Are we still tanking?

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What should be the Blazers goal for next season?

  • Suck so bad we Hawk Tuah!

    Votes: 42 75.0%

  • Play-in or Bust!

    Votes: 11 19.6%

  • Championship baby!

    Votes: 3 5.4%
  • Total voters
    56
Phatguysrule said:
Winning more than 20 this year would be shooting yourself in the foot.
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First, I think that the West is going to be very competitive this year. I don’t see anyone only winning 20 games. I’d be surprised if the East wasn’t more competitive as well. The Pistons will still suck, but 62 losses worth?

Second, playing to lose has a negative effect on team morale and development of young players.

Third, do we never learn from the Blazers’ history of ping pong balls dropping the wrong way or seemingly sure draft picks going bust due to injury or a player just not being as good at the pro level as expected? The draft, even in a loaded year, is still a crapshoot.

Play to win, at least until the losses pile up to a level where winning is no longer possible, then let the chips fall where they may with respect to the draft.
 
Phatguysrule said:
If we can add 2 all stars over the next 2 drafts that's far more important than playing Scoot and Sharpe behind some vets who net us an extract 5 or 6 wins.

Need to start both Scoot and Sharpe. Give them developmental coaches and trainers. The rest will take care of itself. Maybe we do play Clingan a lot.

We need to be high lotto the next 2 drafts.
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Fucking A. I thought that I was the most optimistic poster here, but you just kicked my ass!
 
e_blazer said:
First, I think that the West is going to be very competitive this year. I don’t see anyone only winning 20 games. I’d be surprised if the East wasn’t more competitive as well. The Pistons will still suck, but 62 losses worth?

Second, playing to lose has a negative effect on team morale and development of young players.

Third, do we never learn from the Blazers’ history of ping pong balls dropping the wrong way or seemingly sure draft picks going bust due to injury or a player just not being as good at the pro level as expected? The draft, even in a loaded year, is still a crapshoot.

Play to win, at least until the losses pile up to a level where winning is no longer possible, then let the chips fall where they may with respect to the draft.
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The only way Portland wins more than 20 next season is if we play the vets heavy minutes.

We should not do that. The vets should be traded.
 
Phatguysrule said:
The only way Portland wins more than 20 next season is if we play the vets heavy minutes.

We should not do that. The vets should be traded.
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I respect your dedication to the tank, but I don’t agree.
 
1 Eye Jack said:
I’m tired of tanking……just play it out with Scoot and Sharpe starting let the chips fall where they may.
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Yeah my opinion is that we should move all of the win now players and concentrate on developing youth including and specifically around the guys you just mentioned (Scoot and Shae). If we do that we can get all of the young guys a ton of experience, they can play their hearts out, they won't have to sit at the end of the season and we'll still land with decent odds in the lotto. Oh and from an entertainment standpoint, in my experience losing with guys who are getting better all the time is a helluva lot more fun than losing with guys who are already set in their ways as NBA players and don't quite lose enough so we just sit them for at least the last third of the season.

Go full rebuild and then you don't have to do inorganic shit to "tank" you just end up with a good pick while watching the team get better.
 
Phatguysrule said:
If we can add 2 all stars over the next 2 drafts that's far more important than playing Scoot and Sharpe behind some vets who net us an extract 5 or 6 wins.
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Whether or not we keep Grant and Ant, Shae is not going to be playing behind a vet.
Scoot could come off the bench unless he improves, but either way, he will get close to 30 minutes.
It is a very long season and with injuries, there are plenty of minutes to go around.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Whether or not we keep Grant and Ant, Shae is not going to be playing behind a vet.
Scoot could come off the bench unless he improves, but either way, he will get close to 30 minutes.
It is a very long season and with injuries, there are plenty of minutes to go around.
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If we are what Joe said we are and that is committed to building around a back court of Scoot and Shaedon then you start both of them and you don't play either out of position... you trade Ant because he's just not a fit. The team that makes the most sense for Ant has a guy they drafted last year that would be a fantastic backup that would fit very well next to either Scoot or Shaedon when he would be subbed in.

I think we could get Black and the more favorable of Orlando's and Denver's FRPs in next year's draft for Ant. I think that should be enough for us and I do not think it's asking for too much from them.
 
What kind of bust are we talking about?

My answer hinges strongly on clarification of that.
 
blazerkor said:
If we are what Joe said we are and that is committed to building around a back court of Scoot and Shaedon then you start both of them and you don't play either out of position... you trade Ant because he's just not a fit. The team that makes the most sense for Ant has a guy they drafted last year that would be a fantastic backup that would fit very well next to either Scoot or Shaedon when he would be subbed in.

I think we could get Black and the more favorable of Orlando's and Denver's FRPs in next year's draft for Ant. I think that should be enough for us and I do not think it's asking for too much from them.
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Who is saying playing Scoot and Shae out of position? I think that you start them both as well. I was just saying if Scoot came off the bench he would still get his minutes. You don't like Ant and that is fine but to say he is not a good fit is confusing to me. His shooting off the bench would fit very well next to Shae and a "point forward" like Deni.
 
The scary thing about last year is we had to fake injuries to keep from winning too much. I fear the same will have to happen this year. We have real talent on this team. We just have to make sure to throttle it appropriately.
 
Can someone confirm my lousy research? It appears the only pick we may have in the first round is the one we owe Chicago if we're not in the lottery. We also have a second round pick that is protected 41-59 for Atlanta. Can that be right?
 
1 Eye Jack said:
I’m tired of tanking……just play it out with Scoot and Sharpe starting let the chips fall where they may.
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This was always going to happen after trading Dame. That's why I wanted to avoid it as long as possible.

