OT Why Never Trumpers Should Bet on DeSantis Now (5 Viewers)

[Chris Craig]

I understand what you're saying. But at least admit it's in the minority. Again, my efforts involve focusing on, and contributing to, causes that are actually making strides to improve situations and foster unity. Just to sit back and say, "SYSTEMIC RACISM EXISTS IN OUR COUNTRY!!", and call it a day means nothing to me. We all have our own spheres, and I keep brining that term up. That's where I apply "Accept that it exists", "Acknowledge that it exists", "Call it out when I see it". This would include any established laws. As it pertains to our children, this begins in our homes does it not? How are you parents in here training your children? Are you making efforts to assimilating them into racially mixed environments? Sports? Clubs? The like? And in doing so, are you promoting love, unity, and teamwork? And then actually talking about it during your teaching moments with them? The list goes on and on and on....generation to generation. THAT begets real change.

No. It is ingrained in the core of our nations history. It exists in every town and city in every state. Nothing minority about it, except that it is minorities who it is happening to.

Accepting and acknowledging it exists is only one part of the solution....the first part. To act is the next. To engage. Listen to what the black community has to say work with them. Call out racism in all it's forms when you see, every time you see it because it isn't ok and can never be ok.

Certain people are trying to sweep it under the rug with these new laws to outlaw teaching history in schools. To outlaw teaching that racism has and does exist.

I don't train my son. I teach him. I impart on him what white privilege and racism are. That it exists. As he gets older I will relate the true history of country to him. I have and will continue to teach him critical thinking. And, he will take it all as he will.

 

[UncleCliffy'sDaddy]

No. It is ingrained in the core of our nations history. It exists in every town and city in every state. Nothing minority about it, except that it is minorities who it is happening to.

Accepting and acknowledging it exists is only one part of the solution....the first part. To act is the next. To engage. Listen to what the black community has to say work with them. Call out racism in all it's forms when you see, every time you see it because it isn't ok and can never be ok.

Certain people are trying to sweep it under the rug with these new laws to outlaw teaching history in schools. To outlaw teaching that racism has and does exist.

I don't train my son. I teach him. I impart on him what white privilege and racism are. That it exists. As he gets older I will relate the true history of country to him. I have and will continue to teach him critical thinking. And, he will take it all as he will.

Here’s a fine example of systemic racism from this morning’s “paper”. Yet the willfully clueless denies that there is any kind of a pattern to it……
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...s-outrage-black-teen-cuffed-white-t-rcna16459

 

[ABM]

I feel like the part you are overlooking is systemic means system. It's built into the system and has to do with the power structure of our country and laws. It's not about how you specifically treat your neighbors.

I do understand. Where are you seeing that manifesting itself in your own community? Moreover, as I had mentioned, we had a Black President for 8 years. I'm not so certain this was his top priority. I could be wrong.

 

[Chris Craig]

Here’s a fine example of systemic racism from this morning’s “paper”. Yet the willfully clueless denies that there is any kind of a pattern to it……
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...s-outrage-black-teen-cuffed-white-t-rcna16459

Yeah, this in the other thread. I pointed out those in denial here that this is indeed systemic racism in play.

 

[ABM]

Accepting and acknowledging it exists is only one part of the solution....the first part. To act is the next. To engage. Listen to what the black community has to say work with them.

Perfect. That's exactly why I financially support organizations such as the Woodson Center. For whatever reason(s), that seems to get pooh-poohed in here.

https://woodsoncenter.org/

 

[Chris Craig]

Perfect. That's exactly why I financially support organizations such as the Woodson Center. For whatever reason(s), that seems to get pooh-poohed in here.

https://woodsoncenter.org/

You can't truly act until you have truly acknowledged

Charity is great. Woodson Center has a great mission statement, but behind it is the same fallacy you bring here. A claim to stand against racism without the acceptance or acknowledgement that systemic racism exists, and in some measure actual denial that it exists.

This is why that organization is getting pooh poohed on here. I am sure people are glad to see some families getting the help they need. To see some community empowerment or at least the promise of it, but without acknowledging the bigger picture, it is mostly an empty gesture.

 

[donkiez]

I do understand. Where are you seeing that manifesting itself in your own community? Moreover, as I had mentioned, we had a Black President for 8 years. I'm not so certain this was his top priority. I could be wrong.

