You be the GM: Nurkic extension this summer?

[PtldPlatypus]

I'm coming around to the idea of waiting. He's got an injury history and some motivation issues. We've only seen him for 20 games.

Says the man who still has Plumdog as his avatar.

We know where your true loyalties lie.

 

[illmatic99]

Says the man who still has Plumdog as his avatar.

We know where your true loyalties lie.

LOL just haven't come around to changing yet. I've been wanting Nurk since December.

 

[riverman]

In perspective, Kaman looked like the 6man of the year the first 20 games he played with us...there's no rush to give Nurk a max deal...

 

[B-Roy]

I'm looking forward to a Li'l Penny-style mini-Nurk sitting on Stotts' shoulder, giving him advice on substitution patterns.

"Bench Meyers, bench Meyers, bench Meyers....."

 

[oldfisherman]

In perspective, Kaman looked like the 6man of the year the first 20 games he played with us...there's no rush to give Nurk a max deal...

Not a fair comparison. Kaman was past his prime. It was very predictable that he would come out strong when he had plenty of rest. But as the season wore on, and his minutes added up, his production would suffer. That was the pattern for the last few years of his career.

 

[trailblazer18]

Only sign him this off season if it is a reasonable contract, definitely do not need to max him out this summer. First priority this summer has to be shedding some of the bad contracts and hopefully getting a somewhat useful piece back.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Yes Neil should offer him an extension, and Nurkic would be a fool to accept anything less than a max deal.

That said, Neil better move Heaven and Earth to shed Turner, Crabbe and/or Leonar_'s contracts before it kicks in.

 

[BBert]

No worries about that, Bosnia is not playing this year and the next Eurobasket is 4 years away. And I don't see them playing any World Cup or Olympics.



Personally I think we should try something less than the max, even Giannis did not get the max to help his team. It's not insulting for a player with a track of 20 good games.
If he doesn't accept around 90M/4 years, then just let it be and we match what he gets next year. This way we will 100% sure where he stands healthwise.

This is what I was going to say.

 

[BlazerWookee]

I would offer him max this off season if he promises not to play in the different yearly Europe bball stuff.

I would too. But I'm pretty sure the CBA and the Players' Union would say that ain't kosher...

 

[Blazer Freak]

Two major benefits:

1. You let Nurkic know that you value him in the same way you value Dame and CJ, whom you gave extended contracts.

2. You avoid the whole RFA circus and get to write the contract in a favorable manner, not having to match a junk contract written by another GM with a bunch of provisions intended to make you pass or suffer pain.

I understand those points. Obviously you want to make important players to your team feel wanted...but guys. It's been 20 fucking games. He can ask for it this summer but they are by no means under any pressure to give it to him.

Sure, there are provisions that other teams can throw in if he reaches RFA, but RFA doesn't mean we can't negotiate a contract with him. We will be able to offer him more money than any other team could next summer, why would he miss out on that when he knows in the end we will sign him?

The dude is a potential all-star but he has had injury concerns in the past. For as much as every member on this forum has TORCHED Olshey on the contracts he handed out last year, you guys sure are eager to add another big one to the books.

Let's just be patient. We have the youngest team in the NBA, 3 core players secured and a lot of picks. Let Olshey use the assets he has accumulated to work some magic and see where we are next off-season before we go offering another $100M contract.

 

[Denny Crane]

An even better question might be, "would you sign him to the max if it means one of CJ or Dame has to go to make room?"

 

[BBert]

An even better question might be, "would you sign him to the max if it means one of CJ or Dame has to go to make room?"

Not this summer. That decision would have to wait until after next season. And even then, I'd plan for keeping all three (unless CJ were traded for Butler or another all star).

 

[riverman]

Not a fair comparison. Kaman was past his prime. It was very predictable that he would come out strong when he had plenty of rest. But as the season wore on, and his minutes added up, his production would suffer. That was the pattern for the last few years of his career.

I'm not comparing Kaman to Nurk by any stretch....what I'm saying is that they both came from teams with bad blood and embraced Portland and Stotts....Kaman said it was the first coach he's liked and Nurk says he feels home and welcome for the first time....we all know how old they are. Kaman was a beast his first couple months here...then got injured....Nurk is a beast his first couple months...then got injured.....let's not twist it into a Kaman vs Nurk skillset debate..my comment was more about circumstances and results...I like both guys

 

[Boob-No-More]

Lock that shit up. Don't dick around. Offer him the most you can as soon as you can. Give the guy the keys to the kingdom.

Remember who we are. We are Portland. We can't attract top, or even 2nd tier, free agents - even when we can offer a max contract, which we won't be able to do in the foreseeable future. We have found the 3rd piece of our big 3 and he's only 22. I repeat, lock that shit up.

