Winning Streak Before Trade Deadline Sucks!

[H.C.]

I think people see it as a failed demolition. Foundation may have been destroyed, but too much of the initial structure remained in order for it to fully collapse.

1 out of 5 starters & 3 total players from that 14-15 team are on the 17-18 version of the Blazers.

Pretty iffy for people to see it as a failed Demo just because you kept your pgotf + a backup guard & a backup center.

 

[H.C.]

In theory you are correct and I agree... but this is Portland we are talking about... all decisions are made with emotion and not logic. I can totally see Neil changing course now and standing pat. If he was smart tho, now is the time to trade CJ... coming off that 50 point game, his value will never be higher.

Only to casual fans does a players value change when they score 50 points or go 1-14.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

1 out of 5 starters & 3 total players from that 14-15 team are on the 17-18 version of the Blazers.

Pretty iffy for people to see it as a failed Demo just because you kept your pgotf + a backup guard & a backup center.

Not talking about 3 years later, but specifically about the year immediately following. We weren't "supposed to" win 44 games in 2015-16 and convey our pick to Denver. We were "supposed to" be terrible and get a high lottery pick and "rebuild properly". We weren't as bad that year as expected (desired?) by the "blow it up" contingent, hence the failed demolition analogy. At this point--especially given the roster turnover you mention--it's more of a refurbishment of an abandoned property than an actual "rebuild".

 

[Orion Bailey]

Not talking about 3 years later, but specifically about the year immediately following. We weren't "supposed to" win 44 games in 2015-16 and convey our pick to Denver. We were "supposed to" be terrible and get a high lottery pick and "rebuild properly". We weren't as bad that year as expected (desired?) by the "blow it up" contingent, hence the failed demolition analogy. At this point--especially given the roster turnover you mention--it's more of a refurbishment of an abandoned property than an actual "rebuild".

Who is this guy. Becomes a mod and then starts posting three times as often spreading his opinion as gospel?

SLYYY!~!!!!

 

[Mediocre Man]

care to explain?

Not particularly.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

 

[lamlor]

We blew it up just a few years ago when Aldridge signed with the Spurs. How often should a team blow up the roster and start over again. Sounds like the old Clippers method.

Detroit imploded the Silverdome recently and it failed so they imploded it again. No different than with a team. Or should you just let a crumbling structure stand and hope for the best?

 

[42N8Bounce]

Ive never questioned his talent... just don’t like the fit next to Dame. Now is the time to maximize return

Agreed. And there in lies the problem. Getting that equal value back in a trade. It takes 2 teams to make a trade. We don't want to be the team that does a trade that ends up without the best player. 100 'Meyers Leonards' does not equal 1 'CJ'.

What is equal value to CJ? How many active players in the last 3 years have scored 50 points in a game that aren't duplicate to Dame?
- Klay Thompson (we'll call him a small forward)
- Anthony Davis
- LeBron James
- DeMarcus Cousins
- Jimmy Butler (we'll call him a small forward)
- DeMar DeRozan

If we expand the search to say scoring 45 points in a game:
- Paul George
- Karl Anthony-Towns
- Andrew Wiggins
- Joel Embiid
- Carmelo Anthony
- Paul Milsap

Who on this list would you trade CJ for, that you think is available?

I'm not much into 'balancing the roster' if it means downgrading the talent. I'm a fan of CJ. Not only is he a talented player, he represents Portland well.

 

[lamlor]

Pretty sure we took a 250M leap of faith in summer 2016 and ended up with a trust fall fail. Actions have consequences. Piling on those is part of the sunk cost analysis. We are lucky that we're in a position to kind of recover from that. But throwing multiple years of cheap, cost-controlled young talent at a problem caused by a leap-of-faith checkbook splurge is suboptimal.

2016 spending spree was not a leap of faith. It was a panic move. Spending on proven players or going with the draft is more of a leap. Olshey just panicked.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Its a great point. We've been fortunate with players missing on opponents teams

 

[Mediocre Man]

We blew it up just a few years ago when Aldridge signed with the Spurs. How often should a team blow up the roster and start over again. Sounds like the old Clippers method.

Ooh, another Catholic

 

[BrianFromWA]

 

[H.C.]

Not talking about 3 years later, but specifically about the year immediately following. We weren't "supposed to" win 44 games in 2015-16 and convey our pick to Denver. We were "supposed to" be terrible and get a high lottery pick and "rebuild properly". We weren't as bad that year as expected (desired?) by the "blow it up" contingent, hence the failed demolition analogy. At this point--especially given the roster turnover you mention--it's more of a refurbishment of an abandoned property than an actual "rebuild".

