Notice Any threats by any member to any member will result in immediate banning

[Cippy91]

Do you watch the WWE? I think you'd make a great CM Punk.

No I don’t. Did when I was a kid. I think if these dudes met me in person they would completely change their view, but they read my shit and think I’m some angry person. I’m really not. I’m not angry, I’m not trying to fight. As much as they make it wanna seem like that, it’s not. I did watch cm punks last moment on the wwe on the mic outing shit. So I guess that part could be attributed to me right now. I’m tired of seeing it. On a forum I used to be on all the time. It has pushed me away. Not only for the time I got banned and certain relationships and people I feel got weird towards me after like with sly. These dudes used to like me, now it just feels weird and as a member for quite a while, it makes me feel like shit. I had to fight to get unbanned because I called somebody racist. Sly didn’t give a shit to talk, now all of a sudden he wants to talk. Granted, this shit happened a while ago, I’m a loyal dude. Shit like that sticks to me. When dviss made his comment about me bringing a gun to an event if I ever went, that stuck with me. That’s my character. That just lets me know certain people are crazy. It’s such a delusion.

Now the same dudes wanna act like I don’t have points all the while telling me dviss has a right to respond how he responds because people bait him. im the villain to these dudes. Why? I have no clue. It’s frustrating.

 

[Cippy91]

But your opinion is to rid all blanket statements. So you would like it to be a rule, is that what you're saying?

All these posts and editings seem to be holding people accountable for breaking the rule we have now. What you want is an absolute abolishment of any statement from anybody that could be baiting, blanket or not.

You are free to have that opinion.

You seem to have a failure of connection between the reality of the situation and the opinion with which you have.

We can absolutely talk about blanket statements being taken away. I don't like them either. However, that's putting a blanket over the blanket statement, to which then we'd have to thwart any and every one that could subjectively and objectively be taken as baiting.

In other words, we have to be subjective upon another person when we don't know.

Also, just an aside, but you yourself are using a blanket statement in this post. "We all." "Lets all" "Nobody" " So that, in turn, under your wants, would be cause for deletion. It could also subjectively be seen as baiting. See how ugly of a line that is?

YOU may not think it is, but under what YOU wrote and what YOU want US to moderate, I would delete this message under the rule you want.

You aren’t reading correctly. You act like I want a specific rule here. No, not really. I’m over it though to be honest. I know where you’re going with this forum. This section. That’s fine. The OT section will continue to be terrible then. I will stick in the blazers section. Blanket statements? How much more direct could I be?

 

[Cippy91]

Comparing the members in here with ANTIFA is just wrong. It would be similar to comparing the Right wingers in here with Nazis. I would never even consider lumping you with any of those fools.
The whole racism thing has been pretty one sided. Maybe not entirely one sided but lopsided nevertheless. Try driving home at night and getting stopped on flimsy excuses several times. Try getting stared at in the store because you are suspected of being a candidate for shoplifting. Try getting the cold shoulder from people because they don't like your looks. Black-Americans get this treatment with regularity while you and I don't. I suspect you have no idea the crap those folks have to put up with.

I never compared anybody to antifa. I said Portland Oregon is basically home of antifa now since they run wild in the streets. That as nothing to do with the forum. I don’t think that. Yeah you’re correct, I don’t know anything most black Americans have gone through. However I’m not gonna act like racism in this country is still how it was in the 50’s, 60’s, 70’s. It’s simply not. We have come so far. It seems some people wanna still live in that time. I see a lot of successful African Americans in this country. I saw Obama’s presidency and how many people loved and still love him. Shit, I see big company’s react on just the accusation of racism like the girl who got fired from chipotle because she claimed this black guy didn’t have money on him to pay. Video uploaded, guy claims racism. She gets fired. Later on people did research and this guy would brag about dining and dashing. After that, chipotle rehired her. This country has come a long way and quite frankly I’m tired of certain groups acting as if racism is still as huge as it was. It’s tiring. It’s now cool to shit on white people.

 

[Natebishop3]

I promise to only threaten the fake accounts.

 

[dviss1]

I suspect that this is a language thing. The "y'all need to" construct seems like it lumps people that are not with people that are and people that are indifferent - which I am sure is not your intention.

My intention is to tell all white people who are not racists to actually be allies.

If you're not willing to stand up for what you know is right, you're part of the problem.

"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends."

- Martin Luther King

 

[andalusian]

My intention is to tell all white people who are not racists to actually be allies.

If you're not willing to stand up for what thou know is right, you're part of the problem.