To name a few, policing and minorities being shot or beat up and given unfair sentencing in comparison to non minorities. One very obvious thing for me is the black "thug" like legal gun owners who are shot by police and receive zero support from the gun rights community. Voter supression laws, gerrymandering, red lining and gentrification, and funding for public schools. There are also issues with the accumlation of generational wealth built on the backs of slaves and segregation era labor practices, which were literally one or two generations ago.

One black President does not mean that we are over all this, also I think you are giving the President too much credit for their ability to do anything meaningful.

 

[ABM]

You can't truly act until you have truly acknowledged

Charity is great. Woodson Center has a great mission statement, but behind it is the same fallacy you bring here. A claim to stand against racism without the acceptance or acknowledgement that systemic racism exists.

I acknowledge that it exists, but on a much smaller scale than the left wants us to believe. I bring up Conservative Blacks. I believe most of them have figured out that this so-called systemic racism is something that exists on a small scale, and that they look beyond it, and are treated just fine. There are countless examples.

 

[ABM]

One black President does not mean that we are over all this, also I think you are giving the President too much credit for their ability to do anything meaningful.

Uhhm, Obama ran on that notion. Change. Actually, it went beyond racism itself. He was touted as the great emancipator.

 

[donkiez]

Uhhm, Obama ran on that notion. Change. Actually, it went beyond racism itself. He was touted as the great emancipator.

The type of stuff we are talking about took generations to happen and will take generations to unravel. Especially when people like yourself can't even acknowledge it exists and mock him for his contributions. You make it very had to engage with in any meaningful way. I'm not impressed with your tactics of ignoring all meaningful subject manner in a conversation and replying to only the parts where you feel you will get a reaction from. It's exhausting and obviously not worth anyone's time to try to explain otherwise.

 

[ABM]

Look, I believe racism exists in the minority in this country - both, perpetrators and victims. I believe the vast majority of our citizens want equality in every measure, including in our laws and practices. To make one broad swath, painting us ALL (whites) as somehow needing to be shameful, or such, is flat-out wrong. I get it as it relates to the exceptional situations where racism truly exists, and make efforts to prevent that, including speaking up when necessary. However, this has absolutely nothing to do with my interactions with my Black brothers and sisters, acquaintances, or otherwise, whom I come in contact with on a regular basis. We're just being, well, us. If we need to stand up to a law decision., or otherwise, that's deemed racist or unfair in any manner, we will. It's all case by case, though. Again, nationalizing this whole thing is entirely ineffective. The bottom line is, it's a matter of the heart. Hearts aren't changed by buzzwords and mandates. And, those particular hearts are in the minority. I don't need some left-wing, universal proclamations instructing me otherwise.

Oh, and as an aside, I found this recent guidance piece to be interesting regarding our UK friends:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...-in-schools/political-impartiality-in-schools

......When teaching pupils about racism, teachers should be clear that racism has no place in our society and help pupils to understand facts about this and the law.

Where schools wish to teach about specific campaigning organisations, such as some of those associated with the Black Lives Matter movement, they should be aware that this may cover partisan political views. These are views which go beyond the basic shared principle that racism is unacceptable, which is a view schools should reinforce. Examples of such partisan political views include advocating specific views on how government resources should be used to address social issues, including withdrawing funding from the police.

Schools should ensure this content is taught appropriately taking steps to offer pupils a balanced account of opposing views on these points. Partisan political views must not be promoted to pupils, including by encouraging pupils to support campaign groups advocating such views.......

 

[ABM]

The type of stuff we are talking about took generations to happen and will take generations to unravel. Especially when people like yourself can't even acknowledge it exists and mock him for his contributions. You make it very had to engage with in any meaningful way. I'm not impressed with your tactics of ignoring all meaningful subject manner in a conversation and replying to only the parts where you feel you will get a reaction from. It's exhausting and obviously not worth anyone's time to try to explain otherwise.

I'll agree to disagree. Cheers.

 

[ehizzy3]

Old man doesn’t understand racism

and in other news, the sun is warm

 

[calvin natt]

“We had a black President, it’s over”

ABM, 2022

 

[Chris Craig]

I acknowledge that it exists, but on a much smaller scale than the left wants us to believe. I bring up Conservative Blacks. I believe most of them have figured out that this so-called systemic racism is something that exists on a small scale, and that they look beyond it, and are treated just fine. There are countless examples.

You acknowledge...at least you seem to be here that racism in itself exists. You are saying oh there are just a few racist people out there no biggie. There are a lot of racist people out there. Trump getting elected helped us see how many.