Nurk's inspired play shows he wants to be wanted and he wants to win. Show him the organization wants him and is also dedicated to winning.

And don't just show him. Show Dame and C.J. that we aren't going to piss away their primes because we are too cheap to offer our third star the contract several other teams would be happy to offer him - if they could. We are in the driver's seat. Don't run this car into the ditch.

Everything has risk. That's the problem with guaranteed contracts, but honestly, with the money we gave Crabbe, Turner, Leonard, Harkless and Ezeli now is not the time to suddenly decide to be frugal. It sends a bad message to Nurk, his agent, his teammates, their agents, other players around the league, other agents and other GMs. Would you rather be known as the team that's willing to spend whatever it takes to build a winner, or the team that tries to low ball the player that transformed your team's entire season?

Any extension he signs this summer won't go into affect until the 2018-19 season. Any luxury tax calculations involving his extension won't happen until that last day of the 2019 regular season. That gives you this summer, next February's trade deadline, the summer of 2018 and the February 2019 trade deadline to figure out how to dump some salary. If Neil can't do that, he deserves to be fired. And, I don't even think, if we're winning (like we were when Nurk was playing), he even has to worry about getting under the tax threshold. Just move a couple bad contracts to make things more reasonable moving forward. Paul Allen has said he'd be willing to pay the tax if we're moving toward contention. Giving Nurk a max. extension would do more than any other move we could possibly make to help move us toward contention.

And yes, it's only been 20 games, but in those 20 games Jusuf Nurkic had a bigger influence on this team's success than Allen Crabbe, Evan Turner, Meyers Leonard, Maurice Harkless and Festus Ezeli combined. Those guys were signed for a total of $241 million, and you want to cut corners on Nurkic because it's only been 20 games? If anything, those five (Harklesss is the only one who isn't vastly overpaid for what they contribute) showed us they WEREN'T worth the contracts they received. Nurk, in just 20 games, has shown us he is.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

An even better question might be, "would you sign him to the max if it means one of CJ or Dame has to go to make room?"

That would make zero sense. You don't move one of your Big 3 for cost reasons, especially if you're Portland and have a proven inability to attract top grade talent. You lock up your Big 3 and then shuffle the other pieces to save money and suck it up and pay the tax when the time comes.

BNM

 

[oldfisherman]

I'm not comparing Kaman to Nurk by any stretch....what I'm saying is that they both came from teams with bad blood and embraced Portland and Stotts....Kaman said it was the first coach he's liked and Nurk says he feels home and welcome for the first time....we all know how old they are. Kaman was a beast his first couple months here...then got injured....Nurk is a beast his first couple months...then got injured.....let's not twist it into a Kaman vs Nurk skillset debate..my comment was more about circumstances and results...I like both guys

Fair enough, but I’m a book reader, not a mind reader.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Does anyone know if Nurk's legs are the same length?

The middle one is shorter than the other two, but it only looks small in comparison to the size of his balls, which may be the biggest in the entire NBA.

BNM

 

[Denny Crane]

That would make zero sense. You don't move one of your Big 3 for cost reasons, especially if you're Portland and have a proven inability to attract top grade talent. You lock up your Big 3 and then shuffle the other pieces to save money and suck it up and pay the tax when the time comes.

BNM

If you're not winning championships, tying up MAX x 3 dollars doesn't leave a lot to fill out the rest of the roster. 2 years from now, they'll be making close to $90M combined. That would leave about $2.5M/player for the rest of the roster.

 

[ripcityboy]

I am interested to see when Olshey makes his moves this summer. I'm sure he's got a plan of attack that may change I'd an opportunity arises. I'm sure he will sign Nurkic but with three potential rookies on the team, the future makeup of the team is in the air.

 

[Boob-No-More]

What exactly is the benefit to extending him? He isn't clamoring for an extension and while I love Nurkic and believe he is a a true answer at the C position, it's pretty laughable that everyone complains every day about other contracts on our roster and being in the LT potentially but wants to then sign a player who has only really played at a max level for 20 games another max contract.

I love Nurkic, hope he retires a Blazer and think he can be an All-Star. But there is absolutely 0 reason to give him an extension. He will be an RFA and we will match any offer. We aren't losing him.

You'd have two full years - two summers and two trade deadlines to shed some salary before Nurk's extension would impact the luxury tax calculation. You use that time to move some of those ridiculous contracts you handed out last summer, and by February 2019, those massive four year contracts you handed out to Crabbe, Turner and Leonard have less than a year and a half left on them and become a lot easier to move.

Plus, with three picks in this deep draft, hopefully we'll have some young, cheap talent that can replace the production we get from Crabbe, Turner, Leonard and possibly Harkless. At least by the time you actually have to move those guys you'll know what you have in their replacements.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

If you're not winning championships, tying up MAX x 3 dollars doesn't leave a lot to fill out the rest of the roster. 2 years from now, they'll be making close to $90M combined. That would leave about $2.5M/player for the rest of the roster.

