Zach Lowe on the Blazers now

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yuyuza1 said:
Only way to find out is if we give him that shot, no? He's certainly earned it after that playoff series.
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I agree with this! After this season we'll have way more of an idea about what he is. I know I have a reasonable chance of being wrong about him, and I'll be as thrilled as anyone if I am!!
 
Denny Crane said:
But you nailed the formula that works even for the Blazers:

1) Holdover star (Lillard)
2) Big trades (have cap space and expiring contract)
3) Draft picks.
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Agreed, I just don't think it requires tanking to do that. I would be wary of dealing away draft picks, though. I'm also not sure that cap space is as valuable at this moment in history, when the coming cap explosions mean lots of teams will have cap space (and there will be a paucity of elite free agents to fill it). In general, though, I've felt that cap space is overrated. It's an asset and it can be powerful, but you have to be lucky to have it right when a star is disgruntled and a team needs to trade him before he leaves for nothing.
 
yuyuza1 said:
Look at what GS did, and what HOU is doing. These teams never bottomed out.
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The Warriors were bottomed out for over 20 years! Even from the we believe team in 2007 when they were an 8 seed who had a lucky matchup, it took 6 years and 4 coaches and a new owner just to get back to the playoffs and it wasn't til this year that anyone took them seriously.

Gsw is NOT the model to follow; I had talked myself into thinking players like Monta, Dunleavy, Joe Smith, and Vonteego Cummings were going to bring them back to respectability and it sucked. Ok, maybe I knew vonteego was no good but I just liked saying his name.
 
Minstrel said:
Agreed, I just don't think it requires tanking to do that. I would be wary of dealing away draft picks, though. I'm also not sure that cap space is as valuable at this moment in history, when the coming cap explosions mean lots of teams will have cap space (and there will be a paucity of elite free agents to fill it). In general, though, I've felt that cap space is overrated. It's an asset and it can be powerful, but you have to be lucky to have it right when a star is disgruntled and a team needs to trade him before he leaves for nothing.
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Aflallo isn't a star, but he did put up 18/3/3 for Orlando as a full time player. Neil was able to score him down the stretch for scraps and pick. Boston got Ray Allen for a #5 pick and almost useless bench players.
 
Minstrel said:
(and there will be a paucity of elite free agents to fill it)
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I feel like that's the NBA at this point in time. There are very few bona fide elite players in the league - and even some of the elite players are a little lacking (Durant, Melo). It seems like we're in an in-between phase, waiting for an injection of new talent in the league.
 
Ok, maybe not GS then.

But HOU for sure. Spurs for sure.
 
My biggest fear for Meyers is that he just becomes another Spencer Hawes. Although I guess before this year, Hawes was considered a decent player.
 
B-Roy said:
My biggest fear for Meyers is that he just becomes another Spencer Hawes. Although I guess before this year, Hawes was considered a decent player.
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That's your fear?

That's my hope.
 
B-Roy said:
My biggest fear for Meyers is that he just becomes another Spencer Hawes. Although I guess before this year, Hawes was considered a decent player.
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Last summer nearly everyone in here - plus Olshey! - wanted Hawes!
 
Denny Crane said:
Aflallo isn't a star, but he did put up 18/3/3 for Orlando as a full time player. Neil was able to score him down the stretch for scraps and pick.
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Afflalo is a little overrated. When he was scoring 18 efficient PPG with strong defense, he was quite a good player. His defense has declined steadily the past few years and his scoring efficiency has always been hit-or-miss. He wasn't worth a first-round pick, though I understand why Olshey made the trade; it was a panic move, but the "right" kind of panic move, the kind you use to try to keep together a dark horse contender. It didn't work, obviously.

More to the point, though, you can sign players of Afflalo's level for the MLE (Afflalo himself went for more to the Knicks, but I consider that in the class of "overpays" this offseason that is directly related to how the cap is set to jump by large amounts--not a common occurrence). You don't need to do anything special to get players of that ilk and even Portland can sign such players.

I'm still very much in the camp that it's better to be a good team and try to build towards great rather than tear it all down and try to build greatness from lottery picks and cap space.
 
Minstrel said:
Afflalo is a little overrated. When he was scoring 18 efficient PPG with strong defense, he was quite a good player. His defense has declined steadily the past few years and his scoring efficiency has always been hit-or-miss. He wasn't worth a first-round pick, though I understand why Olshey made the trade; it was a panic move, but the "right" kind of panic move, the kind you use to try to keep together a dark horse contender. It didn't work, obviously.

More to the point, though, you can sign players of Afflalo's level for the MLE (Afflalo himself went for more to the Knicks, but I consider that in the class of "overpays" this offseason that is directly related to how the cap is set to jump by large amounts--not a common occurrence). You don't need to do anything special to get players of that ilk and even Portland can sign such players.

I'm still very much in the camp that it's better to be a good team and try to build towards great rather than tear it all down and try to build greatness from lottery picks and cap space.
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It wasn't a panic move, it was a move to bolster a team in the hunt for a championship now.

Afflalo hasn't been paid as low as MLE since his rookie contract.

Lillard was a lottery pick. I'll take more like that.
 
Denny Crane said:
It wasn't a panic move, it was a move to bolster a team in the hunt for a championship now.
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It was an overpay and it wasn't likely to repair the damage caused by Matthews' loss. We can label it however we wish, but it was a low-probability gamble to try and save a possible title-contending season. I don't think it was irrational, though; adversity sometimes requires less than optimal responses.
 
