Will we be better than the Pelicans?

[santeesioux]

Didn't Rivers have one of the worst rookie years ever?

 

[Boob-No-More]

Didn't Rivers have one of the worst rookie years ever?

Yes, he did. I remember reading an analysis that showed he had one of the five worst seasons in the entire history of the NBA for all players (not just rookies) that played over 1000 minutes.

So yeah, I agree with RoyToy, Rivers has more upside than McCollum. When you suck that bad, there is nowhere to go but up. If Rivers ever even becomes slightly worse than average, that will be a HUGE improvement.

To give Rivers credit, his second season wasn't nearly as terrible as his rookie year. If he continues to improve at this rate, I see his peak as Steve Blake in his prime (PER ~ 14). That should give the young man something to aspire to.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

I'd trade CJ for Rivers

CJ's upside is limited. He's not that athletic, his ball handling is just okay and he has no real position.

Rivers' biggest con is that he's still learning the game. Only 1 year in college. He has good size for his position, has a quick first step and is a good ball handler.

Rivers will have the better career.

Lol, since when is 6'4', 200 lb with an 8' 0.5" standing reach good size for an NBA shooting guard??? Maybe if he played back in 1954. What's up with the short arms? I'm 1/4" shorter than Rivers (6' 3.25") without shoes, but my standing reach is 8'4" and I don't have exceptionally long arms.

And concerning Rivers "superior" athleticism, you may want to check the facts.

From Draftexpress.com:

Austin Rivers, C.J. McCollum:
Height w/o Shoes: 6' 3.5", 6' 2.25"
Wingspan: 6' 7.25", 6' 6.25"
Standing Reach: 8' 0.5", 8' 0.5"
No Step Vertical: 32.5", 32.0"
No Step Vertical Reach: 10' 9", 10 8.5"
Max Vertical: 37.5", 38.5"
Max Vertical Reach: 11' 2", 11' 3"
Benchpress: 1, 13
Agility: 11.54, 11.04
Sprint: 3.32, 3.32

Looks pretty close to me, with a slight edge to C.J. Max Reach is the same, and so is leaping ability (1/2" no step advantage for Rivers, 1" max advantage for C.J.). In terms of strength, it's not close. C.J. blows him away. C.J. is also more agile (by a full half second) and their sprint times are identical. The only real "advantage" Rivers has is the top of his head is 1.25" further from the floor, and since you don't play basketball with the top of your head, that is completely negated by the fact that both players have the exact same standing reach.

Ultimately, there is more to being a basketball player than athleticism (where neither player has a significant advantage over the other). So, I guess we'll wait and see. I do find it inconsistent on your part that you consider McCollum a poor pick at 10, but think Rivers, also taken at 10, is rippling with upside. For the record, in over 2750 minutes played in the NBA, Rivers total Win Shares = -0.5, 57th in his draft class. C.J. McCollum, in only 476 minutes has produced +0.2 Win Shares, 23rd in his draft class. If you prefer to normalize for minutes played. Rivers' WS/48 is -.009, 51st in his draft class, compared to McCollum with WS/48 = +0.019, 28th in his draft class.

At this point, neither player has justified their draft position, but McCollum has come a hell of a lot closer than Rivers, and he's done it with far less playing time.

BNM

 

[MickZagger]

I've watched a ton of Rivers. He was awful.

 

[Strenuus]

Roytoy is going full Mixum, bag on all the players with no knowledge of other players!!!

No wait, Mixum did know a little bit.

 

[MickZagger]

Roytoy is going full Mixum, bag on all the players with no knowledge of other players!!!

No wait, Mixum did know a little bit.

RoyToy has always been this way. He gets boners from playing devils advocate.

 

[RoyToy]

Lol, since when is 6'4', 200 lb with an 8' 0.5" standing reach good size for an NBA shooting guard??? Maybe if he played back in 1954. What's up with the short arms? I'm 1/4" shorter than Rivers (6' 3.25") without shoes, but my standing reach is 8'4" and I don't have exceptionally long arms.

And concerning Rivers "superior" athleticism, you may want to check the facts.

From Draftexpress.com:

Austin Rivers, C.J. McCollum:
Height w/o Shoes: 6' 3.5", 6' 2.25"
Wingspan: 6' 7.25", 6' 6.25"
Standing Reach: 8' 0.5", 8' 0.5"
No Step Vertical: 32.5", 32.0"
No Step Vertical Reach: 10' 9", 10 8.5"
Max Vertical: 37.5", 38.5"
Max Vertical Reach: 11' 2", 11' 3"
Benchpress: 1, 13
Agility: 11.54, 11.04
Sprint: 3.32, 3.32

Looks pretty close to me, with a slight edge to C.J. Max Reach is the same, and so is leaping ability (1/2" no step advantage for Rivers, 1" max advantage for C.J.). In terms of strength, it's not close. C.J. blows him away. C.J. is also more agile (by a full half second) and their sprint times are identical. The only real "advantage" Rivers has is the top of his head is 1.25" further from the floor, and since you don't play basketball with the top of your head, that is completely negated by the fact that both players have the exact same standing reach.

