potential, while winning a championship. If Brandon Roy cannot be a part of that, and if he is going to complain about "his game" and "his touches" than he takes a back seat in my mind.

Now, I'm not saying we should turn our backs on Roy. I'm just being preemptive because this is a hot topic. I'm hoping Roy and Miller can find a way to play together. I'm hoping Roy can learn to play with Miller. I'm hoping he can pick up where he left off last season, but if he can't, and Roy struggles, but the team is winning and Oden is playing at an All-Star level, I won't have much sympathy for Roy.

 

[B-Roy]

I would rather see Andre Miller play, Greg Oden flourish, and Aldridge reach his potential, while winning a championship. If Brandon Roy cannot be a part of that, and if he is going to complain about "his game" and "his touches" than he takes a back seat in my mind.

That's completely missing the big picture imo. For one, we don't know if having Miller makes our bigs significantly better. Secondly, Miller only has 2 or 3 prime years left. What happens once Miller retires and Oden/Aldridge don't have that "pure" point guard to guide them anymore?

Roy has one major advantage over Miller (besides being a significantly better player), and that's youth.

I would rather have Roy than Miller, end of story.

 

[Natebishop3]

That's completely missing the big picture imo. For one, we don't know if having Miller makes our bigs significantly better. Secondly, Miller only has 2 or 3 prime years left. What happens once Miller retires and Oden/Aldridge don't have that "pure" point guard to guide them anymore?

Roy has one major advantage over Miller (besides being a significantly better player), and that's youth.

I would rather have Roy than Miller, end of story.

It's all about the big picture. It's about winning championships. If we can win a championship in the next three years, Roy should understand that he is part of a whole, and his personal numbers are less important than winning. I'm not saying that we know for sure yet that Miller is THE KEY, but I'm just saying that Miller is the kind of player we have been needing. If he turns out to be the missing piece, and he boosts guys like Oden and Aldridge, then the team collective becomes more important than Roy.

 

[B-Roy]

It's all about the big picture. It's about winning championships. If we can win a championship in the next three years, Roy should understand that he is part of a whole, and his personal numbers are less important than winning. I'm not saying that we know for sure yet that Miller is THE KEY, but I'm just saying that Miller is the kind of player we have been needing. If he turns out to be the missing piece, and he boosts guys like Oden and Aldridge, then the team collective becomes more important than Roy.

And how long will it take before we know Andre is the key?

By the way, I haven't heard anything about Roy saying he's worried about his own numbers. He just said he's uncomfortable at the moment with Miller, and since it's only been a few weeks, I don't think that's very outrageous.

 

[Natebishop3]

And how long will it take before we know Andre is the key?

By the way, I haven't heard anything about Roy saying he's worried about his own numbers. He just said he's uncomfortable at the moment with Miller, and since it's only been a few weeks, I don't think that's very outrageous.

I'd say we should know pretty quickly if Andre is the key.

Mostly I'm just making this post because it seems to be a topic amongst us posters. I'm not saying that Roy specifically has been bitching to the media. He's made a few comments about being uncomfortable and liking the ball in his hands, but most of the talk has been from the pundits and the posters.

 

[MARIS61]

Andre is a poor man's Brandon, same skills and weaknesses, and neither is selfless enough to be the point man on a consistent playoff contender.

Unfortunately, neither is very good at moving without the ball or helping others get free with picks either. And both give up early and often when defending PG's.

This team needs a PG who will make everybody better, by giving them good percentage shots and help defense, and by treating Roy like any other player on the team.

 

[Nikolokolus]

It's a pure hypothetical at this point, but one of the big things that jump out at me about Brandon and his prominent role in running the offense through his hands for the past two years is the fact that he was either paired up with Jarret Jack (who isn't a point and couldn't run an offense) or Steve (who isn't dynamic and physically gifted enough to run the point as a true play-maker). I have a feeling that this issue of "needing" to initiate the offense won't be as pressing for Brandon because of two factors: 1) maturation as a player and 2) because he's finally paired up with a guard like Miller who actually doesn't need to dominate the ball all the time as has been erroneously reported.

To answer your main question though, I'm a Blazers fan, not a Brandon fan; if Miller can make Aldridge and Oden dominant and Roy takes on a somewhat diminished role or level of prominence and the team wins a championship that way then it's tough cookies for Brandon -- I'm a much bigger fan of offenses that feature dominant inside scoring from the power forward and center positions versus guard/wing oriented offenses.

