OT Amen Thompson (1 Viewer)

[wizenheimer]

I have yet to see Amen as a great offensive player, he sure has fantastic athletic ability, but he just can't shoot. Castle is a much better prospect.

He sure can score near the basket.

I guess it depends on what you mean by "can't shoot". Certainly he can't shoot from three, and that detracts from his effectiveness and utility

but if you compare Amen to Sharpe this season, and Scoot last season, shooting can mean different things depending on different context and different priorities

FG%: Amen .512 (.536 career)....Sharpe .454 (.450 career)....Scoot .419 (.401 career)
2ptFG%: Amen .565 (.587 career)....Sharpe .515 (.531 career)....Scoot .469 (.438 career)
eFG%: Amen .526 (.551 career)....Sharpe .510 (.517 career)....Scoot .496 (.466 career)
FT%: Amen .797 (.721 career)....Sharpe .777 (.778 career)....Scoot .767 (..793 career)
TS%: Amen .576 (.587 career)....Sharpe .547 (..550 career)....Scoot .540 (.513 career)

FTr: Amen .344 (.349 career)....Sharpe .250 (..222 career)....Scoot .310 (.277 career)
AvgShotDist: Amen 8.4 (7.7 career)....Sharpe 13.8 (14.9 career)....Scoot 14.9 (14.5 career)
% of shots at rim: Amen .364 (.427 career)....Sharpe .257 (.248 career)....Scoot .235 (.236 career)....Avdija .269 (.279 career)
FG% at rim: Amen .755 (.743 career)....Sharpe .717 (.707 career)....Scoot .590 (.543 career)....Avdija .674 (.692 career)
% of shots 3-10': Amen .329 (.296 career)....Sharpe .187 (.150 career)....Scoot .199 (.187 career)....Avdija .247 (.255 career)
FG% at 3-10': Amen .452 (.463 career)....Sharpe .425 (.408 career)....Scoot .346 (.329 career)....Avdija ..424 (..429 career)

as noted, Amen sucks from the arc, but inside the arc and especially inside of 10' he's close to elite. I'm not sure whether it's better to have a player shooting 20% on 2 three's a game, or 34% on 6 three's a game, especially when all other shooting metrics look like this

I added Deni just because he makes for a familiar gauge applied to what Amen is doing. I also think Amen's ability to pull up and convert a high percentage of shots in the 3-10' zone is valuable. Now, I didn't add Deni's FT rate of .580 just because I hadn't though to include him then, but obviously, he's on a different level in drawing fouls



still, it's worth noting that Amen is averaging 19-8-5 which is pretty good offense. It appears he knows his own strengths and weaknesses and exercises godd shot selection. That's valuable BBIQ. Teams know he's unlikely to shoot from the perimeter so they defend against his dribble drives but he's still able to get to the rim at a high rate and convert at an elite level. That's a big component of shooting efficiency

 

[Graduate32]

I guess it depends on what you mean by "can't shoot". Certainly he can't shoot from three, and that detracts from his effectiveness and utility

but if you compare Amen to Sharpe this season, and Scoot last season, shooting can mean different things depending on different context and different priorities

FG%: Amen .512 (.536 career)....Sharpe .454 (.450 career)....Scoot .419 (.401 career)
2ptFG%: Amen .565 (.587 career)....Sharpe .515 (.531 career)....Scoot .469 (.438 career)
eFG%: Amen .526 (.551 career)....Sharpe .510 (.517 career)....Scoot .496 (.466 career)
FT%: Amen .797 (.721 career)....Sharpe .777 (.778 career)....Scoot .767 (..793 career)
TS%: Amen .576 (.587 career)....Sharpe .547 (..550 career)....Scoot .540 (.513 career)

FTr: Amen .344 (.349 career)....Sharpe .250 (..222 career)....Scoot .310 (.277 career)
AvgShotDist: Amen 8.4 (7.7 career)....Sharpe 13.8 (14.9 career)....Scoot 14.9 (14.5 career)
% of shots at rim: Amen .364 (.427 career)....Sharpe .257 (.248 career)....Scoot .235 (.236 career)....Avdija .269 (.279 career)
FG% at rim: Amen .755 (.743 career)....Sharpe .717 (.707 career)....Scoot .590 (.543 career)....Avdija .674 (.692 career)
% of shots 3-10': Amen .329 (.296 career)....Sharpe .187 (.150 career)....Scoot .199 (.187 career)....Avdija .247 (.255 career)
FG% at 3-10': Amen .452 (.463 career)....Sharpe .425 (.408 career)....Scoot .346 (.329 career)....Avdija ..424 (..429 career)

as noted, Amen sucks from the arc, but inside the arc and especially inside of 10' he's close to elite. I'm not sure whether it's better to have a player shooting 20% on 2 three's a game, or 34% on 6 three's a game, especially when all other shooting metrics look like this

I added Deni just because he makes for a familiar gauge applied to what Amen is doing. I also think Amen's ability to pull up and convert a high percentage of shots in the 3-10' zone is valuable. Now, I didn't add Deni's FT rate of .580 just because I hadn't though to include him then, but obviously, he's on a different level in drawing fouls

View attachment 79967

still, it's worth noting that Amen is averaging 19-8-5 which is pretty good offense. It appears he knows his own strengths and weaknesses and exercises godd shot selection. That's valuable BBIQ. Teams know he's unlikely to shoot from the perimeter so they defend against his dribble drives but he's still able to get to the rim at a high rate and convert at an elite level. That's a big component of shooting efficiency

I appreciate the statistical work, Wiz. Thank you. What I admit to be fascinated by with regard to Amen is to what effect he will have on Houston's offense come playoff time when the games slow down and defenses become more intentional and deliberate. I suspect that any negative effect (if any) might not necessarily be seen/felt in Amen's stats directly, but rather in team performance. For instance, if Amen refuses to take that open 18-footer, his percentages will not suffer, but it may have a trickle-down effect on his teammates of his defender being able to sit in the lane throughout a defensive possession. I expect that Udoka will use Amen as a frequent screener to counter it. At the very least, Amen's presence should create some interesting chess matches.