Minstrel said:
It was an overpay and it wasn't likely to repair the damage caused by Matthews' loss. We can label it however we wish, but it was a low-probability gamble to try and save a possible title-contending season. I don't think it was irrational, though; adversity sometimes requires less than optimal responses.
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Afflalo was acquired before Wes went down. It was hardly damage control.
 
Minstrel said:
Afflalo is a little overrated. When he was scoring 18 efficient PPG with strong defense, he was quite a good player. His defense has declined steadily the past few years and his scoring efficiency has always been hit-or-miss. He wasn't worth a first-round pick, though I understand why Olshey made the trade; it was a panic move, but the "right" kind of panic move, the kind you use to try to keep together a dark horse contender. It didn't work, obviously.

More to the point, though, you can sign players of Afflalo's level for the MLE (Afflalo himself went for more to the Knicks, but I consider that in the class of "overpays" this offseason that is directly related to how the cap is set to jump by large amounts--not a common occurrence). You don't need to do anything special to get players of that ilk and even Portland can sign such players.

I'm still very much in the camp that it's better to be a good team and try to build towards great rather than tear it all down and try to build greatness from lottery picks and cap space.
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Bravo. Agree on all accounts.
 
I moved to Portland in August of last year and got season tickets in March, starting with last playoffs. So, next year is my first full season of season tickets. Previously, I lived outside of DC and owned Wizards season tickets the year that John Wall got hurt early and the team started 0-13 (since I grew up in Baltimore, I've been an NBA orphan until I moved out here).

I would really, really, like to have season tickets to a winning basketball team. That said, I agree with the sentiment that it's much better to be bottomed out than in the middle. The draft & draft lottery in the NBA favors teams that are awful. Fringe playoff contenders get stuck at the end of the lottery or in the mid-late teens, and it's rare to hit on players in that range.
 
J.D. said:
I moved to Portland in August of last year and got season tickets in March, starting with last playoffs. So, next year is my first full season of season tickets. Previously, I lived outside of DC and owned Wizards season tickets the year that John Wall got hurt early and the team started 0-13 (since I grew up in Baltimore, I've been an NBA orphan until I moved out here).

I would really, really, like to have season tickets to a winning basketball team. That said, I agree with the sentiment that it's much better to be bottomed out than in the middle. The draft & draft lottery in the NBA favors teams that are awful. Fringe playoff contenders get stuck at the end of the lottery or in the mid-late teens, and it's rare to hit on players in that range.
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Welcome! I hope we can get to 43 wins sooner rather than later!
 
J.D. said:
I moved to Portland in August of last year and got season tickets in March, starting with last playoffs. So, next year is my first full season of season tickets. Previously, I lived outside of DC and owned Wizards season tickets the year that John Wall got hurt early and the team started 0-13 (since I grew up in Baltimore, I've been an NBA orphan until I moved out here).

I would really, really, like to have season tickets to a winning basketball team. That said, I agree with the sentiment that it's much better to be bottomed out than in the middle. The draft & draft lottery in the NBA favors teams that are awful. Fringe playoff contenders get stuck at the end of the lottery or in the mid-late teens, and it's rare to hit on players in that range.
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So would you consider yourself more of a Wizards fan or a Blazers fan?

Either way, welcome.
 
B-Roy said:
So would you consider yourself more of a Wizards fan or a Blazers fan?

Either way, welcome.
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Thanks! I'm a Blazers fan now. All-in. I'm not planning on moving away. I still vaguely follow the Wizards, and don't mind when they do well. But if the two teams met in the finals, I would be pulling for the Blazers to win each game by 40 points.
 
J.D. said:
I moved to Portland in August of last year and got season tickets in March, starting with last playoffs. So, next year is my first full season of season tickets. Previously, I lived outside of DC and owned Wizards season tickets the year that John Wall got hurt early and the team started 0-13 (since I grew up in Baltimore, I've been an NBA orphan until I moved out here).

I would really, really, like to have season tickets to a winning basketball team. That said, I agree with the sentiment that it's much better to be bottomed out than in the middle. The draft & draft lottery in the NBA favors teams that are awful. Fringe playoff contenders get stuck at the end of the lottery or in the mid-late teens, and it's rare to hit on players in that range.
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Welcome to RIP CITY!!!
 
The problem with tanking is that you don't aren't guaranteed with a star player. Just the chance at one. Its,a roll of the dice. And sad to say, the Blazers were always one of the leagues better teams at best.
 
ripcityboy said:
The problem with tanking is that you don't aren't guaranteed with a star player. Just the chance at one. Its,a roll of the dice. And sad to say, the Blazers were always one of the leagues better teams at best.
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Pleez splane.
 
In the big picture, Portland lost 4 pretty elite players in Z-bo, Roy, Oden and Aldridge with almost no compensation. (And really, looking back on the circumstances, there's a pretty good argument that management didn't really do anything wrong on any of these guys in that time period. Shit just happens sometimes.)

Imagine the Spurs losing Leonard, Duncan, Parker and Ginobili over the past 8 years. Uncompensated. (Collectively, the talent of our Big 4 was probably even greater than these guys.) Popovich would probably be coaching a different team by now. The Spurs would be in full-on tank mode most likely. At best they would look a lot like us. Nobody would be citing them as a model for building on the fly.

Sometimes bad things happen to good teams. It sucks, but there it is. I look at our current roster and, well, the nice thing about being a Blazer fan is that you know it always could be much more grim.

We may not have this:
BlazersStartingFive.jpg


But we also don't have this:
51013749-ha-seung-jin-sebastian-telfair-viktor-khryapa-gettyimages.jpg
 
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