Whiteside can not be traded.

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I have a different take. I don't think Hassan is going to score a major contract because of the value of a center in today's league. He's been described as a malcontent. He's in a contract year. He's been lazy before. This is the argument against him from other GMs in the league. Can we pay more than the MLE? If so, I don't think he'll get more than Nurk's 12. Why not pay that?

I've been a Hassan fan before he got to Portland. The wrap on him was unfair and I was always confident he'd show that. Let's also be clear that we're not a good team yet. The Blazers have to have an open mind regarding trades. As it stands however, Hassan is more valuable than Love or Griffin at the moment and I don't think that's changing anytime soon.
 
AmirIcon said:
I have a different take. I don't think Hassan is going to score a major contract because of the value of a center in today's league. He's been described as a malcontent. He's in a contract year. He's been lazy before. This is the argument against him from other GMs in the league. Can we pay more than the MLE? If so, I don't think he'll get more than Nurk's 12. Why not pay that?

I've been a Hassan fan before he got to Portland. The wrap on him was unfair and I was always confident he'd show that. Let's also be clear that we're not a good team yet. The Blazers have to have an open mind regarding trades. As it stands however, Hassan is more valuable than Love or Griffin at the moment and I don't think that's changing anytime soon.
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Because I think even if they let Baze and WS walk and try to resign they only have 12m in cap and they have to put a team together. Whiteside is going to be looking for his last payday, Im also not sure Whiteside or Nurk will accept a “bench role”.
 
AmirIcon said:
I have a different take. I don't think Hassan is going to score a major contract because of the value of a center in today's league. He's been described as a malcontent. He's in a contract year. He's been lazy before. This is the argument against him from other GMs in the league. Can we pay more than the MLE? If so, I don't think he'll get more than Nurk's 12. Why not pay that?

I've been a Hassan fan before he got to Portland. The wrap on him was unfair and I was always confident he'd show that. Let's also be clear that we're not a good team yet. The Blazers have to have an open mind regarding trades. As it stands however, Hassan is more valuable than Love or Griffin at the moment and I don't think that's changing anytime soon.
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I do like whiteside, if there was a clear path to keeping him and having him and Nurk that made sense Id love to take it. I just think the circumstances of his Contract and the Cap are going to make that very difficult.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
I do like whiteside, if there was a clear path to keeping him and having him and Nurk that made sense Id love to take it. I just think the circumstances of his Contract and the Cap are going to make that very difficult.
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Jody can afford it. Look, I'm not saying we shouldn't trade Hassan. I'm just saying we almost certainly shouldn't trade him. He's a huge impact guy so it'll be difficult to trade him for someone giving you the same impact. But in case you can, at a position of need with a healthy contract, then you look at it.

If you can't find that player, you keep Hassan and try to negotiate a deal. I don't think it's impossible. You promise the starting center position initially. No one is a bigger fan of Nurk than me, but he's coming back from a broken leg. Next season he must earn trust regarding his health. He won't demand to be a starter this season and in my opinion, not until half-way next season can he be back to who he was. If the issue arises, you deal with it at the time.

Having two high impact centers who want to start isn't the worst thing. You can trade one for a high impact player later if you can't find one before this deadline. People could have sworn there was no way to get Nurk at just 12 mil. I don't think Hassan will command more than that. My guess would actually be less because of age and reputation.
 
AmirIcon said:
Jody can afford it. Look, I'm not saying we shouldn't trade Hassan. I'm just saying we almost certainly shouldn't trade him. He's a huge impact guy so it'll be difficult to trade him for someone giving you the same impact. But in case you can, at a position of need with a healthy contract, then you look at it.

If you can't find that player, you keep Hassan and try to negotiate a deal. I don't think it's impossible. You promise the starting center position initially. No one is a bigger fan of Nurk than me, but he's coming back from a broken leg. Next season he must earn trust regarding his health. He won't demand to be a starter this season and in my opinion, not until half-way next season can he be back to who he was. If the issue arises, you deal with it at the time.

Having two high impact centers who want to start isn't the worst thing. You can trade one for a high impact player later if you can't find one before this deadline. People could have sworn there was no way to get Nurk at just 12 mil. I don't think Hassan will command more than that. My guess would actually be less because of age and reputation.
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But its not just it Jody can afford it. You have to fill out a roster, both Hassan and Nurkic have not been happy as a bench player in previous times in their career. Having a trade chip worth 27m is better than a trade chip of 12m. I get what you’re saying, Whitesides been really good, NO/Jody have tough decisions to make.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
But its not just it Jody can afford it. You have to fill out a roster, both Hassan and Nurkic have not been happy as a bench player in previous times in their career. Having a trade chip worth 27m is better than a trade chip of 12m. I get what you’re saying, Whitesides been really good, NO/Jody have tough decisions to make.
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If you can find a great young player that projects as a starter and is a big impact player, you trade Hassan. But you don't do it for a bad contract, old aged Kevin Love or oft-injured Blake Griffin. This is my problem - What do you get back for him? I'd rather keep him and deal with playing time issues down the road than to trade him for lesser value. Nurk has to prove he can stay healthy for a while. When we get there, we can make a trade. Again, unless you can find a value that is equivalent or more.
 
