A primary problem? Free throw attempts

[Ed O]

Last year's free throw attempts leaders for the Blazers:

Roy (440)
Aldridge (392)
Miller (304)
Bayless (242)
Webster (155)
Rudy (98)

Wes Matthews attempted 193 (in a faster-paced offense) but we still were asking for trouble in terms of free throws attempted when we traded both Bayless and Webster.

Our team got to the line 24.8 times a game last year, and we're down to 22.1 this year.

Free throws are the most consistently effective weapon a team can employ. This team is built around jump-shooters that don't get to the line... after trading Bayless and Webster (and replacing them with a single player, basically) we were set up with little room for error, and it's coming back to bite us.

Ed O.

 

[Mediocre Man]

To quote the oten maligned Sir Charles.

"Portland is a jump shooting team"

FTA has always been a big key for me, and one of the main reasons I was sad to see Bayless traded


2010 - 29th
2009 - 12th
2008 - 16th
2007 - 25th
2006 - 21st
2005 - 27th
2004 - 15th
2003 - 24th
2002 - 27th
2001 - 28th
2000 - 17th

So in 11seasons as a head coach, Nate's teams have finished at or below the league average 10 times. Good teams tend to get to the line more times than not.

 

[hasoos]

Just another thing Bayless did that in 17 minutes a game. If he had played the minutes Roy had, he would have buried him in free throw attempts for the year. That is what a lot of folks don't understand about Bayless. The style of play he had was weak in some areas. But he made up for it in others by playing the right way. The right way is to get to the rim and put pressure on the defense. By getting fouls on the opposition, it causes additional problems for teams because their interior players get in foul trouble. Its not just a couple of points here and there. It is the opponents bigs being limited by foul trouble in quarter 4, and not being able to play at full agressiveness because of it.

 

[BoBoBREWSKI]

We are soft. Have been for awhile.
FT percentage has always pissed me off. There is no excuse for an NBA player to not shoot at least 85% from the line. Every guard and SF should shoot at least 90%.

 

[BLAZER PROPHET]

To quote the oten maligned Sir Charles.

"Portland is a jump shooting team"

FTA has always been a big key for me, and one of the main reasons I was sad to see Bayless traded


2010 - 29th
2009 - 12th
2008 - 16th
2007 - 25th
2006 - 21st
2005 - 27th
2004 - 15th
2003 - 24th
2002 - 27th
2001 - 28th
2000 - 17th

So in 11seasons as a head coach, Nate's teams have finished at or below the league average 10 times. Good teams tend to get to the line more times than not.

It's because we don't run enough.

 

[handiman]

Just another thing Bayless did that in 17 minutes a game. If he had played the minutes Roy had, he would have buried him in free throw attempts for the year. That is what a lot of folks don't understand about Bayless. The style of play he had was weak in some areas. But he made up for it in others by playing the right way. The right way is to get to the rim and put pressure on the defense. By getting fouls on the opposition, it causes additional problems for teams because their interior players get in foul trouble. Its not just a couple of points here and there. It is the opponents bigs being limited by foul trouble in quarter 4, and not being able to play at full agressiveness because of it.

I think defenses were starting to figure Bayless out. Let him drive, back away from contact, contest the shot, and he'll throw up a wild scoop shot with mediocre accuracy.

 

[Nikolokolus]

FTA are no different a metric than PPG. Unless you adjust for pace there's no way of knowing how those free throw attempts stack up against the rest of the league. In general though, Bayless being traded isn't the issue here -- his FTA's declined steadily as the season wore on last year anyway -- we just don't really have a straw to stir the drink right now or at least not with Roy in the shape he's in, and Miller and he having some of the worst chemistry I've ever seen in a backcourt (with a nod of deference to Sebastian Telfair and Juan Dixon). Guys are trying to play one-on-one and nobody really up to the task and nobody to spread the floor reliably.

 

[blazedanugz]

roy averaged 6.8 FTA per game last season...this year hes averaging 4.8 FTA per game. theres 2 attempts right there

 

[Ed O]

FTA are no different a metric than PPG. Unless you adjust for pace there's no way of knowing how those free throw attempts stack up against the rest of the league.

The difference (or a difference) is that players only get a certain number of fouls a game, so while a team scoring 120 PPG might give up 130, a team drawing 30 fouls a game are getting their opponents in foul trouble in almost every case.

Further, free throws are always easy. Whether you play at a slow pace or a fast pace, getting more free throws should always be a goal. The Blazers have almost no one who draws free throws at a good clip, and it's one of the things killing them right now.

Ed O.

 

[Nikolokolus]

The difference (or a difference) is that players only get a certain number of fouls a game, so while a team scoring 120 PPG might give up 130, a team drawing 30 fouls a game are getting their opponents in foul trouble in almost every case.

Further, free throws are always easy. Whether you play at a slow pace or a fast pace, getting more free throws should always be a goal. The Blazers have almost no one who draws free throws at a good clip, and it's one of the things killing them right now.

Ed O.

I don't argue that. I have a feeling that if Roy's knee had flared up like this in the pre-season Cho probably would have held off on pulling the trigger on the Bayless trade.

 

[craigehlo]

The lack of FT attempts are merely a symptom of being primarily a jump shooting team. You want more FTs? Fire Nate.