"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends."

- Martin Luther King

I understand that - and I am telling you that they way you are saying it is what can cause alienation even if you do not mean it because it feels as if you lump the ones that are against racism and oppose it in anyway they can with those that are not.

 

[Natebishop3]

My intention is to tell all white people who are not racists to actually be allies.

What do you want us to do? (serious question)

 

[Strenuus]

You aren’t reading correctly. You act like I want a specific rule here. No, not really. I’m over it though to be honest. I know where you’re going with this forum. This section. That’s fine. The OT section will continue to be terrible then. I will stick in the blazers section. Blanket statements? How much more direct could I be?

What exactly did I miss in my response about blanket statements? I was very detailed in responding.

And yes, you are actually a main contributor to blanket statements, whether you want to believe that or not. You have done it several several several times.

So you would be moderated thusly based on what you would like, blanket statements and baiting.

It's only fair. If that's what you want, that's how it'd be.

See you on the Blazers side of the forum!

 

[Strenuus]

I never compared anybody to antifa. I said Portland Oregon is basically home of antifa now since they run wild in the streets. That as nothing to do with the forum. I don’t think that. Yeah you’re correct, I don’t know anything most black Americans have gone through. However I’m not gonna act like racism in this country is still how it was in the 50’s, 60’s, 70’s. It’s simply not. We have come so far. It seems some people wanna still live in that time. I see a lot of successful African Americans in this country. I saw Obama’s presidency and how many people loved and still love him. Shit, I see big company’s react on just the accusation of racism like the girl who got fired from chipotle because she claimed this black guy didn’t have money on him to pay. Video uploaded, guy claims racism. She gets fired. Later on people did research and this guy would brag about dining and dashing. After that, chipotle rehired her. This country has come a long way and quite frankly I’m tired of certain groups acting as if racism is still as huge as it was. It’s tiring. It’s now cool to shit on white people.

Blanket statement on Portland.

Could be cause for baiting.

See how this would work?

 

[dviss1]

You are missing my point and its right there in bold. They aren't my racists any more than they are yours. Racism comes from more than just white people. And when you lump me in with them, I stop listening to you.
It only upsets me because I consider you a friend.. that's the only reason.



Its not that I don't care anymore about THE cause, its not caring about YOUR cause because you insist on lumping all white people into one lump sum, which is a huge issue with white racists who lump all blacks into one sum. Its not white privilege, its being impartial.

I have no room for hatred, bigotry or racism in my life. period.

I also cant stand people who don't use blinkers, but I don't think I can get people to start using blinkers by lumping all drivers into one sum.
Maybe not the best analogy, but as long as you lump us white people all into one category, I really don't care if you think my response is because of white privilege.

I read somewhere where you said something like all republicans are racist or support a racist or something? Also not true and also generalizing. The very thing that causes more dissention.

This is no better than Antifa calling anyone who is a republican a nazi.
Its simply not factually true and does nothing to help the cause. It hurts the cause.


The others above are right in this fact.

You get more flies with honey than with vinegar. You will make it further in getting your point across if you don't pin everyone white as having an issue. because we don't all have issues.

Some blacks have issues. You don't see anyone on this forum saying D, you need to get your folk in line. You need to stop this cop hating( another thing that frustrates me about something you said about cops and cop supporters.)

You toss out generalizing statements that encompass many who shouldn't be in that statement.

I can only assume that when you say yall need to fix these people, you are speaking to me and every other White person. How exactly do you propose I do this? As if I have some power over other whites state of mind and can control them to stop their racist behavior?
I can only do what you advocate, which is speak up when it happens.

Well i'm doing that now and racism comes in more forms than just whites hating on blacks.

Just to be clear, I dont think you are calling all White people racist. I think you are saying its all White people's problem that there is racism when it isn't. Just like it isn't every Black person's problem.


When you say these things, I cant help but feel like you think I have some direct influence on the KKK or something.

Yes, I agree that it goes further to have White people speak up against racism than it does Blacks or any other minority, but that doesn't mean that we are all part of the problem if we aren't out marching 24/7.

I mean really, what more would you like to see done from the White people on this forum that aren't bigots or racists? Other than speaking up when we see it, what else do you advocate we do, so we know and can start doing it so you stop lumping us all together?

Let's put it another way. IF you had a brother who was a drug addict who stole for his fix, I could then say you need to fix yall thieves, right? I know that's over the top, but its still the same generalization that you are exhibiting when you say yall white people....

Please just think about what I am saying. When EVER has fighting fire with fire put the fire out?