Ultimately, there is more to being a basketball player than athleticism (where neither player has a significant advantage over the other). So, I guess we'll wait and see. I do find it inconsistent on your part that you consider McCollum a poor pick at 10, but think Rivers, also taken at 10, is rippling with upside. For the record, in over 2750 minutes played in the NBA, Rivers total Win Shares = -0.5, 57th in his draft class. C.J. McCollum, in only 476 minutes has produced +0.2 Win Shares, 23rd in his draft class. If you prefer to normalize for minutes played. Rivers' WS/48 is -.009, 51st in his draft class, compared to McCollum with WS/48 = +0.019, 28th in his draft class.

At this point, neither player has justified their draft position, but McCollum has come a hell of a lot closer than Rivers, and he's done it with far less playing time.

BNM

lmfao

I see you know how to look up combine stats, but none of what you posted addresses what I said.

When you watch the two play you see the fact that Rivers has almost a lightning quick first step with the ball in his hands. CJ McCollum doesn't. Rivers will have the ability to play the point because of this, while CJ usually gets swarmed because he's not as quick and his ball handling isn't on the level of Rivers'. It's been said more than once on this forum by different posters that CJ at the 1 is a bad idea because he's not necessarily that quick and his ball handling is just ok.

I'm not even a big Rivers fan, but I'd take him over CJ. Rivers will have the better career.

 

[RoyToy]

I'd take Rivers over Lillard tbh

 

[3RA1N1AC]

in the butt

 

[Strenuus]

I'd take Rivers over Lillard tbh

hahahahahahahahhahahahahaha. hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

I mean, you did an admirable job hiding it, but now this is just too much.

No, please, make a valid case for this. I'll be waiting.

Oh wait, you'll conveniently "ignore" this. Now you'll say "I'm not ignoring you, you just irritate me"

Let me think of the next thing you'll say...

lmfao. This is even worse than "Lillard for Conley"

You were doing so well hiding your trolls. But this one is a top notch effort. Well done.

 

[jlprk]

Pelican walks into a bar. Says to the bartender, "I'd like to buy some peanuts." Bartender says, "Sorry, don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender replies, "I already told you I don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender yells back, "I told you, I don't sell peanuts. If you ask one more time, I'll nail you to the wall." So the pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "Do you have any nails?" Bartender says, "Sorry, don't have nails." Pelican asks, "Do you have any peanuts?"

Pelican walks into a bar. Says to the bartender, "I'd like to buy some peanuts." Bartender says, "Sorry, don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender replies, "I already told you I don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender yells back, "I told you, I don't sell peanuts. If you ask one more time, I'll nail you to the wall." So the pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "Do you have any nails?" Bartender says, "Sorry, don't have nails." Pelican asks, "Do you have any peanuts?"

 

[3RA1N1AC]

the joke so nice you told it twice

 

[jlprk]

Pelican walks into a bar. Says to the bartender, "I'd like to buy some peanuts." Bartender says, "Sorry, don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender replies, "I already told you I don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender yells back, "I told you, I don't sell peanuts. If you ask one more time, I'll nail you to the wall." So the pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "Do you have any nails?" Bartender says, "Sorry, don't have nails." Pelican asks, "Do you have any peanuts?"

Pelican walks into a bar. Says to the bartender, "I'd like to buy some peanuts." Bartender says, "Sorry, don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender replies, "I already told you I don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender yells back, "I told you, I don't sell peanuts. If you ask one more time, I'll nail you to the wall." So the pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "Do you have any nails?" Bartender says, "Sorry, don't have nails." Pelican asks, "Do you have any peanuts?"

Pelican walks into a bar. Says to the bartender, "I'd like to buy some peanuts." Bartender says, "Sorry, don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender replies, "I already told you I don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender yells back, "I told you, I don't sell peanuts. If you ask one more time, I'll nail you to the wall." So the pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "Do you have any nails?" Bartender says, "Sorry, don't have nails." Pelican asks, "Do you have any peanuts?"

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Answer: Yes.

 

[RR7]

props for bumping your own thread.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

I'm worried about jlprk, he hasn't been around for a couple of weeks.

 

[OneLifeToLive]

Pelican walks into a bar. Says to the bartender, "I'd like to buy some peanuts." Bartender says, "Sorry, don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender replies, "I already told you I don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender yells back, "I told you, I don't sell peanuts. If you ask one more time, I'll nail you to the wall." So the pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "Do you have any nails?" Bartender says, "Sorry, don't have nails." Pelican asks, "Do you have any peanuts?"

Pelican walks into a bar. Says to the bartender, "I'd like to buy some peanuts." Bartender says, "Sorry, don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender replies, "I already told you I don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender yells back, "I told you, I don't sell peanuts. If you ask one more time, I'll nail you to the wall." So the pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "Do you have any nails?" Bartender says, "Sorry, don't have nails." Pelican asks, "Do you have any peanuts?"

Pelican walks into a bar. Says to the bartender, "I'd like to buy some peanuts." Bartender says, "Sorry, don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender replies, "I already told you I don't sell peanuts." The pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "I want to buy some peanuts." Bartender yells back, "I told you, I don't sell peanuts. If you ask one more time, I'll nail you to the wall." So the pelican leaves.

Next day, the pelican walks into the bar, "Do you have any nails?" Bartender says, "Sorry, don't have nails." Pelican asks, "Do you have any peanuts?"

Where is this crackerjack?

 

[magnifier661]

I'm worried about jlprk, he hasn't been around for a couple of weeks.

He pm me saying he's tired of your fascist modding

 

[KingSpeed]

RoyToy would rather have Rivers than Lillard. LOL