-Captain Obvious

 

[Ed O]

I don't argue that. I have a feeling that if Roy's knee had flared up like this in the pre-season Cho probably would have held off on pulling the trigger on the Bayless trade.

Word up.

Ed O.

 

[Ed O]

The lack of FT attempts are merely a symptom of being primarily a jump shooting team. You want more FTs? Fire Nate.

-Captain Obvious

Hmm... game plan is part of it, but I think it's just as much a matter of the players. I don't have data to back it up, but I believe that some players are just able/willing to get to the line and others much less so.

The current roster (maybe because of Nate's preferences) is lacking guys who can get to the line regularly.

Ed O.

 

[LittleAlex]

Hmm... game plan is part of it, but I think it's just as much a matter of the players. I don't have data to back it up, but I believe that some players are just able/willing to get to the line and others much less so.

The current roster (maybe because of Nate's preferences) is lacking guys who can get to the line regularly.

Ed O.

You know, I was thinking about this the other night.

I am wondering if perhaps all the injuries the team has suffered is something that rolls around in the back of the other players minds causing them a split second hesitation when they could attack the rim.

I know I wouldn't want to get crippled like Oden or Roy if I was still playing out my first contract.
I also wouldn't want to tweak my knee and count on the Blazers medical staff to take care of me.


There is no way to prove this but the guys wouldn't be human if it didn't cross their minds once or twice.

 

[HailBlazers]

Definitely a huge problem. It has also has a ripple effect on the way the Ref's call the game as well, if your not attacking, your not going to get the calls. Last night was a perfect example of that.

I think it all comes down to ball movement, and off the ball player movement, If you get the defense off balance it's gonna be way easier to take it to the rim.

Another Captain obvious: LMA needs to get the ball lower in the post, he seems to draw allot of fouls when he attacks down low

 

[hasoos]

I think defenses were starting to figure Bayless out. Let him drive, back away from contact, contest the shot, and he'll throw up a wild scoop shot with mediocre accuracy.

I guess Washington didn't get the note last night, since he dropped 16 on them. It is interesting, because our bench, will be facing that exact team coming up I believe. I wonder if the whole Blazers bench, will outscore what Bayless did.

 

[handiman]

I guess Washington didn't get the note last night, since he dropped 16 on them. It is interesting, because our bench, will be facing that exact team coming up I believe. I wonder if the whole Blazers bench, will outscore what Bayless did.

Washington and defense don't get used in the same sentence very often... They did give up 127 pts to a rather lousy Toronto team, after all. And Bayless only had 4 FTA's among his 16 pts, so that doesn't exactly disprove my point that defenses figured out he's not all that tough to keep off the line.

 

[Ed O]

Washington and defense don't get used in the same sentence very often... They did give up 127 pts to a rather lousy Toronto team, after all. And Bayless only had 4 FTA's among his 16 pts, so that doesn't exactly disprove my point that defenses figured out he's not all that tough to keep off the line.

In his last three games he's been to the line 17 times in 56 minutes. Does that disprove your point that defenses have figured out how to keep him off the line?

Ed O.

 

[handiman]

In his last three games he's been to the line 17 times in 56 minutes. Does that disprove your point that defenses have figured out how to keep him off the line?

Ed O.

Not really, no. I believe you're a fan of sample sizes, if memory serves... In the three games prior to your quoted three games, he went to the line a total of 5 times in 39 minutes (and he had a stretch of 3 FTA's in 7 games and 90 minutes shortly before that), so that tells me next to nothing in terms of trends.

 

[hasoos]

Washington and defense don't get used in the same sentence very often... They did give up 127 pts to a rather lousy Toronto team, after all. And Bayless only had 4 FTA's among his 16 pts, so that doesn't exactly disprove my point that defenses figured out he's not all that tough to keep off the line.

I wasn't trying to disprove it, because frankly it's ridiculous. Let's see who scores more against Washington's second unit. Bayless, or the whole Blazer second unit. Then my point will be made.

 

[handiman]

I wasn't trying to disprove it, because frankly it's ridiculous. Let's see who scores more against Washington's second unit. Bayless, or the whole Blazer second unit. Then my point will be made.

Which is what, that our bench sucks or that Bayless is really good or just decent and not as sucky as what we have without him? I'm confused. All I was saying is defenses have figured out how to keep him off the line, taking away the major weapon you and others were bemoaning lacking with him gone. If you weren't trying to disprove that notion, then I'm not sure what we're talking about.

 

[Ed O]

Not really, no. I believe you're a fan of sample sizes, if memory serves... In the three games prior to your quoted three games, he went to the line a total of 5 times in 39 minutes (and he had a stretch of 3 FTA's in 7 games and 90 minutes shortly before that), so that tells me next to nothing in terms of trends.

OK. It doesn't disprove your point.

Does it support your assertion that the NBA has figured him out?

Ed O.

 

[handiman]

Does it support your assertion that the NBA has figured him out?

How would one go about proving or disproving that? I would think the fact that he's been traded twice within a couple months speaks volumes... Nikolokolous said above, "his FTA's declined steadily as the season wore on last year." If that can be supported by game log data, then that's about as good as we're going to come up with one way or the other. Otherwise, we're left with just opinions.