Why does Obama think hiring construction workers to rebuild roads....

[EL PRESIDENTE]

is the best way to fight off the unemployment problem? Do you really think a significant number of the unemployed in this country are cement mixers?

Sure, its good to have some infrastructure...but it seems a big part of his job creation ideas involves building more roads. I would think investing in high technology, manufacturing and other similar avenues would be better.

 

[barfo]

is the best way to fight off the unemployment problem? Do you really think a significant number of the unemployed in this country are cement mixers?

Sure, its good to have some infrastructure...but it seems a big part of his job creation ideas involves building more roads. I would think investing in high technology, manufacturing and other similar avenues would be better.

I imagine it is not so much building new roads as repairing the ones we've got.

I'm sure there are people out there who could be trained to mix cement - but I'm also sure there are plenty of people with construction experience who are currently unemployed.

What I'd like to see is a revival of the WPA.

barfo

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I'm sure there are. But it seems a disproportionate amount of stimulus job creation is kind of transient in nature. I guess the goal being the more roads and transportation, the more commerce can occur...I think the whole idea is being oversold while not addressing the real problems in this country.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

and repairing the roads we have should be a given. Our taxes should go to this, not additional "stimulus spending". Such a scam, main roads in Mexico are in better shape than in California.

 

[julius]

What was FDR thinking hiring people to build stuff, when they had no knowledge of how to build...

(and no, I'm not comparing the two).

Like barfo said, you can be trained. And it's not just pouring concrete that they can do. Directing traffic, driving, clean up, whatever. Some people just find reasons to bitch I guess.

 

[julius]

and repairing the roads we have should be a given. Our taxes should go to this, not additional "stimulus spending". Such a scam, main roads in Mexico are in better shape than in California.

I'm not sure where to start with this one. If they do try to create jobs by doing this, um..that is where our taxes are going to.

thats like saying the schools shouldn't get any extra money since they already get our taxes.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I'm not sure where to start with this one. If they do try to create jobs by doing this, um..that is where our taxes are going to.

thats like saying the schools shouldn't get any extra money since they already get our taxes.

"I've got a good idea to stimulate the economy....its to borrow extra money to spend on what we should have been spending on in the first place the first time around instead of handouts!"

 

[julius]

"I've got a good idea to stimulate the economy....its to borrow extra money to spend on what we should have been spending on in the first place the first time around instead of handouts!"

what are some other options? raise the taxes on the poor and lower taxes on the rich?

 

[Denny Crane]

what are some other options? raise the taxes on the poor and lower taxes on the rich?

Grow the economy so there's more revenues for government to spend.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

what are some other options? raise the taxes on the poor and lower taxes on the rich?

That's not going to happen. According to Obama, the "Millionaires and the Billionaires" are evil.

 

[julius]

Grow the economy so there's more revenues for government to spend.

how? just saying 'grow the economy' is like saying saying "I know how you can fix your broken car. Just fix it"

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

First, there needs to be a determination as to what the actual "future" is economically in this country.

If we are using Obama's vision, its a lot of low skilled labor, investing in less efficient "clean" energy, and building roads.

Basically blue collar work. We need to focus on white collar work. Technology, healthcare, scientific research, etc.

 

[BrianFromWA]

like I posted in the other thread, 52% of companies are looking to hire "high-priority" jobs--especially in engineering, high-tech manufacturing and the skilled trades.

Can't an unemployed cement mixer go to ITT Tech or a community college to learn how to do clean room assembly or robotics? Why are we keeping people down by having them dig up roads and re-surface them?

Edit: in the referenced piece a community college prof said that he had companies offering jobs for 500 graduates of his mechanical trades program (welding, etc). He had 27 this year. And this is some CC in Michigan.

 

[julius]

First, there needs to be a determination as to what the actual "future" is economically in this country.

If we are using Obama's vision, its a lot of low skilled labor, investing in less efficient "clean" energy, and building roads.

Basically blue collar work. We need to focus on white collar work. Technology, healthcare, scientific research, etc.

yeah, those are neat talking points, but HOW?

everytime someone bitches about Obama (or Bush) doing something, they always say "he should do this" and then give statements that have no depth to them.

"It's easy! Just focus on white collar work!"

Ok, by doing what?

 

[julius]

like I posted in the other thread, 52% of companies are looking to hire "high-priority" jobs--especially in engineering, high-tech manufacturing and the skilled trades.

Can't an unemployed cement mixer go to ITT Tech or a community college to learn how to do clean room assembly or robotics? Why are we keeping people down by having them dig up roads and re-surface them?

Edit: in the referenced piece a community college prof said that he had companies offering jobs for 500 graduates of his mechanical trades program (welding, etc). He had 27 this year. And this is some CC in Michigan.

they'll have to pay for them somehow.

If I wanted to go back to school to change my occupation, I don't have the money too. I'd have to borrow it from someone. and if I'm an unemployed person, chances are I would have far less money then I do now. What if I was an unemployed person with a family? or debt? I can't just simply pick up and go to a trade school easily.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

yeah, those are neat talking points, but HOW?

everytime someone bitches about Obama (or Bush) doing something, they always say "he should do this" and then give statements that have no depth to them.

"It's easy! Just focus on white collar work!"

Ok, by doing what?

Grants to fund research in high technology. Strengthening the broadband bandwidth backbone in this country. Investing in high speed cellular satellite networks and speeding up data transmission. Incentives (or "tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires" if you so prefer) for companies to build high technology campuses and facilities.

The problem is, as you can see with that Solynda, it can get corrupt, but with road construction you get the same thing.