I just think it's stupid to see it as a failed demo because Portland didn't purposely sign 5th grade level talent in an attempt to win the lotto.
Fast forward 6 years, and they're right back where they started. Struggling to be a .500 club in the weaker conference.

 

[lamlor]

Agreed. And there in lies the problem. Getting that equal value back in a trade. It takes 2 teams to make a trade. We don't want to be the team that does a trade that ends up without the best player. 100 'Meyers Leonards' does not equal 1 'CJ'.

What is equal value to CJ? How many active players in the last 3 years have scored 50 points in a game that aren't duplicate to Dame?
- Klay Thompson (we'll call him a small forward)
- Anthony Davis
- LeBron James
- DeMarcus Cousins
- Jimmy Butler (we'll call him a small forward)
- DeMar DeRozan

If we expand the search to say scoring 45 points in a game:
- Paul George
- Karl Anthony-Towns
- Andrew Wiggins
- Joel Embiid
- Carmelo Anthony
- Paul Milsap

Who on this list would you trade CJ for, that you think is available?

I'm not much into 'balancing the roster' if it means downgrading the talent. I'm a fan of CJ. Not only is he a talented player, he represents Portland well.

Good points, but my only argument is that basing a 50 point game as a measurement of value is off. Andre Miller scored 50 once. CJ is talented, but is one dimensional in my mind. And anyone that has played or coached knows that talent alone doesn't win, chemistry and fit play just as much of a part or more sometimes. I think it is a fit problem and not a talent problem. They need to trade him for a better fit which may be for a player of less talent. Unless you can create the superteam, fit is your best chance.

 

[Denny Crane]

We're on pace to win 47.

Based upon their last 10, we'd be on pace to win 57.

The Raptors, Celtics, and Warriors are the team's only 3 games against teams with winning records, for February (10 games).

We might be looking at a really good season after all.

Note that March isn't going to be as easy

 

[H.C.]

This tired ass argument.
'Lillard and CJ don't fit together, they can't play together, they're duplicates offensively'! 15-16
'Lillard and CJ don't fit together, they're both too small, they don't play enough defense'! 16-17
'Lillard and CJ don't fit together, they're both too small.. Wait they're 8th defensively? wtf? Oh see! I told you they were duplicates offensively. Portland's rated 13th offensively. Talk about shit, trade em'! 17-18

 

[Scalma]

There’s no way Olshey is that short sighted. And yeah we can only play who’s on the schedule, but the reality is still that we’ve beaten teams we should’ve beaten. That’s not a knock, but I definitely wouldn’t alter plans because of it either. We’ve pretty much had the same roster for at least two seasons. We have the same surplus in the front court we had last year at the same time. We need a starting SF, or a bench scorer. We have a bunch of pending FAs, and we need to get under the tax.

If Olshey goes without making any moves, he should be fired before the sun rises next Friday. It’s time.

 

[Mediocre Man]

There’s no way Olshey is that short sighted. And yeah we can only play who’s on the schedule, but the reality is still that we’ve beaten teams we should’ve beaten. That’s not a knock, but I definitely wouldn’t alter plans because of it either. We’ve pretty much had the same roster for at least two seasons. We have the same surplus in the front court we had last year at the same time. We need a starting SF, or a bench scorer. We have a bunch of pending FAs, and we need to get under the tax.

If Olshey goes without making any moves, he should be fired before the sun rises next Friday. It’s time.

Olshey drafted and then extended Meyers Leonar_.

He can ABSOLUTELY be that short sighted

 

[Scalma]

Actually if there’s one thing I’m afraid of is that Neil pulls another Afflalo and trades a first for Evans.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Its a great point. We've been fortunate with players missing on opponents teams

Well, we also beat OKC and SAS without Dame. So, it works both ways.

It's not just POR's recent record that shows the team is playing better, there are several stats that show a significant improvement.

For example both Dame and C.J. went through shooting slumps in November (Dame) and December (CJ.). When one, or both, of your best players aren't making their shots, you're not going to have much success. Both have turned it around in January. You can argue they are shooting better because the competition hasn't been as good, but it's not like they went all November and December without getting any open looks. They just weren't making them when they did.

November:
Dame = .311 3FG% on 37 made 3FGs
C.J. = .442 3FG on 42 made 3FGs
Combined = .369 on 79 made 3FGs

December:
Dame = .386 3FG% on 32 made 3FGs
C.J. = .294 3FG on 20 made 3FGs
Combined = .344 on 52 made 3FGs

January:
Dame = .429 3FG% on 45 made 3FGs
C.J. = .471 3FG on 49 made 3FGs
Combined = .450 on 94 made 3FGs

January was the first month that both or our leading scorers shot the ball well. That tends to lead to more wins, regardless of the competition.