Or, with the richest owner in sports, you suck it up and pay the tax for a couple years. Wouldn't be the end of the world, especially if you're Paul Allen and would like to see your team go deep in the playoffs one more time before you die.

BNM

 

[Trackjack]

I would at least kick the door to see where they stand. If they can come up with a fair enough contract for both side then sign him extension. If not then you let league figure out much he is worth either way you sign him. The only way I don't sign him next year if he come up with some serious injury. Either way there going be a risk.

 

[Strenuus]

1. Sign him

2. Dont look back.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

I do not sign him to the max this summer. If he insists on the max, wait a season. There will be no RFA "circus" - no one will offer him a contract. Every team knows we'll match, and make them tie up their money for too long during free agency.....

Other Team's Fans: "Sign him to the max!"
Other Team's GM: "They matched Allen Fucking Crabbe, you don't think they'll match Nurkic?"

All that being said, I think you sign him to a large, but not max contract this summer, and I think he'll bite.

 

[Chris Craig]

Extend him

 

[Denny Crane]

Or, with the richest owner in sports, you suck it up and pay the tax for a couple years. Wouldn't be the end of the world, especially if you're Paul Allen and would like to see your team go deep in the playoffs one more time before you die.

BNM

Hence the "if you're not winning championships" bit in my post.

$100M (tax payment) is real money, even to a billionaire.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Hence the "if you're not winning championships" bit in my post.

$100M (tax payment) is real money, even to a billionaire.

Why do you assume the tax penalty would be $100 million? Did you just pull that number out of the air?

And as I said, Neil would have two full years to dump some salary. Even if he doesn't get under the tax threshold, he could get close by dumping a couple of our truly bad contracts and replacing them with guys on rookie deals (our three draft picks) or vet minimum contracts.

BNM

 

[Denny Crane]

Why do you assume the tax penalty would be $100 million? Did you just pull that number out of the air?

And as I said, Neil would have two full years to dump some salary. Even if he doesn't get under the tax threshold, he could get close by dumping a couple of our truly bad contracts and replacing them with guys on rookie deals (our three draft picks) or vet minimum contracts.

BNM

Tax adds up really quick. I wouldn't suggest Mr. Allen is willing to pay even $50M over 2 years, unless we're already finals winner or loser.

I assume we start with 3 guys at $90M or so. 12 more roster spots at ~$2.5M each. Not worried about who we cut, the assumption is they're all cut or moved for $2.5M-ish contracts.

We could have a 7 or 8 deep team and some scrubs, but that requires those guys to be healthy.

It works for some teams, where those scrubs are still useful vets chasing a ring. I hope we get to be that good. I don't see why the city of Cleveland is more appealing to a FA than Portland.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Tax adds up really quick. I wouldn't suggest Mr. Allen is willing to pay even $50M over 2 years, unless we're already finals winner or loser.

I assume we start with 3 guys at $90M or so. 12 more roster spots at ~$2.5M each. Not worried about who we cut, the assumption is they're all cut or moved for $2.5M-ish contracts.

We could have a 7 or 8 deep team and some scrubs, but that requires those guys to be healthy.

It works for some teams, where those scrubs are still useful vets chasing a ring. I hope we get to be that good. I don't see why the city of Cleveland is more appealing to a FA than Portland.

Your math is off. Those three won't be making $90 million/year in 2018-19. Dame and C.J. will be making a combined $53,737,455. Even if you max out Nurk, that's about $80 million, not $90 million. The projected tax threshold for the 2018-19 season is $130 million. That leaves us $50 million for the other 12 spots. I suspect at least three of those will be rookie contract, end of bench guys making about $1 million/year. That leaves $47 million for 9 players, over $5.2 million/year each for guys who will actually play (10 deep rotation + two to cover injuries). Some will make more, a couple guys in the $10 - $12 million range and some will make less. It's doable. And that gets us to paying zero in taxes. If Paul's willing to pay some tax, it get's even easier to fill out the roster. We just can't afford to have bench players making $18.5 million, like Allen Crabbe.

The key to picking up cheap ring chasers is to be on the verge of contention. As you note CLE was never a free agent destination until they became a contender. Now guys are tripping over each other to get paid the league minimum for the privilege of landing one of those limited ring chaser roster spots.

BNM

 

[Paulus]

Blazers don't have much of a bargaining position. Nurkic is going to be a max player. If Olshey tries to offer anything less all Nurk's agent has to do is hold up a picture of Meyers and start giggling.

FUCK YOU MAN !!! Sheessss I almost drawn with a sip of coffee reading this oh man hahahahahahahahahahhahaahhahhha