But if you're tearing down you have about an 80% chance of not drafting an all star in the lotto. So you need to plan on being high lotto 5 years in a row, minimum. It took the Lakers 6 seasons to get out of the lotto.

It'll probably take us more. I don't want to tear it down again for a long time. We're already over halfway through a good rebuild.

Let's do it right.
 
maxiep said:
Can someone confirm my lousy research? It appears the only pick we may have in the first round is the one we owe Chicago if we're not in the lottery. We also have a second round pick that is protected 41-59 for Atlanta. Can that be right?
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Not only can that be right but as far as I know it is right.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Who is saying playing Scoot and Shae out of position? I think that you start them both as well. I was just saying if Scoot came off the bench he would still get his minutes. You don't like Ant and that is fine but to say he is not a good fit is confusing to me. His shooting off the bench would fit very well next to Shae and a "point forward" like Deni.
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I do like Ant but I like him surrounded by size and elite defenders and hopefully another guy who can be the primary playmaker on the majority of plays. That's not this team. I also think the fact that Joe point blank said this team is being built around Scoot and Shae and didn't say a damn word about Ant after a year of saying that Ant is our best player likely means that one or more likely multiple seeds that Joe said had been planted that day will have Ant on a different team soon.

Oh and I don't like Ant nearly as much as I like Scoot or Shae... I know that Ant has more realized value but I like the character of both younger guys and what that means for their potential. I do not like how Ant's game has fit with Scoot's or Shae's or projects to fit with them.
 
We’ll be perpetually tanking for as long as I can see
 
Team building takes time. We are arguably entering our 2nd or 3rd year of the rebuild. Some of the players with the most potential are still rookies and will take 4-5 years to reach their potential. Whether we intentionally tank or not for the next year or two is anyone's guest but regardless - we will not have a contender for several more years and that is IF these rookies actually reach their full potential. Adding young players through trades can speed up the process but unless we luck into a trade or two that brings us real star power I wouldn't be surprised if it takes us several more years before we even make the play ins. All things being equal - I just hope that we see some progress each year going forward until we finally have a contender - basketball gods willing!
 
If we believe that our roster contains the top-end talent necessary to contend (whether developing or not), then no, we should not be tanking.

If we do not believe that our roster contains the top-end talent necessary to contend (whether developing or not), then yes, we should be tanking.

It is as simple as that.
 
blazerkor said:
I do like Ant but I like him surrounded by size and elite defenders and hopefully another guy who can be the primary playmaker on the majority of plays. That's not this team. I also think the fact that Joe point blank said this team is being built around Scoot and Shae and didn't say a damn word about Ant after a year of saying that Ant is our best player likely means that one or more likely multiple seeds that Joe said had been planted that day will have Ant on a different team soon.
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What Joe said is fine with me. Although I don't think it was as calculated as some think. But he should build around Scoot and Shae. I just fail to see what that has to do with Simons since I have advocated for him to come off the bench. I do agree with you that he needs to play next to tall and good defenders. "Elite" may be a little extreme since very few teams have multiple elite defenders. But I would not say "That's not this team" when we are not done building this team. Shae, Deni, Clingan, Camara, and even Rupert all have the potential to be good defenders. It is rare though that good defenders are also very good shooters, so someone like Ant will always be needed.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Whether or not we keep Grant and Ant, Shae is not going to be playing behind a vet.
Scoot could come off the bench unless he improves, but either way, he will get close to 30 minutes.
It is a very long season and with injuries, there are plenty of minutes to go around.
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Scoot getting minutes is not my concern. Get rid of the "win now" vets who dominate the ball.

We need the ball in Scoot and Shae's hands to start possessions as much as possible. We need those guys defending the best guards on opposing teams as much as possible.

We'll lose games, even while trying to win. And they'll be getting so much more experience handling the situations they'll need to handle once we are back in the playoff picture in a few years.
 
e_blazer said:
I respect your dedication to the tank, but I don’t agree.
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I hate tanking. I don't want to be in this position again for as long as possible.

We'll need to lose for a couple more seasons to have the best chance if that. And it will more likely make the time in between more fun as well.

This was the best path as soon aw ee traded Dame.
 
Tank for what? Who is it y'all want to replace before having any clue of the growth and chemistry? In terms of the players they have now, who have room to improve while being competitive now, we have a very good core. The greatest mystery is Sharpe, but he seems to have the tools to become a player similar to Anthony Edwards. Say what you want. The surrounding pieces as they stand individually and their potential for improvement? Center-- is looking great. SF-- is suddenly looking great. SG is looking great. PF-- we have a very good play in Grant, and an interesting backup with 21 year old Walker. PG-- We have a guy who showed signs of figuring things out in his first season, and we should all be excited about moving forward. I just don't see the need to tear it all down before having any clue as to what it could be.

To each their own. Excited for the season!
 
Cronin is playing 4D chess. He's going to tank for three more years by strategic "injuries" to all key players. We're talking about no one playing close to a full season. He will re-sign these guys as the years go on because they will all be in on it, understanding the bigger picture. After he's collected a roster of lottery pick stars the chains will be removed, and he'll release the Kraken on the NBA. Our dynasty will begin in 2027 and will last over a decade. Genius!
 
Are the Spurs considered a well-run organization?

They've had 5 straight losing seasons. The last two seasons a combined 44 wins.

What is the outlook for that team for 2024-25?
 
Trailblazers76 said:
Cronin is playing 4D chess. He's going to tank for three more years by strategic "injuries" to all key players. We're talking about no one playing close to a full season. He will re-sign these guys as the years go on because they will all be in on it, understanding the bigger picture. After he's collected a roster of lottery pick stars the chains will be removed, and he'll release the Kraken on the NBA. Our dynasty will begin in 2027 and will last over a decade. Genius!
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every player and their agent would avoid us like the plague.
 
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