The whole can Dame and C.J. coexist debate seems to resurface every time one of them is in a shooting slump. It becomes much less of an issue when both are shooting > .400 3FG%. I really don't think we're trading either of them within the next week. So, it will be interesting to see if January was just a fluke, or their continued hot shooting will continue for the remainder of the season.

If not, it strengthens a case for splitting them up this summer. If they both continue to play as well as they have recently, you probably keep them together and look for help elsewhere (like the SF position).

BNM

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Well, winning never really Sucks...Unless it is right before the trade deadline and you want some trades to happen to improve this team and the last 8 teams you have played and looked good against have a combined record of 180-234 while several of the teams were also missing some of their top players.

This winning streak, which can easily be looked at as a pan of fools gold based on the items listed above, may completely turn the tide on the Vulcans making any meaningful moves before the deadline. Let's face it, the Blazers have not really played the best teams or at full strength during this mini winning streak and now the powers that be likely feel like the Blazers are better than they are.

I hope I am wrong and the Blazers still look to make a meaningful move before the deadline...but, I haven't heard any trade chatter of significance concerning the Blazers the past week or so and reports I have read say the Blazers are not active in finding a trade...That Sucks!!...because this team is not good enough as it is to do much in the playoffs and this winning streak against sub-par teams may have just sealed their fate for the rest of this season!

Solid post! Well done!

 

[Chris Craig]

Well, winning never really Sucks...Unless it is right before the trade deadline and you want some trades to happen to improve this team and the last 8 teams you have played and looked good against have a combined record of 180-234 while several of the teams were also missing some of their top players.

This winning streak, which can easily be looked at as a pan of fools gold based on the items listed above, may completely turn the tide on the Vulcans making any meaningful moves before the deadline. Let's face it, the Blazers have not really played the best teams or at full strength during this mini winning streak and now the powers that be likely feel like the Blazers are better than they are.

I hope I am wrong and the Blazers still look to make a meaningful move before the deadline...but, I haven't heard any trade chatter of significance concerning the Blazers the past week or so and reports I have read say the Blazers are not active in finding a trade...That Sucks!!...because this team is not good enough as it is to do much in the playoffs and this winning streak against sub-par teams may have just sealed their fate for the rest of this season!

Great post! Yeah, it's hard. The last few months before the winning streak, here in the forum, we have been talking about trades, about who should go, and about the unbalance of the team. Now the Blazers are winning, the chemistry looks sharp. Do we still make trades? Will it destroy the chemistry? Further unbalance the team? The winning streak doesn't change the fact that Damian Lillard just sat down with Paul Allen and told him to find help, to upgrade the roster. A trade is coming, its imminent. Its just going to be tougher to see guys go. You can bet Neil is busy manning the phones and actively looking for deals. His job depends on it. He has a series of screw ups in the Turner and Leonard contracts. He kind of made up for the Crabbe screw up by trading Crabbe this summer, but the Blazers have several stretched contracts taking up a chunk of salary for the next few seasons. The Blazers have one of the largest team salaries and their are no easy answers.

I have heard a few rumors surrounding a hand full of players, but nothing serious

Mirotic (Who was traded to the Pelicans and is off the table)
Julius Randle
Skal Labissiere
Wes Mathews
Kevin Love (Who broke his hand)
Deandre Jordan

 

[riverman]

I haven't read all through the posts here so someone might have mentioned it but.....winning builds trade value for the guys out there winning...harder to make trades when you're losing and players can't win a game

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Dame wants us to keep Ed. Dame wants improved supporting cast. That adds up to just one thing...

We will make a trade, and our 1st rounder will be involved.
#BookIt

 

[andalusian]

Dame wants us to keep Ed. Dame wants improved supporting cast. That adds up to just one thing...

We will make a trade, and our 1st rounder will be involved.
#BookIt

I agree, but my opinion is that is imperative for this team to shed some bad contracts, and this will likely only happen if a pick is involved.

 

[rotary111]

Really loving all the new voices around here. Great to see some new takes on the team.

What other site can Sly take down?

 

[BrianFromWA]

I don't know the reference, but Sly's logs indicate he's spending a lot of time chatting on PORnba.com, so I think he's scouting for other Blazer basketball fans...

 

[BBert]

I don't know the reference, but Sly's logs indicate he's spending a lot of time chatting on PORnba.com, so I think he's scouting for other Blazer basketball fans...

 

[Scalma]

Dame wants us to keep Ed. Dame wants improved supporting cast. That adds up to just one thing...

We will make a trade, and our 1st rounder will be involved.
#BookIt

Ok then, Jabari Parker come on down.

 

[Chris Craig]

I agree, but my opinion is that is imperative for this team to shed some bad contracts, and this will likely only happen if a pick is involved.

Yeah one of Turner or Meyers is gone