The problem is people DON'T think (talking about the government) before throwing cash around. This is likely what Obama is going to do on Thursday and what he did with his first stimulus. A bunch of talking points with no direction. He's throwing darts here.

 

[BLAZER PROPHET]

If jobs can be created, I'm all for it.

 

[Denny Crane]

how? just saying 'grow the economy' is like saying saying "I know how you can fix your broken car. Just fix it"

It's like saying your current job doesn't pay enough, go find a better paying one.

GDP almost always grows, year over year. Just not so much during this administration.

The Hoover Dam was built by a private company (consortium of companies) and was completed 2 years ahead of schedule. It took 5 years. When it was done, the employees were out of work.

These types of jobs are expensive to the tax payer and any benefits are only temporary.

 

[barfo]

The Hoover Dam was built by a private company (consortium of companies) and was completed 2 years ahead of schedule. It took 5 years. When it was done, the employees were out of work.

These types of jobs are expensive to the tax payer and any benefits are only temporary.

Yeah, that Hoover Dam, only lasted a year or two before it fell down. Too bad they didn't build something with lasting benefits.

barfo

 

[julius]

Grants to fund research in high technology. Strengthening the broadband bandwidth backbone in this country. Investing in high speed cellular satellite networks and speeding up data transmission. Incentives (or "tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires" if you so prefer) for companies to build high technology campuses and facilities.

The problem is, as you can see with that Solynda, it can get corrupt, but with road construction you get the same thing.

The problem is people DON'T think (talking about the government) before throwing cash around. This is likely what Obama is going to do on Thursday and what he did with his first stimulus. A bunch of talking points with no direction. He's throwing darts here.

sounds like code words for "spend money we don't have".

btw, "incentives" worked so great with reagonomics. It has to work this time. /sarcasm

 

[julius]

It's like saying your current job doesn't pay enough, go find a better paying one.

yeah, it's hollow. Because just saying 'go find a better paying job' doesn't mean you can, will, or know how to..or that there are higher playing jobs.

GDP almost always grows, year over year. Just not so much during this administration.

The Hoover Dam was built by a private company (consortium of companies) and was completed 2 years ahead of schedule. It took 5 years. When it was done, the employees were out of work.

These types of jobs are expensive to the tax payer and any benefits are only temporary.

I doubt they were out of work long AND the dam provided lots of benefits to the nation. It also provided lots of men with new skills that they could then take back to their homes and work construction, or whatever.

 

[BrianFromWA]

they'll have to pay for them somehow.

If I wanted to go back to school to change my occupation, I don't have the money too. I'd have to borrow it from someone. and if I'm an unemployed person, chances are I would have far less money then I do now. What if I was an unemployed person with a family? or debt? I can't just simply pick up and go to a trade school easily.

I just went through this in November. The State of Washington's Unemployment counselors had many programs that could send you back to community college if your previous experience/etc. was in a "declining" area, and you wanted training in an "opportunity" field. For instance, Aerospace Engineering was a "declining" field, and I could've received training at Green River CC (grants) if I wanted to do a set of welding classes (while still collecting unemployment). I didn't want to spend a year or two in that program, and I knew that I had other options, but it's not as hopeless as you're painting it, Julius.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

sounds like code words for "spend money we don't have".

btw, "incentives" worked so great with reagonomics. It has to work this time. /sarcasm

Yes. Spending money we don't have. Glad you finally see it.

 

[julius]

Yes. Spending money we don't have. Glad you finally see it.

so you're complaining about it, yet proposing the same. Brilliant.

 

[julius]

I just went through this in November. The State of Washington's Unemployment counselors had many programs that could send you back to community college if your previous experience/etc. was in a "declining" area, and you wanted training in an "opportunity" field. For instance, Aerospace Engineering was a "declining" field, and I could've received training at Green River CC (grants) if I wanted to do a set of welding classes (while still collecting unemployment). I didn't want to spend a year or two in that program, and I knew that I had other options, but it's not as hopeless as you're painting it, Julius.

it's also not that easy for everyone to do it. Is it possible? Yes.

But the money comes from something, and we have people who complain we waste money on helping people get jobs.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

so you're complaining about it, yet proposing the same. Brilliant.

I was assuming a stimulus to spending. I'd rather focus on higher technology and white collar type jobs versus manufacturing, green energy and road construction. To me, road construction and infrastructure investment to stimulate a stagnant job market is very "3rd world thinking".

I'd just let things ride, personally.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I don't think there's much complaining from people for re-training workers. I think there's complaining about giving money to people to be Baby Man or sit on unemployment for 99 weeks without trying things like going back to school or learning a different trade, or giving money to companies who "create jobs" by blowing half a billion dollars in 2 years before going bankrupt.

Anybody in here want to say that they're against retraining programs for people on unemployment for high-demand jobs, and why?

 

[chris_in_pdx]

I don't think there's much complaining from people for re-training workers. I think there's complaining about giving money to people to be Baby Man or sit on unemployment for 99 weeks without trying things like going back to school or learning a different trade, or giving money to companies who "create jobs" by blowing half a billion dollars in 2 years before going bankrupt.

Anybody in here want to say that they're against retraining programs for people on unemployment for high-demand jobs, and why?

I disagree. Shit, there's people out there that want to defund the public school system. Taxes and government spending of ANY kind that isn't a direct benefit to the individual being asked is like Satanism these days. CUT EVERYTHING... oh but leave that program that benefits me, okay?

Everyone's talking out of both sides of their mouths. It's really ridiculous and pathetic.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

SOCIALISM! :MARIS61: