Big 3 To Be

[e_blazer]

So how close is Cronin to assembling a future competitive Big 3?

 

[SheedSoNasty]

If it’s Ayton, Scoot and Sharpe, that means that everything went well with their development and it’s what I’m hoping for. Sharpe has the tools and build to be a prototypical dominant wing.

 

[blazerfan11]

So how close is Cronin to assembling a future competitive Big 3?

He might have already done it, if Ayton can be motivated to play defense and dunk on smaller players.

I have a lot of confidence in Scoot and Sharpe. That combination together should be fantastic.

 

[e_blazer]

Added an Ant choice for those who may be so inclined.

 

[wizenheimer]

unless you have a transcendent player like Jokic or Lebron or Giannis or Curry, you really need to have two top-15 players to rank as a Big-3; at least for a Big-3 on a contender and not a pretender. I don't see anybody on the Blazer roster elevating to a top-15 unless Scoot is the next Derrick Rose. I guess if you squint your eyes while tilting your head you might see Sharpe, maybe, getting there, but that's quite a stretch at this point, especially after summer league. There are no other candidates on the roster

 

[BankTeller]

unless you have a transcendent player like Jokic or Lebron or Giannis or Curry, you really need to have two top-15 players to rank as a Big-3; at least for a Big-3 on a contender and not a pretender. I don't see anybody on the Blazer roster elevating to a top-15 unless Scoot is the next Derrick Rose. I guess if you squint your eyes while tilting your head you might see Sharpe, maybe, getting there, but that's quite a stretch at this point, especially after summer league. There are no other candidates on the roster

I absolutely believe either Sharpe, Scoot, or both can be top-15 players. With already a developed body, athletic gifts, and a good handle, he could probably get his 19ppg like Dame/Kyrie/Mitchell did their rookie years and average between 25-30ppg by year 4.

 

[wizenheimer]

I absolutely believe either Sharpe, Scoot, or both can be top-15 players. With already a developed body, athletic gifts, and a good handle, he could probably get his 19ppg like Dame/Kyrie/Mitchell did their rookie years and average between 25-30ppg by year 4.

I haven't seen a minute of Scoot on the floor against real NBA teams yet, so I don't really know, either way. One half of basketball in SL is meaningless. Sharpe? He has great athleticism and hops. And at times he seemed in control of his own pace. But he's got a long, long ways to go to just be in the all-star conversation.

can either get to elite status? Sure, it's possible. Can both? I'm a little skeptical. And if either does I doubt it would happen in the next 3 years or so. Meaning the team could look radically different

 

[e_blazer]

unless you have a transcendent player like Jokic or Lebron or Giannis or Curry, you really need to have two top-15 players to rank as a Big-3; at least for a Big-3 on a contender and not a pretender. I don't see anybody on the Blazer roster elevating to a top-15 unless Scoot is the next Derrick Rose. I guess if you squint your eyes while tilting your head you might see Sharpe, maybe, getting there, but that's quite a stretch at this point, especially after summer league. There are no other candidates on the roster

The funny thing about your post is that, other than LeBron, none of the guys you mentioned were seen as transcendent their first year. Of course it’s waaaaay too soon to be earmarking Scoot and Sharpe for the Hall of Fame. But it’s also way too soon to say they don’t have a decent shot to be that caliber of player.

 

[BankTeller]

I think Scoot, Shae, and ____ form our next big 3.

DA is already good enough that maybe Scoot, Shae and DA can compete early.

If we land high enough to draft Sarr and Scoot, Shae, and DA fail, then maybe Scoot, Shae, and Sarr are the big 3.

Or maybe even before that happens, Ant or Grant bring back someone like Murphy and Scoot, Shae, and Murphy are the big 3.

Maybe of all of those things happened and DA turns out to still be a stud, we’ll have a big 5. At this point, we just need to acquire the best young talents possible to spread out through Scoot and Shae’s Blazers tenure. We are fortunate to already have the future in place with two teenagers and a stash of picks, with vets that can guarantee even more picks.

For the next 3 years, Scoot and Shae will have a chance to compete with Ant, Grant and DA all ready-to-compete players.

As Scoot and Shae enter their rookie extensions, they will have the ‘24 1st round pick, whoever comes back for Ant or Grant (probably will be entering their prime as well), and possibly a re-signed DA to compete with.

Barring a significant trade, Scoot and Shae will have a ton of young (possibly lotto) talents coming as they are in their late 20s.

There are a ton of possibilities of who our big 3 can be, all that matters is we have 2 of the 3 already that fit together. We still don’t know how any of the pieces in Detroit, Orlando, and Houston will fit.

 

[BoomChakaLaka]

Ayton / Simons / Scoot

Sharpe, over the course of the season, will be added to the group, forming the “Big 4”

everyone is sleeping on Ant!

 

[PtldPlatypus]

everyone is sleeping on Ant!

Like Ant does on defense?

 

[wizenheimer]

The funny thing about your post is that, other than LeBron, none of the guys you mentioned were seen as transcendent their first year. Of course it’s waaaaay too soon to be earmarking Scoot and Sharpe for the Hall of Fame. But it’s also way too soon to say they don’t have a decent shot to be that caliber of player.

please, define "decent shot" so I know what that means. Is less than 10% a decent chance? 5%?

if you go back to 2012, Dame's draft, there have been 168 players taken in the lottery; 360 players taken in the first round. 720 players drafted overall. Lebron was drafted 20 years ago. If you're talking top-15 players, on average, there is probably less around 1 per draft. That the Blazers landed two in consecutive drafts seems like a real stretch of imagination

I agree that the first year doesn't reveal a lot, ususally. It did for Lebron. Not for the others. Jokic didn't really get to elite till his 5th or 6th season; kind of the same for Curry & Giannis. So if Scoot and/or Sharpe get to that level, it probably won't be for 4-6 years

 

[THE HCP]

Added an Ant choice for those who may be so inclined.

Well considering he will be our number option this season and leading scorer, that kinda makes sense.

 

[e_blazer]

please, define "decent shot" so I know what that means. Is less than 10% a decent chance? 5%?

if you go back to 2012, Dame's draft, there have been 168 players taken in the lottery; 360 players taken in the first round. 720 players drafted overall. Lebron was drafted 20 years ago. If you're talking top-15 players, on average, there is probably less around 1 per draft. That the Blazers landed two in consecutive drafts seems like a real stretch of imagination

I agree that the first year doesn't reveal a lot, ususally. It did for Lebron. Not for the others. Jokic didn't really get to elite till his 5th or 6th season; kind of the same for Curry & Giannis. So if Scoot and/or Sharpe get to that level, it probably won't be for 4-6 years

I find it odd that you don’t recognize that there’s a pretty good chance Scoot is special given that Curry and other peers, as well as draft experts, have said that they believe he is. That said, it’s kind of funny that I’m getting blowback on it given that leading up to the draft I said I wasn’t sure how well his game would translate against top NBA defenses. Still, I recognize that a lot of people with more knowledge than I have say he’s special. Sharpe is a living highlight reel and didn’t really get a chance to fully show himself last season until the plug was pulled and the tank unleashed. He won me over with the way he was able to elevate his game even when defenses were keying on him. In no way am I saying that they are certain to achieve all-star level, but they are pretty unlikely to be busts. The purpose of my poll is to take the temperature of the forum as to how much work Cronin has yet to do.

 

[e_blazer]

Well considering he will be our number option this season and leading scorer, that kinda makes sense.

That’s likely true for this season. My question relates to 3-4 years down the road. Will Ant still be the top scorer and, if so, will it be for the Blazers or the team they’ve traded him to?

 

[wizenheimer]

I find it odd that you don’t recognize that there’s a pretty good chance Scoot is special given that Curry and other peers, as well as draft experts, have said that they believe he is.

wut?

I said: "I don't see anybody on the Blazer roster elevating to top-15 unless Scoot is the next Derrick Rose"

so. I WAS allowing for the possibility that Scoot was special and might really pop. Or maybe he'll be the next Ja Morant; I'd think Morant is probably a top-15 talent...with a bottom-15 brain. I even allowed for the chance that Sharpe will be special. That both get there? yes, I'm a little skeptical. That's a damn tall mountain to climb

 

[e_blazer]

wut?

I said: "I don't see anybody on the Blazer roster elevating to top-15 unless Scoot is the next Derrick Rose"

so. I WAS allowing for the possibility that Scoot was special and might really pop. Or maybe he'll be the next Ja Morant; I'd think Morant is probably a top-15 talent...with a bottom-15 brain. I even allowed for the chance that Sharpe will be special. That both get there? yes, I'm a little skeptical. That's a damn tall mountain to climb

I’m not completely disagreeing with you. Just a bit more optimistic. Frankly, what other choice is there? If you think it’s not likely to do it in a reasonable time period via draft, and given Portland’s history with free agents, we may as well get comfortable with mediocre.

 

[wizenheimer]

I’m not completely disagreeing with you. Just a bit more optimistic. Frankly, what other choice is there? If you think it’s not likely to do it in a reasonable time period via draft, and given Portland’s history with free agents, we may as well get comfortable with mediocre.

that's all fair and I guess it seems like I'm being a contrarian in the face of major wave of optimism around here about the young guys, the trades, the future based upon the young guys and trades. I'm actually hopeful when it comes to Scoot & Sharpe; I can see how Ayton can elevate his game. But I'm inclined to wait a while and see this team perform for at least a half season or more before projecting superstars or a Big-3

 

[handiman]

if you go back to 2012, Dame's draft, there have been 168 players taken in the lottery; 360 players taken in the first round. 720 players drafted overall. Lebron was drafted 20 years ago. If you're talking top-15 players, on average, there is probably less around 1 per draft. That the Blazers landed two in consecutive drafts seems like a real stretch of imagination

OKC landed three future MVPs in three consecutive drafts. Unlikely, sure, but a stretch of the imagination? This ultra negativity kick you're on post-Dame is going to get old pretty quick.

 

[e_blazer]

OKC landed three future MVPs in three consecutive drafts. Unlikely, sure, but a stretch of the imagination? This ultra negativity kick you're on post-Dame is going to get old pretty quick.

The Warriors did okay with Curry (2009), Klay (2011), and Draymond (2012). They blew it with Udoh in 2010, but nobody is perfect.

 

[blazerfan11]

unless you have a transcendent player like Jokic or Lebron or Giannis or Curry, you really need to have two top-15 players to rank as a Big-3; at least for a Big-3 on a contender and not a pretender. I don't see anybody on the Blazer roster elevating to a top-15 unless Scoot is the next Derrick Rose. I guess if you squint your eyes while tilting your head you might see Sharpe, maybe, getting there, but that's quite a stretch at this point, especially after summer league. There are no other candidates on the roster

Scoot certainly could be the next Derrick Rose.

 

[wizenheimer]

OKC landed three future MVPs in three consecutive drafts. Unlikely, sure, but a stretch of the imagination? This ultra negativity kick you're on post-Dame is going to get old pretty quick.

being a little skeptical that both Scoot and Sharpe will become top-15 players in the NBA is "ultra negativity"? Being skeptical that Portland not only has a Big-3 now, but a Big-3 that will be good enough to make the Blazers contenders is "ultra-negative"? When Portland has had a contender for 24 years?

I've said several times I'm hopeful about both players, even though I've only seen about 20 minutes of Scoot in one game, in summer league. I'm even a bit hopeful about Ayton, with some reservations. But I guess that's not spewing enough unbridled optimism for some of you

I just looked, in the wins predictions thread, out of about 17-18 predictions, 7 were lower than mine and 3 others were the same. I guess I have some company in the ultra-negative clubhouse.

 

[wizenheimer]

Scoot certainly could be the next Derrick Rose.

going by his highlight reel, Rose does seem to be a good stylistic comp; that's why I mentioned him. I sure hope Scoot hits that mark, even though I'm an ultra-negative hater

 

[handiman]

The Warriors did okay with Curry (2009), Klay (2011), and Draymond (2012). They blew it with Udoh in 2010, but nobody is perfect.

Brown/Tatum in consecutive years wasn't too bad, either.

 

[e_blazer]

unless you have a transcendent player like Jokic or Lebron or Giannis or Curry, you really need to have two top-15 players to rank as a Big-3; at least for a Big-3 on a contender and not a pretender. I don't see anybody on the Blazer roster elevating to a top-15 unless Scoot is the next Derrick Rose. I guess if you squint your eyes while tilting your head you might see Sharpe, maybe, getting there, but that's quite a stretch at this point, especially after summer league. There are no other candidates on the roster

I got to thinking about the part of your post where you say that without a transcendent player you need at least 2 top 15 players to have a true “big 3” that can contend. Are there any teams out there that are constructed that way? Maybe the Lakers if you consider LBJ to be post-transcendent and Davis to be still top-15. Boston? I don’t think Brown is top-15. Same with the Heat. Jimmy’s probably still top-15, but Bam’s more like top-25 to 30.

Looking at past Blazers contenders:

Walton probably was transcendental that championship year (in more ways than one).

Clyde, Terry and Buck- Clyde was top-15, but Terry and Buck were more top-30.

Sheed, Sabonis, Pippen, Smith - Sheed was top-15, the rest were a committee of slightly past-prime stars.

I guess I would say that there are probably more ways to construct a big-3 and still compete than the 1 transcendent or two top-15 models. Although, I would certainly be thrilled if the Blazers grew into either of those.

 

[wizenheimer]

I got to thinking about the part of your post where you say that without a transcendent player you need at least 2 top 15 players to have a true “big 3” that can contend. Are there any teams out there that are constructed that way? Maybe the Lakers if you consider LBJ to be post-transcendent and Davis to be still top-15. Boston? I don’t think Brown is top-15. Same with the Heat. Jimmy’s probably still top-15, but Bam’s more like top-25 to 30.

Looking at past Blazers contenders:

Walton probably was transcendental that championship year (in more ways than one).

Clyde, Terry and Buck- Clyde was top-15, but Terry and Buck were more top-30.

Sheed, Sabonis, Pippen, Smith - Sheed was top-15, the rest were a committee of slightly past-prime stars.

I guess I would say that there are probably more ways to construct a big-3 and still compete than the 1 transcendent or two top-15 models. Although, I would certainly be thrilled if the Blazers grew into either of those.

transcendent was probably too hyperbolic a word. Maybe Top-5 would have been a little better; or MVP level

and sure, there could be another template that might work in an exceptional year. Again though, when you look at past champions over the last 40-50 years, the templates for just about all champions have been that MVP level player with excellent support, or two top-15 players with excellent support. The only exception I see is the 2004 Pistons team. But that team would be nearly impossible to replicate under the newer CBA's