AmirIcon said:
I have a different take. I don't think Hassan is going to score a major contract because of the value of a center in today's league. He's been described as a malcontent. He's in a contract year. He's been lazy before. This is the argument against him from other GMs in the league. Can we pay more than the MLE? If so, I don't think he'll get more than Nurk's 12. Why not pay that?

I've been a Hassan fan before he got to Portland. The wrap on him was unfair and I was always confident he'd show that. Let's also be clear that we're not a good team yet. The Blazers have to have an open mind regarding trades. As it stands however, Hassan is more valuable than Love or Griffin at the moment and I don't think that's changing anytime soon.
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Both Whiteside and Bazemore have Full Bird Rights so technically we could offer them max contracts. However, they could just sign with another team and leave us high and dry like Aminu did last year (not implying anything just same situation).
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
But its not just it Jody can afford it. You have to fill out a roster, both Hassan and Nurkic have not been happy as a bench player in previous times in their career. Having a trade chip worth 27m is better than a trade chip of 12m. I get what you’re saying, Whitesides been really good, NO/Jody have tough decisions to make.
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That's a complete fallacy.

Good players on 'cheap' contracts are worth more than the same player getting paid double that
 
tester551 said:
That's a complete fallacy.

Good players on 'cheap' contracts are worth more than the same player getting paid double that
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If you’re trying to trade someone for a “better player” and their only making 12m, and the guy you want is making 30 then that is a bad trade asset unless you have another bad or expiring deal to combine it with.
Do you want to trade Nurk / whiteside + 2 guys for a guy like otto porter jr or just whiteside?
 
Watch Whiteside walk and sign with the Lakers.
 
I think we will trade him and its was Neil's plan all along unless something absolutely crazy comes about involving Nurk & some, for a prolific 3 or 4.
Whiteside along with Zman would anchor the 5.
 
wizenheimer said:
defining "worthwhile" might be a chore considering what Whiteside's 'worth' is to Portland:

PER:
Hassan Whiteside 25.6 Damian Lillard 24.5 CJ McCollum 17.3 Skal Labissière 15.5 Carmelo Anthony 13.9

TS%:
Hassan Whiteside .645 Rodney Hood .625 Damian Lillard .608 Skal Labissière .588 CJ McCollum .548 Carmelo Anthony .511

FTRate:
Damian Lillard .393 Hassan Whiteside .319 Mario Hezonja .290 Skal Labissière .226 Kent Bazemore .224

rebound rate:
Hassan Whiteside 23.4 Skal Labissière 15.2 Mario Hezonja 13.3 Carmelo Anthony 10.4 Anthony Tolliver 8.9

winshares:
Damian Lillard 4.4 Hassan Whiteside 3.6 CJ McCollum 2.0 Skal Labissière 1.5 Nassir Little 0.4

defensive box plus/minus:
Hassan Whiteside 3.1 Skal Labissière 1.8 Kent Bazemore 0.8 Mario Hezonja 0.0 Nassir Little -0.3

box plus/minus:
Damian Lillard 4.9 Hassan Whiteside 3.5 Skal Labissière 1.6 CJ McCollum 0.2 Kent Bazemore -1.8

winshares/48:
Hassan Whiteside .222 Damian Lillard .205 Skal Labissière .135 Rodney Hood .100 CJ McCollum .090

finding a Whiteside trade that brings in a player better than him seems like a total fantasy. And we've already seen from this current team vs last year's team, that it's a major miscalculation to think the Blazers can dump rebounding and defense for some hypothetical offensive upgrade, and get better. Portland isn't going to be trading Whiteside for Paul George or Pascal Siakam. I think his trade market is going to be fairly unimpressive, and the odds seem really high Portland will get worse after a trade.....at least any trade that seems realistic rather just some wishful thinking
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How is Lillard only 2nd in per ?
 
Hoopguru said:
I think we will trade him and its was Neil's plan all along unless something absolutely crazy comes about involving Nurk & some, for a prolific 3 or 4.
Whiteside along with Zman would anchor the 5.
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If Love is prolific enough Nurkic and Baze for Love works on the trade Machine.
 
Strenuus said:
Smart people trade whiteside.

There is no counter argument.
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Smart people consider what value they'd get in a trade involving Whiteside.

There is no counter argument.