Do white racists listen to black people?

Since they don't, I'm asking my white friends to be actual allies.

It's not enough to talk about it on a message board.

Again, being able to stay out, tune out, get turned off of, is a privilege not afforded to me.

But instead, we get chastised and called racist by the very same people who voted for Trump...

 

[Cippy91]

My intention is to tell all white people who are not racists to actually be allies.

If you're not willing to stand up for what thou know is right, you're part of the problem.

"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends."

- Martin Luther King

Be allies he says. Any normal and decent human being is already an ally. We don’t have to announce it to please you. All humans should be allies to one another unless that human is just an ugly person on the inside. White people that aren’t racists don’t need to sit and announce it or do any special gestures towards African Americans that they wouldn’t do to anybody else. People should treat each other how they wanna be treated. Nobody needs your preaching on anything racial because it is skewed. Shit I ball with black people and have one very good friend that is black. All you gotta do is treat people the same. It’s not hard. This whole ally thing is the stupidest shit I keep hearing among the left. Just be a decent human being. Simple. The more you bring up racial shit, the more divided people get. People are sick of hearing what they need to do according to your rules. Especially your rules

 

[Cippy91]

Blanket statement on Portland.

Could be cause for baiting.

See how this would work?

Not really. Have you seen videos lately the past few months? Antifa has a bit more ground here than anywhere else. Just as I would suspect some alt right group has more ground on a southern spot. It’s not a blanket statement if you pay attention to your own city and what’s been going on

 

[dviss1]

I have no room for hatred, bigotry or racism in my life. period.

Serious question:

Did you file a complaint against the people who falsely called the police on the brown people working on your home?

 

[Cippy91]

Do white racists listen to black people?

Since they don't, I'm asking my white friends to be actual allies.

It's not enough to talk about it on a message board.

Again, being able to stay out, tune out, get turned off of, is a privilege not afforded to me.

But instead, we get chastised and called racist by the very same people who voted for Trump...

As if your reactions to the republicans and people that voted for trump on this forum arent alienating...

Like come on. You lump them all together and say y’all this and y’all that just as I’m sure a racist trump supporter would lump black people. Difference is, I don’t see any racist trump supporters here.

 

[dviss1]

I understand that - and I am telling you that they way you are saying it is what can cause alienation even if you do not mean it because it feels as if you lump the ones that are against racism and oppose it in anyway they can with those that are not.

The same people pissed about it, voted for Trump...

Common sense says white racists don't care about what I have to say.

They need interpreters.

 

[Strenuus]

Not really. Have you seen videos lately the past few months? Antifa has a bit more ground here than anywhere else. Just as I would suspect some alt right group has more ground on a southern spot. It’s not a blanket statement if you pay attention to your own city and what’s been going on

Is every single person an ally or part of antifa?

Videos are a screen that only shows a little bit.

Kind of like when something happens that -looks- like it affects the whole town. But then tourists come back and say "No, I didn't see any of that. That was on the other side of town"

Just because it's going on, doesn't mean all of portland oregon is of that group.

THAT'S a blanket statement, and THAT'S what can be assumed from it. Regardless of your intent. This is why what you want would never work.

You can backpedal from that, but when you say a city and say "basically"... you're trying to say it without saying it. The same exact thing that you are mad at is exactly what you were doing.

Tell me how that makes sense and why you get a free pass and you want others to be moderated? DOes that seem fair?

I know, I know. "I wasn't really..." but then theres the grey area. The same grey area you hate is the same one you habitate at times.

We're humans. We all dabble in the grey area. Embrace it.

 

[Jade Falcon]

Do white racists listen to black people?

Since they don't, I'm asking my white friends to be actual allies.

It's not enough to talk about it on a message board.

Again, being able to stay out, tune out, get turned off of, is a privilege not afforded to me.

But instead, we get chastised and called racist by the very same people who voted for Trump...

I won't call you racist, but I would appreciate if you showed me the same amount of respect and didn't insinuate that I'm racist for voting for Trump.

I think that's a fair trade off. Because it really is true that not everyone who voted for Trump is racist.

Unfortunately, yes, some do exist. I know because I've dealt online with them.

But in MY experience....again, MY experience.....the majority of people who voted for Trump were tired of established politicians, and wanted a brash businessman from Queens to shake things up.

If you disagree with that, then we'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Do white racists listen to black people?

Since they don't, I'm asking my white friends to be actual allies.

It's not enough to talk about it on a message board.

Again, being able to stay out, tune out, get turned off of, is a privilege not afforded to me.