 

[RoyIsClutch07]

It's all about the big picture. It's about winning championships. If we can win a championship in the next three years, Roy should understand that he is part of a whole, and his personal numbers are less important than winning. I'm not saying that we know for sure yet that Miller is THE KEY, but I'm just saying that Miller is the kind of player we have been needing. If he turns out to be the missing piece, and he boosts guys like Oden and Aldridge, then the team collective becomes more important than Roy.

It think it's irrelevant mainly because Roy and Miller will stick. And if they don't, no matter how much better Andre makes everyone else. He will be gone.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Andre is a poor man's Brandon, same skills and weaknesses, and neither is selfless enough to be the point man on a consistent playoff contender.

Unfortunately, neither is very good at moving without the ball or helping others get free with picks either. And both give up early and often when defending PG's.

This team needs a PG who will make everybody better, by giving them good percentage shots and help defense, and by treating Roy like any other player on the team.

If you're lost here's the way home:
http://espn.go.com/nba/clubhouse?team=sac
http://www.sactownroyalty.com/

 

[Natebishop3]

It think it's irrelevant mainly because Roy and Miller will stick. And if they don't, no matter how much better Andre makes everyone else. He will be gone.

I think you're wrong. Greg Oden is more important to this franchises future than Roy. If Andre Miller can get Oden playing at an All-Star level, and Oden looked great last night, then I would say his job is safe.

I don't want there to be confusion. I love Roy on our team. I think he's a great player. I truly enjoy watching him, and I really don't want to see him struggle or, god forbid, leave our team. I'm just saying that I think the overall success of this team is far more important.

 

[RoyIsClutch07]

I think you're wrong. Greg Oden is more important to this franchises future than Roy. If Andre Miller can get Oden playing at an All-Star level, and Oden looked great last night, then I would say his job is safe.

I don't want there to be confusion. I love Roy on our team. I think he's a great player. I truly enjoy watching him, and I really don't want to see him struggle or, god forbid, leave our team. I'm just saying that I think the overall success of this team is far more important.

It is important, I agree. But Brandon Roy is the franchise. He is the face of the team. HE ain't going anywhere. If he ain't happy with a certain a situation or person, I feel for the person the vendetta is against. Kind of like Zach. All he had to do was speak up and he was gone. Furthermore, the team showed they could have great success without a player or a point like Miller in rotation. IF the two can't coexist which I think is worthless to be talking about, because they will. Andre will be gone.

 

[Ed O]

Andre is a poor man's Brandon, same skills and weaknesses, and neither is selfless enough to be the point man on a consistent playoff contender.

Are you comparing Andre Miller and Brandon Roy?

Second question: have you ever seen either of them play?

Ed O.

 

[Nikolokolus]

I think you're wrong. Greg Oden is more important to this franchises future than Roy. If Andre Miller can get Oden playing at an All-Star level, and Oden looked great last night, then I would say his job is safe.

I don't want there to be confusion. I love Roy on our team. I think he's a great player. I truly enjoy watching him, and I really don't want to see him struggle or, god forbid, leave our team. I'm just saying that I think the overall success of this team is far more important.

I think what you're really asking is this: If Brandon can't integrate his game into what this team is doing and Greg actually lives up to the billing he got coming out of college and turns himself into the linchpin of this team's championship aspirations, would we be willing to trade Brandon Roy, Travis Outlaw, Jerryd Bayless, Martell Webster and a first round draft pick for Chris Paul in two years when Miller's career is winding down?

Hmmm ... I'll go ahead and commit Blazers blasphemy here and say it, "yes."

 

[RoyIsClutch07]

I think what you're really asking is this: If Brandon can't integrate his game into what this team is doing and Greg actually lives up to the billing he got coming out of college and turns himself into the linchpin of this team's championship aspirations, would we be willing to trade Brandon Roy, Travis Outlaw, Jerryd Bayless, Martell Webster and a first round draft pick for Chris Paul in two years when Miller's career is winding down?

Hmmm ... I'll go ahead and commit Blazers blasphemy here and say it, "yes."

I don't see it. But maybe. The team has built this thing around Roy.

