Big Food vs. Big Insurance

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ABM

Happily Married In Music City, USA!
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FWIW...

By MICHAEL POLLAN
Berkeley, Calif.

To listen to President Obama’s speech on Wednesday night, or to just about anyone else in the health care debate, you would think that the biggest problem with health care in America is the system itself — perverse incentives, inefficiencies, unnecessary tests and procedures, lack of competition, and greed.

No one disputes that the $2.3 trillion we devote to the health care industry is often spent unwisely, but the fact that the United States spends twice as much per person as most European countries on health care can be substantially explained, as a study released last month says, by our being fatter. Even the most efficient health care system that the administration could hope to devise would still confront a rising tide of chronic disease linked to diet.

That’s why our success in bringing health care costs under control ultimately depends on whether Washington can summon the political will to take on and reform a second, even more powerful industry: the food industry.

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, three-quarters of health care spending now goes to treat “preventable chronic diseases.” Not all of these diseases are linked to diet — there’s smoking, for instance — but many, if not most, of them are.

We’re spending $147 billion to treat obesity, $116 billion to treat diabetes, and hundreds of billions more to treat cardiovascular disease and the many types of cancer that have been linked to the so-called Western diet. One recent study estimated that 30 percent of the increase in health care spending over the past 20 years could be attributed to the soaring rate of obesity, a condition that now accounts for nearly a tenth of all spending on health care.

The American way of eating has become the elephant in the room in the debate over health care. The president has made a few notable allusions to it, and, by planting her vegetable garden on the South Lawn, Michelle Obama has tried to focus our attention on it. Just last month, Mr. Obama talked about putting a farmers’ market in front of the White House, and building new distribution networks to connect local farmers to public schools so that student lunches might offer more fresh produce and fewer Tater Tots. He’s even floated the idea of taxing soda.

But so far, food system reform has not figured in the national conversation about health care reform. And so the government is poised to go on encouraging America’s fast-food diet with its farm policies even as it takes on added responsibilities for covering the medical costs of that diet. To put it more bluntly, the government is putting itself in the uncomfortable position of subsidizing both the costs of treating Type 2 diabetes and the consumption of high-fructose corn syrup.

Why the disconnect? Probably because reforming the food system is politically even more difficult than reforming the health care system. At least in the health care battle, the administration can count some powerful corporate interests on its side — like the large segment of the Fortune 500 that has concluded the current system is unsustainable.

That is hardly the case when it comes to challenging agribusiness. Cheap food is going to be popular as long as the social and environmental costs of that food are charged to the future. There’s lots of money to be made selling fast food and then treating the diseases that fast food causes. One of the leading products of the American food industry has become patients for the American health care industry.

The market for prescription drugs and medical devices to manage Type 2 diabetes, which the Centers for Disease Control estimates will afflict one in three Americans born after 2000, is one of the brighter spots in the American economy. As things stand, the health care industry finds it more profitable to treat chronic diseases than to prevent them. There’s more money in amputating the limbs of diabetics than in counseling them on diet and exercise.

As for the insurers, you would think preventing chronic diseases would be good business, but, at least under the current rules, it’s much better business simply to keep patients at risk for chronic disease out of your pool of customers, whether through lifetime caps on coverage or rules against pre-existing conditions or by figuring out ways to toss patients overboard when they become ill.

But these rules may well be about to change — and, when it comes to reforming the American diet and food system, that step alone could be a game changer. Even under the weaker versions of health care reform now on offer, health insurers would be required to take everyone at the same rates, provide a standard level of coverage and keep people on their rolls regardless of their health. Terms like “pre-existing conditions” and “underwriting” would vanish from the health insurance rulebook — and, when they do, the relationship between the health insurance industry and the food industry will undergo a sea change.

The moment these new rules take effect, health insurance companies will promptly discover they have a powerful interest in reducing rates of obesity and chronic diseases linked to diet. A patient with Type 2 diabetes incurs additional health care costs of more than $6,600 a year; over a lifetime, that can come to more than $400,000. Insurers will quickly figure out that every case of Type 2 diabetes they can prevent adds $400,000 to their bottom line. Suddenly, every can of soda or Happy Meal or chicken nugget on a school lunch menu will look like a threat to future profits.

When health insurers can no longer evade much of the cost of treating the collateral damage of the American diet, the movement to reform the food system — everything from farm policy to food marketing and school lunches — will acquire a powerful and wealthy ally, something it hasn’t really ever had before.