But instead, we get chastised and called racist by the very same people who voted for Trump...

So again i pose the question. What more do you want done? What more would be enough and how do you know what you want isnt already there? What, more than speaking out against it is needed to be enough to be considered an ally.?

I never called you a racist but there is that generalization again.
Im trying to help you.

When you label us all it does no good to your cause. However valid and needed the cause is. My best friend and non blood brother is full on hispanic. We have had these conversations for decades. All he says is just be you. If you arent racist it will show and eventually rub off on those that are. I dont agree 100% with that but i also think there is some truth to that.
Its like killing them with kindness.

So when you say what we are currently doing isnt enough, how do you know? What makes you think that your way is the only way and that nothing else is being done by all the whites here you say arent doing enough?

“Y'all need to check yourselves.”

Please explain what more is needed to appease this statement?

 

[Cippy91]

Is every single person an ally or part of antifa?

Videos are a screen that only shows a little bit.

Kind of like when something happens that -looks- like it affects the whole town. But then tourists come back and say "No, I didn't see any of that. That was on the other side of town"

Just because it's going on, doesn't mean all of portland oregon is of that group.

THAT'S a blanket statement, and THAT'S what can be assumed from it. Regardless of your intent. This is why what you want would never work.

You can backpedal from that, but when you say a city and say "basically"... you're trying to say it without saying it. The same exact thing that you are mad at is exactly what you were doing.

Tell me how that makes sense and why you get a free pass and you want others to be moderated? DOes that seem fair?

I know, I know. "I wasn't really..." but then theres the grey area. The same grey area you hate is the same one you habitate at times.

We're humans. We all dabble in the grey area. Embrace it.

Yeah but there’s a difference between me dabbling in the gray area trying to get to you and me dabbling in the gray area talking about antifa. But here’s the thing, you know what I meant. Obviously the whole city isn’t antifa. Obviously if any tourists came here they likely wouldn’t see it. You still know what I’m saying though. So when you read some shit here and you can clearly see a person in that gray area taking jabs at another, that’s different. But hey agree to disagree

 

[Strenuus]

I won't call you racist, but I would appreciate if you showed me the same amount of respect and didn't insinuate that I'm racist for voting for Trump.

I think that's a fair trade off. Because it really is true that not everyone who voted for Trump is racist.

Unfortunately, yes, some do exist. I know because I've dealt online with them.

But in MY experience....again, MY experience.....the majority of people who voted for Trump were tired of established politicians, and wanted a brash businessman from Queens to shake things up.

If you disagree with that, then we'll have to agree to disagree.

An honest question:

How much faith did you have in Trump to actually lead a country? Because fixing it for the sake of fixing it seems really silly. And yes, I abhor trump and think he's the worst person to ever be in that house, but he had nothing to really qualify him to be that.

He's shown to be a mouthpiece for division more than unity, in my opinion, and it was shown before he took office. I just don't see how anyone could believe he could run a country. This is not to bash you, and I hope you don't take it that way, but I'm just confused as to what people saw. And if "wanting a change from established politics" was the reason... he wasn't the answer, IMO.

 

[andalusian]

The same people pissed about it, voted for Trump...

I have no idea who OB voted for - but if you guys think you are friends and he tells you that this is an issue he has - this is something to consider.

I can assure you that the first time I read the "y'all white people" sentence I cringed as well - and I did not vote for Mr. Trump. Now, my guess from the context of reading this forum for a while was that you were not trying to lump everyone together - but the sentence sure read like it to me.

Common sense says white racists don't care about what I have to say.

They need interpreters.

Common sense says that racists of any kind will not take the word of people they are prejudiced against - there is no argument about that.

The argument is that using a language that can be read as if it lumps people together - even if that's not your intention - can cause alienation - this is all OB and I have said.

 

[Chris Craig]

Yeah but there’s a difference between me dabbling in the gray area trying to get to you and me dabbling in the gray area talking about antifa. But here’s the thing, you know what I meant. Obviously the whole city isn’t antifa. Obviously if any tourists came here they likely wouldn’t see it. You still know what I’m saying though. So when you read some shit here and you can clearly see a person in that gray area taking jabs at another, that’s different. But hey agree to disagree

Then stop using antifa as a generalization. I am not in antifa. I don't believe anyone here is.

 

[Strenuus]

Yeah but there’s a difference between me dabbling in the gray area trying to get to you and me dabbling in the gray area talking about antifa. But here’s the thing, you know what I meant. Obviously the whole city isn’t antifa. Obviously if any tourists came here they likely wouldn’t see it. You still know what I’m saying though. So when you read some shit here and you can clearly see a person in that gray area taking jabs at another, that’s different. But hey agree to disagree

Just like when someone says "republicans" or "democrats" are this and that. Doesn't mean -every- single one.

But we would have to police it that way, because the moment we let one go, we'd hear it about another one.

So your comment would be under that same law, too. "I knew what you meant" sure... other people with blanket statement know what they mean too. But when people start asking for baiting blanket statements to be taken away, yours would have been one too. It falls under that, intent or no.

 

[Strenuus]

The same people pissed about it, voted for Trump...

Common sense says white racists don't care about what I have to say.

They need interpreters.

I've already deleted some stuff from you, dviss. Keep it civil.

 

[dviss1]

What do you want us to do? (serious question)

Call them out LOUDLY. Be Jane Elliott:

Ask the ones who stay silent this:



Hold workshops like this:



Join organizations like Resolutions Northwest who's mission is:

We facilitate honest dialogue to resolve conflict and advance racial & social justice. We provide training & consultation. We build skills & capacity.

That's just a start.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Serious question:

Did you file a complaint against the people who falsely called the police on the brown people working on your home?

No. For two reasons.
I dont know for a fact it was racially motivated. I dont know who actually called it in and i have many neighbors.
I assume that it was racially motivated, but without some proof or evidence i find it wrong to pass jusgment without knowing everything.

Do i have a gut feeing it was racially motivated? Yes.
But thats my opinion. Not fact.

Wouldnt i look pretty stupid if i called it in and the cops said the call in was becasue a cement truck was seen and they were concerned about additional structures? Especially since they had been working on my house since march as a small crew for a while and wxpanded the crew on e we started working on the exterior and no one called in until then?

See i believe everyone can have opinions and feelings and thats everyones right. But we cant pass judgement on our feelings without some proof.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Call them out LOUDLY. Be Jane Elliott:

Ask the ones who stay silent this:



Hold workshops like this:



Join organizations like Resolutions Northwest who's mission is:

We facilitate honest dialogue to resolve conflict and advance racial & social justice. We provide training & consultation. We build skills & capacity.

That's just a start.

How do you know these things or similiar things arent already being done by forum members outside of the forum?

 

[dviss1]

I won't call you racist, but I would appreciate if you showed me the same amount of respect and didn't insinuate that I'm racist for voting for Trump.

I've never once insinuated this. There are many people that voted for him that aren't.

 

[Cippy91]

I needed to back up a bit. I get too involved in this shit. This is why I stay away from the nonsense. I would like to participate in positive OT conversations but unfortunately those are rare. Fuck the politics and all that. Yes though, my fault for responding to dviss, my fault for entertaining it. I had a choice, one I usually make in real life and that’s usually to just stay the fuck out of it because it’s just a waste of time and not worth it. I got involved though last night and today. Maybe I was feeling froggy or some shit last night and got riled up. That’s on me. I will always speak my opinion and I still hold my opinions here but maybe it’s best if I just don’t share them here because they are clearly unwanted. My intention wasn’t trying to get some rule made or anything, honestly I just wanted some to see the hypocrisy and irony in some of the shit that goes on here and maybe take that into account. That’s all. Dviss won’t see this but I’m sorry dviss for saying shit last night you may or may not have seen. That was unfair of me to call you certain things regardless of our past. I have tried to reason with you many times before and have conversations, you have let it be known you don’t want to so nothing I can do there.

Chris, I’m sure you do a lot behind the scenes, I wasn’t trying to offend you, I get frustrated though at times with how the OT section is today compared to pre trump and the hysteria around the presidency.

Sly, I appreciate you actually trying to have a conversation with me last night as I have felt for a while you haven’t cared to do that with me since all that shit went down. I’m not trying to say mods here are bad or anything, there are just frustrations that exist still.

 

[dviss1]

I have no idea who OB voted for - but if you guys think you are friends and he tells you that this is an issue he has - this is something to consider.

I can assure you that the first time I read the "y'all white people" sentence I cringed as well - and I did not vote for Mr. Trump. Now, my guess from the context of reading this forum for a while was that you were not trying to lump everyone together - but the sentence sure read like it to me.



Common sense says that racists of any kind will not take the word of people they are prejudiced against - there is no argument about that.

The argument is that using a language that can be read as if it lumps people together - even if that's not your intention - can cause alienation - this is all OB and I have said.

I can easily talk a racist black person down of the ledge.

I do it all the time.