It's not worth trading Whiteside if you're getting a player who is significantly older and on a bad contract.
 
AmirIcon said:
Smart people consider what value they'd get in a trade involving Whiteside.

There is no counter argument.

It's not worth trading Whiteside if you're getting a player who is significantly older and on a bad contract.
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How old do you think Love is...? Not that Im big into the idea of bringing Kevin Love in but he’s not “that” old... He’s 31, Whiteside is 30.
 
AmirIcon said:
Smart people consider what value they'd get in a trade involving Whiteside.

There is no counter argument.

It's not worth trading Whiteside if you're getting a player who is significantly older and on a bad contract.
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Nope.

You trade whiteside.

I already know i won this. You -almost- did the impossible though.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
They have to trade whiteside because theres basically no way to keep him, he’s an expiring deal and dont have money to pay him in the free market. It has absolutely nothing to do with his current “worth” to the team.

More than likely they’re looking for a star on a team who wants to start over thats where Blake and Klove come up, or they’ll just be looking to use him to add some depth.
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I don't agree. They didn't "have" to trade Aldridge or Matthews or Lopez when they were expiring. They didn't have to trade Aminu or Ed Davis or Gerald Henderson either. Sure, fans can say "at least get something for them"....but fans don't have to pay the tax or manage the cap.

it may be that Portland will trade one of both of Whiteside and Bazemore. But my hunch is they didn't trade for Whiteside thinking they were going to just trade him away 6 months later; they got him to make another playoff run, and the way he's been playing certainly supports that idea. A lot of times an expiring contract has more value to the team holding the contract than to other teams.

I just don't see any realistic trades out there for Whiteside that makes a lot of sense, either on the floor, or in terms of the future cap
 
If we don't trade both Whiteside and Bazemore for solid vets that can make us a legit contender next year, Olshey will have totally failed.
 
wizenheimer said:
I don't agree. They didn't "have" to trade Aldridge or Matthews or Lopez when they were expiring. They didn't have to trade Aminu or Ed Davis or Gerald Henderson either. Sure, fans can say "at least get something for them"....but fans don't have to pay the tax or manage the cap.

it may be that Portland will trade one of both of Whiteside and Bazemore. But my hunch is they didn't trade for Whiteside thinking they were going to just trade him away 6 months later; they got him to make another playoff run, and the way he's been playing certainly supports that idea. A lot of times an expiring contract has more value to the team holding the contract than to other teams.

I just don't see any realistic trades out there for Whiteside that makes a lot of sense, either on the floor, or in terms of the future cap
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They got him to fill in for Nurk because his leg was snapped. If Nurk was healthy I really doubt that trade is made. If they believe Nurk is going to be fine and playing his way back into things in Feb which is the trade deadline, thats the 6 months they traded him for. Neil’s already said that the goal is next year Nurk, Zach, Hood, CJ and Dame so it doesnt seem like he thinks he thinks Whiteside is part of the future. Sure he doesnt “have” to trade him bit Whiteside and Baze are the only significant trade chips they have if they want to upgrade the bench going into next year.

The expiring contract would be much nicer for the Blazers if they werent aready significantly over the cap.
 
It's like people forget that the reason why Nurk didn't work in Denver was because they were trying to make it work with him and Jokic. They tried playing them together. They tried bringing Nurk off the bench. I don't want to go down that road.
 
Tince said:
If we don't trade both Whiteside and Bazemore for solid vets that can make us a legit contender next year, Olshey will have totally failed.
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what "solid vets" do you see them being traded for? especially ones that would magically catapult Portland into being a "legit contender"...? that seems like way too high a standard

I mean, Bazemore had the value of Evan Turner, and Whiteside had the value of Meyers and Harkless....and both trades happened 5 months ago. Would Turner, Harkless, and Meyers make Portland a "legit contender" next year?

the only way Portland becomes a contender is if they land another player of Dame's caliber. Another player at the level of Hood won't do it. Portland's issues aren't centered in the middle & lower parts of the rotation, it's higher. Another couple of role players isn't bringing a championship to Portland
 
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Natebishop3 said:
It's like people forget that the reason why Nurk didn't work in Denver was because they were trying to make it work with him and Jokic. They tried playing them together. They tried bringing Nurk off the bench. I don't want to go down that road.
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Why not go down that road? That's like saying we shouldn't draft Chris Paul because of Sebastian Telfair. It's nonsense. When and if that time comes where you need to trade a center, you do it. Now isn't that time. It's fine if you can get a great piece back, but there's no reason to be on the losing end of a trade because you're worried about what your currently injured center says in a year and a half.

If you're trading one of the best big men in the league who won't cost you more than 12 mil when re-signing him, you better damn well get back a great player who would be an immediate starter and has considerable upside.
 
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