AGRIBUSINESS dominates the agriculture committees of Congress, and has swatted away most efforts at reform. But what happens when the health insurance industry realizes that our system of farm subsidies makes junk food cheap, and fresh produce dear, and thus contributes to obesity and Type 2 diabetes? It will promptly get involved in the fight over the farm bill — which is to say, the industry will begin buying seats on those agriculture committees and demanding that the next bill be written with the interests of the public health more firmly in mind.

In the same way much of the health insurance industry threw its weight behind the campaign against smoking, we can expect it to support, and perhaps even help pay for, public education efforts like New York City’sbold new ad campaign against drinking soda. At the moment, a federal campaign to discourage the consumption of sweetened soft drinks is a political nonstarter, but few things could do more to slow the rise of Type 2 diabetes among adolescents than to reduce their soda consumption, which represents 15 percent of their caloric intake.

That’s why it’s easy to imagine the industry throwing its weight behind a soda tax. School lunch reform would become its cause, too, and in time the industry would come to see that the development of regional food systems, which make fresh produce more available and reduce dependence on heavily processed food from far away, could help prevent chronic disease and reduce their costs.

Recently a team of designers from M.I.T. and Columbia was asked by the foundation of the insurer UnitedHealthcare to develop an innovative systems approach to tackling childhood obesity in America. Their conclusion surprised the designers as much as their sponsor: they determined that promoting the concept of a “foodshed” — a diversified, regional food economy — could be the key to improving the American diet.

All of which suggests that passing a health care reform bill, no matter how ambitious, is only the first step in solving our health care crisis. To keep from bankrupting ourselves, we will then have to get to work on improving our health — which means going to work on the American way of eating.

But even if we get a health care bill that does little more than require insurers to cover everyone on the same basis, it could put us on that course.
For it will force the industry, and the government, to take a good hard look at the elephant in the room and galvanize a movement to slim it down.

Michael Pollan, a contributing writer for The Times Magazine and a professor of journalism at the University of California, Berkeley, is the author of “In Defense of Food: An Eater’s Manifesto.”
 
BTW, I wonder if any of you have heard about that ultra-fat guy Canzano is seeking (public) help for?
 
There isn't a food on this planet that causes obesity. It has to do with portion control. Oh, and government shouldn't have a damn thing to do with this problem. If someone chooses to be fat, then they should pay higher premiums.
 
Why is it the Insurance industry's job to make sure people take care of themselves? Why doesnt anyone take personal responsibility for the fact that they smoke and are fat!?! I just dont understand this mindset that it is someone else's responsibility to make decisions for me.
 
The problem is people are growing up without knowing the actual dangers of eating fast food every day and drinking soda like it's water. I know it seems that people have to "choose" to be fat, but with many people, it comes down to ignorance. They weren't raised to know the difference between real food and processed food, they just know one is cheaper and tastes better.

Of course it's not the government's job or the insurance industry's job to make sure we eat right, but I think something needs to be done for less privileged and less informed who don't know any better.
 
The problem is people are growing up without knowing the actual dangers of eating fast food every day and drinking soda like it's water. I know it seems that people have to "choose" to be fat, but with many people, it comes down to ignorance. They weren't raised to know the difference between real food and processed food, they just know one is cheaper and tastes better.

Of course it's not the government's job or the insurance industry's job to make sure we eat right, but I think something needs to be done for less privileged and less informed who don't know any better.

There is also the issue of a lot of restaurants serving 2-3 times the normal portion size of foods in their meal. As you said ignorance and not being educated is an issue, and I would call it an avalanche effect.

If you're raising a kid and you yourself were uneducated growing up about food, portion sizes, calories, carbs, and the different kind of fats you're probably going to pass that on your kids unless someone (an educated friend or a doctor) points it out and educates you.

So maybe you feed your kids some fast food meals, or restaurant meals, that come in bigger sizes. So as the kid grows up on these things, even if for just a short period, then their stomach is expanding and needs more to fill it up.

A kid is going to want food if they're is still hungry, and it's going to be extremely hard to get them to change their diet especially with how food is marketed in the world today. It'll take a concentrated effort to slowly change their diet and shrink their portion sizes without having them freak out.

Then you have to also consider that you cannot watch your kid all the time, you don't know what or how much they're eating at school, or even at a friend's house.
 
There is also the issue of a lot of restaurants serving 2-3 times the normal portion size of foods in their meal. As you said ignorance and not being educated is an issue, and I would call it an avalanche effect.

If you're raising a kid and you yourself were uneducated growing up about food, portion sizes, calories, carbs, and the different kind of fats you're probably going to pass that on your kids unless someone (an educated friend or a doctor) points it out and educates you.

So maybe you feed your kids some fast food meals, or restaurant meals, that come in bigger sizes. So as the kid grows up on these things, even if for just a short period, then their stomach is expanding and needs more to fill it up.