But, you miss the point. The everyday racism we see, and there is a lot of it, is a microcosm of systemic racism. You fail to see the greater picture, the true scale of it.

 

[Chris Craig]

Look, I believe racism exists in the minority in this country - both, perpetrators and victims. I believe the vast majority of our citizens want equality in every measure, including in our laws and practices. To make one broad swath, painting us ALL (whites) as somehow needing to be shameful, or such, is flat-out wrong. I get it as it relates to the exceptional situations where racism truly exists, and make efforts to prevent that, including speaking up when necessary. However, this has absolutely nothing to do with my interactions with my Black brothers and sisters, acquaintances, or otherwise, whom I come in contact with on a regular basis. We're just being, well, us. If we need to stand up to a law decision., or otherwise, that's deemed racist or unfair in any manner, we will. It's all case by case, though. Again, nationalizing this whole thing is entirely ineffective. The bottom line is, it's a matter of the heart. Hearts aren't changed by buzzwords and mandates. And, those particular hearts are in the minority. I don't need some left-wing, universal proclamations instructing me otherwise.

Oh, and as an aside, I found this recent guidance piece to be interesting regarding our UK friends:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...-in-schools/political-impartiality-in-schools

......When teaching pupils about racism, teachers should be clear that racism has no place in our society and help pupils to understand facts about this and the law.

Where schools wish to teach about specific campaigning organisations, such as some of those associated with the Black Lives Matter movement, they should be aware that this may cover partisan political views. These are views which go beyond the basic shared principle that racism is unacceptable, which is a view schools should reinforce. Examples of such partisan political views include advocating specific views on how government resources should be used to address social issues, including withdrawing funding from the police.

Schools should ensure this content is taught appropriately taking steps to offer pupils a balanced account of opposing views on these points. Partisan political views must not be promoted to pupils, including by encouraging pupils to support campaign groups advocating such views.......

This us and them division is a paragon of what I have been saying. It's an exemplification of systemic racism. That there is an us and them in your mind, in anyones mind, shows it is still prevalent today.

Until we can get passed us and them to we, it is still here. Until, we can acknowledge how deeply rooted it is, and work to fix it, then it will be here.

 

[crandc]

Still touting the organization that produced a sanitized view of US history on orders from Trump where all white people are good all and darkies happy.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

ABM really thinks that Obama was the president only for black people?

I can promise you this if I'm elected president. I will be president not just for dogs but for all the people and maybe three or four cats.

 

[Phatguysrule]

He tried to do more but a Republican ruled Senate and house made it their mission to make sure he got nothing through.

Yeah, I'll accept that. I think he wanted to but caved to special interests... But he got some good stuff done.

 

[crandc]

Was Trump only president for white people?

 

[Phatguysrule]

Was Trump only president for white people?

Pretty much...

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Was Trump only president for white people?

No, only for rich white people.

 

[Phatguysrule]

No, only for rich white people.

But he loves poor and uneducated people... And he had his own African American...

 

[RR7]

ABM really thinks that Obama was the president only for black people?

I can promise you this if I'm elected president. I will be president not just for dogs but for all the people and maybe three or four cats.

I think he thinks that because there was a black president, he should have solved all the problems of the black people. Hundreds and hundreds of years dismantled with the flick of a pen of a black president.

 

[donkiez]

Was Trump only president for white people?

No, only for rich white people.

Oh good their persecution is finally over then.

Also, I have a few rich white people in my circle of friends, we treat each other very nice, thats how I know they are not persecuted anymore and its proof the system is fair.

 

[donkiez]

What are you all doing in your personal lives to ensure rich white people are treated fairly?

I donate a portion of my paycheck to the IRS. They are a reputable organization that ensures that all rich white people get the benefits and treatment they deserve. If you have not heard of them, I suggest you spend some time researching this organization. This absolves me of all guilt and responsibility I have towards the situation and allows me to live my life in my own bubble, free of further thought on the subject.

 

[crandc]

I bought some stuff from Amazon. Keep Bezos rich.

 

[ABM]

But, you miss the point. The everyday racism we see, and there is a lot of it.....

Please elaborate.

 

[ABM]

ABM really thinks that Obama was the president only for black people?

I can promise you this if I'm elected president. I will be president not just for dogs but for all the people and maybe three or four cats.

The horses simply yawn.

 

[ABM]

Until we can get passed us and them to we, it is still here....

I agree. And yet, there are constant reminders out there that I'm supposed to be shameful that I'm a privileged white male.