 

[MrSelfDestruct]

I think what you're really asking is this: If Brandon can't integrate his game into what this team is doing and Greg actually lives up to the billing he got coming out of college and turns himself into the linchpin of this team's championship aspirations, would we be willing to trade Brandon Roy, Travis Outlaw, Jerryd Bayless, Martell Webster and a first round draft pick for Chris Paul in two years when Miller's career is winding down?

Hmmm ... I'll go ahead and commit Blazers blasphemy here and say it, "yes."

Ditto. Especially if Batum continues to progress. Although I don't think Travis will be here in two years.

 

[rocketeer]

All this talk about Miller, Roy, and their ability to coexist is really quite ridiculous.

As much as I love Roy, and I truly think he's a great player, he is only one cog in a greater machine. This team will not win a championship based entirely on the merits of Brandon Roy.

In my opinion, this team sorely lacked a true point guard last season.

i would say that the idea that the blazers need a "true point guard" is really quite ridiculous.

roy and miller are going to be able to play together, the questions are will they be as good together as they would be alongside players who compliment them better and what combination of players will get portland the most wins?

i personally don't think that the addition of miller offers an upgrade to the blazers team. i feel that while he's obviously a much better player than sergio(though just slotting bayless into sergio's minutes would have been an upgrade as well) and better than blake he doesn't really fit with the team and i expect that to cause his contributions to be less than just the sum of his talent.

it's not ridiculous talk at all. playing the combination of players who will give the blazers the best chance to succeed is important. i feel starting blake to make sure he plays almost exclusively alongside roy is important. this maximizes blake's abilities as well as roy's. miller coming off the bench(but playing 28-30 minutes) will play both alongside roy and rudy. when miller plays with roy, roy gets to work off the ball and not carry as much of the load. this also gets miller a lot of minutes with rudy which ensures that the blazers don't struggle with playmaking like they may with a blake/rudy backcourt. and this maximizes what miller brings to the table because he isn't forced to play off the ball nearly as much as he would be if he plays most of his minutes with roy. and while you may call that a dumb coaches gimmick, you certainly never responded to me when i brought up that many of the best teams and coaches in the league last year did something similar.

 

[rocketeer]

I'm just saying that I think the overall success of this team is far more important.

of course the overall success of the team is more important just like the overall success of the team is far more important than starting andre miller or having what you would consider a true pg.

 

[PapaG]

All this talk about Miller, Roy, and their ability to coexist is really quite ridiculous.

As much as I love Roy, and I truly think he's a great player, he is only one cog in a greater machine. This team will not win a championship based entirely on the merits of Brandon Roy.

In my opinion, this team sorely lacked a true point guard last season. Someone who would get all of our many weapons involved in the offense. Brandon, for all his skills, has never been able to achieve this. It's really the biggest criticism I have for him. He can pass, and at times he can wrack up the assists, but he is not a point guard.

Andre Miller is a true point guard. He is going to run the offense. He is going to dictate the tempo. He is going to push the ball and find the open man. If adding Miller can push Aldridge, speed up our offense, and get Greg Oden involved, then I think that supersedes Brandon Roy and his comfort zone.

I would rather see Andre Miller play, Greg Oden flourish, and Aldridge reach his potential, while winning a championship. If Brandon Roy cannot be a part of that, and if he is going to complain about "his game" and "his touches" than he takes a back seat in my mind.

Now, I'm not saying we should turn our backs on Roy. I'm just being preemptive because this is a hot topic. I'm hoping Roy and Miller can find a way to play together. I'm hoping Roy can learn to play with Miller. I'm hoping he can pick up where he left off last season, but if he can't, and Roy struggles, but the team is winning and Oden is playing at an All-Star level, I won't have much sympathy for Roy.

So ... you're setting up Roy as a scapegoat this season? Wow, this board sucks at times. I think you made a stupid post, Nate.

 

[KingSpeed]

It's all about the big picture. .

YES, and the Big Picture is that Andre Miller's much older than the rest of our team and will no longer be playing for us when Oden and LMA are in their prime. Roy has a whole Hall of Fame career ahead of him.

Building around Roy, one of the top 10 players in the league and a possible MVP candidate this season, IS the big picture.

 

[KingSpeed]

I think you're wrong. Greg Oden is more important to this franchises future than Roy. If Andre Miller can get Oden playing at an All-Star level, and Oden looked great last night, then I would say his job is safe.