A kid is going to want food if they're is still hungry, and it's going to be extremely hard to get them to change their diet especially with how food is marketed in the world today. It'll take a concentrated effort to slowly change their diet and shrink their portion sizes without having them freak out.

Then you have to also consider that you cannot watch your kid all the time, you don't know what or how much they're eating at school, or even at a friend's house.


Right, this was a better way of saying what I was trying to say.

Another thought on the personal freedom, it's your choice, thing: Even when people know what's good and bad for them, they still choose the bad choice. This is in part because of what you touched on-- how food is marketed. If the average person watches 8 hours of TV a day how many commercials do they see? Advertisers use very effective psychological techniques to get you to crave whatever it is they're selling. When an already uninformed person sees nothing but bright and flashy commercials for fast food or microwave meals, it just seems unfair.
 
Right, this was a better way of saying what I was trying to say.

Another thought on the personal freedom, it's your choice, thing: Even when people know what's good and bad for them, they still choose the bad choice. This is in part because of what you touched on-- how food is marketed. If the average person watches 8 hours of TV a day how many commercials do they see? Advertisers use very effective psychological techniques to get you to crave whatever it is they're selling. When an already uninformed person sees nothing but bright and flashy commercials for fast food or microwave meals, it just seems unfair.

But isn't it their right as an American to make poor choices? The important part of making bad choices is that they pay the price for doing so in higher health insurance premiums.
 
But isn't it their right as an American to make poor choices? The important part of making bad choices is that they pay the price for doing so in higher health insurance premiums.

Well of course it's their right. All I'm doing is pointing out that the degree in which people do not know how to be healthy is staggering. When one generation doesn't know how to be healthy, they raise the next generation who doesn't know how to be healthy. Then they are bombarded with ads that encourage them not to be healthy, reinforcing what they were raised with. Doesn't that seem unfair?

Why does this issue boil down to health insurance premiums? And what about people who don't have health insurance? What do they pay?
 
But isn't it their right as an American to make poor choices? The important part of making bad choices is that they pay the price for doing so in higher health insurance premiums.

No they don't. Premiums aren't assigned on an individual basis, at least not in a typical employer-based plan.

More accurately, their coworkers pay the cost of their bad choices.

So I say, fie on your "freedom to make bad choices" (in this case).

barfo
 
No they don't. Premiums aren't assigned on an individual basis, at least not in a typical employer-based plan.

More accurately, their coworkers pay the cost of their bad choices.

So I say, fie on your "freedom to make bad choices" (in this case).

barfo

No shit, Sherlock. I was stating the way it should be, not the way it is.
 
No shit, Sherlock. I was stating the way it should be, not the way it is.

Ok. So do you agree that until that happens, they shouldn't have the freedom to make those bad choices and cost other people money?

barfo
 
Ok. So do you agree that until that happens, they shouldn't have the freedom to make those bad choices and cost other people money?

barfo

I do not. It's a flawed system, but I choose freedom.
 
I do not. It's a flawed system, but I choose freedom.

Well, either way is freedom. In the one case, you are free to be unhealthy. In the other case, you are free to spend your money on what you want. Can't have both.

barfo
 
ABM, if you're going to intentionally 'stir the pot', then get you tired *** back here are participate. Nothing worse than a cowardly poster. This is your thread, man.
 
I partially agree with Maxiep.

But what about who suffer from other maladies not related to eating too much, drinking booze, doing drugs... should we punish them? What about offices with a lot of your women who will be having babies?... There's a lot of controversy aver that class as well.

To me, insurance is one big melting pot- or should be.
 
Well, either way is freedom. In the one case, you are free to be unhealthy. In the other case, you are free to spend your money on what you want. Can't have both.

barfo


Why should I have to pay the same car insurance premiums that other people do? I have never had so much as a fender bender or any type of claim. If I get in a collision with someone else I can repair their car to professional standards.

Unfortunately that is the way insurance works. If you have a claim the insurance will pay more than you will through your premiums.

Fast food and junk is bad for you. However, where there used to be butter or some other grease there is now partially hydrogenated soybean oil. Where there was sugar there some new chemical that is cheaper and probably causes butt cancer.

Junkfood was always bad for you, the big companies have made it worse so they can profit.

If you buy frozen dinner with a picture of a piece of chicken and cheese on the box, what you are really getting is a chemical compound that a scientist can barely understand.
 
Why should I have to pay the same car insurance premiums that other people do? I have never had so much as a fender bender or any type of claim. If I get in a collision with someone else I can repair their car to professional standards.