 

[Pinwheel1]

I appreciate the statistical work, Wiz. Thank you. What I admit to be fascinated by with regard to Amen is to what effect he will have on Houston's offense come playoff time when the games slow down and defenses become more intentional and deliberate. I suspect that any negative effect (if any) might not necessarily be seen/felt in Amen's stats directly, but rather in team performance. For instance, if Amen refuses to take that open 18-footer, his percentages will not suffer, but it may have a trickle-down effect on his teammates of his defender being able to sit in the lane throughout a defensive possession. I expect that Udoka will use Amen as a frequent screener to counter it. At the very least, Amen's presence should create some interesting chess matches.

Yeah, I was wondering about that myself. It will be interesting, especially at the end of the games when they need a bucket. Will he be a
Ben Simmons or Giannis?

 

[andalusian]

I guess it depends on what you mean by "can't shoot". Certainly he can't shoot from three, and that detracts from his effectiveness and utility

but if you compare Amen to Sharpe this season, and Scoot last season, shooting can mean different things depending on different context and different priorities

FG%: Amen .512 (.536 career)....Sharpe .454 (.450 career)....Scoot .419 (.401 career)
2ptFG%: Amen .565 (.587 career)....Sharpe .515 (.531 career)....Scoot .469 (.438 career)
eFG%: Amen .526 (.551 career)....Sharpe .510 (.517 career)....Scoot .496 (.466 career)
FT%: Amen .797 (.721 career)....Sharpe .777 (.778 career)....Scoot .767 (..793 career)
TS%: Amen .576 (.587 career)....Sharpe .547 (..550 career)....Scoot .540 (.513 career)

FTr: Amen .344 (.349 career)....Sharpe .250 (..222 career)....Scoot .310 (.277 career)
AvgShotDist: Amen 8.4 (7.7 career)....Sharpe 13.8 (14.9 career)....Scoot 14.9 (14.5 career)
% of shots at rim: Amen .364 (.427 career)....Sharpe .257 (.248 career)....Scoot .235 (.236 career)....Avdija .269 (.279 career)
FG% at rim: Amen .755 (.743 career)....Sharpe .717 (.707 career)....Scoot .590 (.543 career)....Avdija .674 (.692 career)
% of shots 3-10': Amen .329 (.296 career)....Sharpe .187 (.150 career)....Scoot .199 (.187 career)....Avdija .247 (.255 career)
FG% at 3-10': Amen .452 (.463 career)....Sharpe .425 (.408 career)....Scoot .346 (.329 career)....Avdija ..424 (..429 career)

as noted, Amen sucks from the arc, but inside the arc and especially inside of 10' he's close to elite. I'm not sure whether it's better to have a player shooting 20% on 2 three's a game, or 34% on 6 three's a game, especially when all other shooting metrics look like this

I added Deni just because he makes for a familiar gauge applied to what Amen is doing. I also think Amen's ability to pull up and convert a high percentage of shots in the 3-10' zone is valuable. Now, I didn't add Deni's FT rate of .580 just because I hadn't though to include him then, but obviously, he's on a different level in drawing fouls

still, it's worth noting that Amen is averaging 19-8-5 which is pretty good offense. It appears he knows his own strengths and weaknesses and exercises godd shot selection. That's valuable BBIQ. Teams know he's unlikely to shoot from the perimeter so they defend against his dribble drives but he's still able to get to the rim at a high rate and convert at an elite level. That's a big component of shooting efficiency

A non-big that is limited to scoring within 0-10 ft is a problem in the modern NBA, simple as that. Add the fact that the Rockets have masked some of their shooting problems by going absolutely nuts for offensive rebounds. That's not a recipe that can be replicated / sustained long term in the NBA.

Without shooting, Amen is not going to be the superstar that some seem to have declared him to be. At some point, this needs to happen for him to become this kind of superstar. Otherwise, he is a super-great role player in the NBA.

I think that there is a marked difference between Amen and guys like Deni (for sure) and to a lesser extent Sharpe - he is playing next to some deadly shooters (Durant, Reed Shepard) and is at best, 3rd option on offense (vs 1st for Deni, 2nd for Sharpe) - so he gets less defensive attention. We already know Deni can be a #1 option for a good team in the NBA, there is a good chance Sharpe can get there as well. I am a lot more skeptical of Amen being able to do that.

So, assuming he remains limited in his shooting - the question really is - what is he, is he a setup kind of PG in the NBA - I only have eye test for that, but to me, Castle seems like a better bet to be a modern early career Jason Kidd type of player than Amen. Is he a defensive first secondary guard / small wing? Sure, that's great, but this is not a superstar kind of player.

All I can say is that whenever I see him play, he does not jump out of the screen as a superstar kind of player, even if the athletic ability is fantastic and he clearly is working hard to become an excellent defender. Maybe I do not see enough of him to have that superstar potential jump out at me - and he is certainly young enough that he can improve, I am just commenting on what I have seen whenever I have seen him play.