I don't want there to be confusion. I love Roy on our team. I think he's a great player. I truly enjoy watching him, and I really don't want to see him struggle or, god forbid, leave our team. I'm just saying that I think the overall success of this team is far more important.

Oden needs to get HIMSELF to All-Star level. Miller can help but most of Greg's problems last season were his own. Oden will be better this season, yes, and you'll say it's because of Miller and that may be partly true but the real reason will be that he is a year older and worked hard with Bill Bayno this summer.

 

[KingSpeed]

That's completely missing the big picture imo. For one, we don't know if having Miller makes our bigs significantly better. Secondly, Miller only has 2 or 3 prime years left. What happens once Miller retires and Oden/Aldridge don't have that "pure" point guard to guide them anymore?

Roy has one major advantage over Miller (besides being a significantly better player), and that's youth.

I would rather have Roy than Miller, end of story.

Exactly.

Nate- you've gone crazy.

That's like adding Miller to the Lakers so that he can help Bynum but getting rid of Kobe. Stupid. Maybe the Cavs should get Tony Parker and then let LeBron go to the Knicks.

 

[PapaG]

I think you're wrong. Greg Oden is more important to this franchises future than Roy. If Andre Miller can get Oden playing at an All-Star level, and Oden looked great last night, then I would say his job is safe.

I don't want there to be confusion. I love Roy on our team. I think he's a great player. I truly enjoy watching him, and I really don't want to see him struggle or, god forbid, leave our team. I'm just saying that I think the overall success of this team is far more important.

Oden played the Kings last night. He had better nights statistically last year with Blake at the PG.

At least this board doesn't overreact to a few preseason games.

Get rid of Roy!!

Wow.

 

[KingSpeed]

Miller only had 1.4 assists (and 0.4 turnovers) more than Roy last season.

 

[PapaG]

Exactly.

Nate- you've gone crazy.

That's like adding Miller to the Lakers so that he can help Bynum but getting rid of Kobe. Stupid. Maybe the Cavs should get Tony Parker and then let LeBron go to the Knicks.

Times like these make me wonder how he ever had a press pass.

 

[KingSpeed]

TONIGHT THUS FAR:

Roy 5 assts, 1 turnover

Miller 3 assts, 3 turnovers

Nate- why are you pitting these guys against each other? Roy is and always has been a team guy. He'll make it work. So will Andre.

 

[PapaG]

TONIGHT THUS FAR:

Roy 5 assts, 1 turnover

Miller 3 assts, 3 turnovers

Nate- why are you pitting these guys against each other? Roy is and always has been a team guy. He'll make it work. So will Andre.

Keep in mind that the mods need board hits to drive activity. I take almost nothing a mod posts as being more than a flame post created to get some responses.

 

[Nikolokolus]

TONIGHT THUS FAR:

Roy 5 assts, 1 turnover

Miller 3 assts, 3 turnovers

Nate- why are you pitting these guys against each other? Roy is and always has been a team guy. He'll make it work. So will Andre.

I didn't really read Nate's OP that way at all, I see this as a purely hypothetical situation, since Miller and Roy will likely find a way to work together. The real issue here isn't Miller vs. Roy it's more about a guard oriented offense or a bigs oriented offense -- the difference between a team that makes it's living off of jumpers and 3s or dominating the post.

It all remains to be seen if Oden can sustain the performance he's shown in two pre-season games against the Kings. Personally I'm rooting for a team that dominates all phases of the game with both stellar guard play, sharp shooting and the ability to play back to the basket.

 

[PapaG]

I see this as a purely hypothetical situation

A hypothetical situation where the Blazers' franchise player is rendered expendable after 1.5 exhibition games against a 17 win Sacto team?

I just see a dumb thread.

 

[KingSpeed]

Personally I'm rooting for a team that dominates all phases of the game with both stellar guard play, sharp shooting and the ability to play back to the basket.

Exactly. Isn't that what we all want?

 

[KingSpeed]

Miller= 10 years in league and hasn't won a round in the playoffs. He's had lots of time to get it done and hasn't.

No matter, let's get rid of 4th year Roy (top 10 player in the league) and hand the team over to Miller whose career will end right about the time Roy hits his prime.

So stupid.

Big picture? LMAO!!!!