Unfortunately that is the way insurance works. If you have a claim the insurance will pay more than you will through your premiums.

Fast food and junk is bad for you. However, where there used to be butter or some other grease there is now partially hydrogenated soybean oil. Where there was sugar there some new chemical that is cheaper and probably causes butt cancer.

Junkfood was always bad for you, the big companies have made it worse so they can profit.

If you buy frozen dinner with a picture of a piece of chicken and cheese on the box, what you are really getting is a chemical compound that a scientist can barely understand.

The reason is that health insurance companies offer a policy to an entire company. Auto insuance is individual. If health insurance was purchased strictly by individuals, things would be different.
 
The reason is that health insurance companies offer a policy to an entire company. Auto insuance is individual. If health insurance was purchased strictly by individuals, things would be different.


My car insurance company doesn't charge me differently except that they base it on easily found driving records. They charge me more based on the city I live in as the risk is higher in Vegas.

My employer buys insurance for 1-150 people. That seems like a small enough sample that the rest of them can pay for the few fatties and smokers. We could do genetic tests to see who is more likely to have breast cancer.
 
My employer buys insurance for 1-150 people. That seems like a small enough sample that the rest of them can pay for the few fatties and smokers. We could do genetic tests to see who is more likely to have breast cancer.

But that only gives a propensity for potential health problems. How far do we extend that? Do we raise rates for people with cancer in their family? Or heart diseases in their parents? Once you start down that road, it's hard to stop.
 
Well, either way is freedom. In the one case, you are free to be unhealthy. In the other case, you are free to spend your money on what you want. Can't have both.

barfo

I could have it both ways if we dropped the idiotic link between employment and health insurance.
 
I could have it both ways if we dropped the idiotic link between employment and health insurance.

Well, sure. But that would be a radical change. Think how many Hitler mustaches would have to be painted on Obama if he proposed that.

barfo
 
Well, sure. But that would be a radical change. Think how many Hitler mustaches would have to be painted on Obama if he proposed that.

barfo

Why? It's a good idea. Let people have all the say so in what coverage they buy. Just like an auto policy. It's a great idea.
 
Why? It's a good idea. Let people have all the say so in what coverage they buy. Just like an auto policy. It's a great idea.

I didn't say it wasn't a good idea. I said (well, implied) that it was impossible to pass politically, because the same people who are complaining about very incremental reforms now would have a cow. Regardless of whether it is a good idea or not.

barfo
 
I didn't say it wasn't a good idea. I said (well, implied) that it was impossible to pass politically, because the same people who are complaining about very incremental reforms now would have a cow. Regardless of whether it is a good idea or not.

barfo

I get that. But I'd love to get to choose what plan to have, what deductible, ....
 
I didn't say it wasn't a good idea. I said (well, implied) that it was impossible to pass politically, because the same people who are complaining about very incremental reforms now would have a cow. Regardless of whether it is a good idea or not.

barfo

Wanna bet? People oppose this ridiculous health care takeover because a government that hasn't proven it can run anything is asking us to trust them with 16% of our economy. They don't oppose it because they're afraid of change. Hell, people voted for "Change", even if they didn't know the kind of "Change" they'd be voting for.

People generally respond well to having more control over their lives. Make individual health insurance tax deductable, allow people to have a tax free health savings account, increase people's pay by the amount employers were paying for health insurance (which puts their pay at exactly the same level as before), allow people to purchase across state lines and allow them to find EXACTLY the level of health insurance they want. You have a winner a majority of the American people can get behind.
 
Photo from history.ucsb.edu/faculty/...

BushHitlerShitAsshole.jpg


Some pictures from earthhopenetwork.com

Bush-hitler-blair-mussolini.jpg


Mein_Kampf_Dubya.gif


bush_hitler_red.jpg


Awe heck, you can see the 2M+ google image results for yourself:

http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&source=hp&q=bush hitler&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi
 
Wanna bet? People oppose this ridiculous health care takeover because a government that hasn't proven it can run anything is asking us to trust them with 16% of our economy. They don't oppose it because they're afraid of change. Hell, people voted for "Change", even if they didn't know the kind of "Change" they'd be voting for.

People generally respond well to having more control over their lives. Make individual health insurance tax deductable, allow people to have a tax free health savings account, increase people's pay by the amount employers were paying for health insurance (which puts their pay at exactly the same level as before), allow people to purchase across state lines and allow them to find EXACTLY the level of health insurance they want. You have a winner a majority of the American people can get behind.

I disagree that you could get the majority behind that, but I guess we'll never know for sure.

barfo
 
Wrong thread. You were complaining about less offensive pictures of Obama.
 

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