Bishop Eddie long.....The "MONSTER"

[MickZagger]

In my worldview, if straight people have sex out of marriage they ARE as sinful as those who practice homosexual sex. And those who don't honor their parents. And those who lie. Etc, etc...we've been over this. You know these things. You're either choosing to not comprehend in order to bait, or not paying attention. I can't help either one, sorry. It could be because of your rationale from the Mary Thread: Your bias and hate for those you disagree with colors your stand on issues. I choose to live by one worldview, and apply it to my life and situations consistently.

Edit: http://sportstwo.com/threads/161586-So-what-would-they-say-to-Mary/page4 Post 51 for your quote, post 97 for mine

Thats fine and dandy. But, just because your a church going fella doesn't make your "worldview" the end-all be-all. This is part of my stink with organized religion.

 

[BrianFromWA]

it is for me. And unless the laws change, you have to accept that. Just as I have to accept that someone may disagree and want to fornicate or commit adultery or neglect their parents--all things that the government says is ok but my faith says is wrong. Persecution on both sides is forbidden, but you can see in this thread how, depending on your biases, one could flip-flop and think they're still right to vent hate. My worldview is based on a few absolutes, and a consistent application of those whether or not it's convenient for me or in my best interest or if I can understand it or not.

 

[MARIS61]

OK, everyone is innocent until proven guilty, but...

But this man says he is "David against Goliath". Excuse me? A millionaire, with bodyguards ahd driver, 25,000 members of his church, friends in high places, media access against 4 scared kids with nothing, knowing their entire life histories will be put on display in order to prove them "nuts and sluts". Sounds like he has David and Goliath mixed up.

I used to say nothing is 100% certain except the physical laws of the universe. I now say nothing is 100% certain except the physical laws of the universe and some professional male "hate is a family value" homophobe being caught with another male. (So far never heard of a female professional "hate is a family value" homophobe being caught with another woman. Interesting.)

I fail to see any difference between the sexes when it comes to child abuse, hetero or homo. I've unfortunately known victims from both sexes. Women just get excused from prosecution much more often.

 

[MARIS61]

Tragedy, suffering ,anguish and betrayal happen every day. I'm saddened by it, every day. Part of that sadness is that sinners bring it on themselves by their actions and the consequences of those actions, and don't know where to go for forgiveness.

In my worldview, if straight people have sex out of marriage they ARE as sinful as those who practice homosexual sex. And those who don't honor their parents. And those who lie. Etc, etc...we've been over this. You know these things. You're either choosing to not comprehend in order to bait, or not paying attention. I can't help either one, sorry. It could be because of your rationale from the Mary Thread: Your bias and hate for those you disagree with colors your stand on issues. I choose to live by one worldview, and apply it to my life and situations consistently.

Why is the young man tormented? Could it be because of a poor decision he made? I sympathize with consequences of bad decisions, I've gone through many. I'm not saying I'm any better than this man. In fact, since you bring up my "high and holy Mount Olympus", I'll quote myself from the earlier thread...maybe this time it will be read and/or understood:


If the pastor did use his office to coerce these men into sex they didn't want to have, he will be at the mercy of societal justice. And you already know where I stand on criminals getting punished for breaking laws. If he didn't, and just had consensual sex with the men, my worldview states that he has still sinned because he's committed adultery and had homosexual sex. But that's not for me or you to judge, because that's between him and his God. For you to speak out against it seems pretty presumptuous and hypocritical, since you consistently champion

Edit: http://sportstwo.com/threads/161586-So-what-would-they-say-to-Mary/page4 Post 51 for your quote, post 97 for mine

First and foremost, he abused CHILDREN, not men.

Second, I have to roll my eyes a little every time some "believer" refers to his wearing of blinders through life as a "worldview".

Until you face the real world without a mythical super-being as your crutch, you ain't seen nothin' yet.

 

[MARIS61]

it is for me. And unless the laws change, you have to accept that. Just as I have to accept that someone may disagree and want to fornicate or commit adultery or neglect their parents--all things that the government says is ok but my faith says is wrong. Persecution on both sides is forbidden, but you can see in this thread how, depending on your biases, one could flip-flop and think they're still right to vent hate. My worldview is based on a few absolutes, and a consistent application of those whether or not it's convenient for me or in my best interest or if I can understand it or not.

There are numerous laws on the books forbidding neglect of the elderly, and you have a twisted interpretation of the word fornication.

One man's religion is another man's haven for child abuse.

 

[MARIS61]

Part of the outrage against him is that he's actively anti-homosexual.

From wikipedia**:
CNN has said "Long frequently denounces homosexual behavior."[13] Long has ministered “homosexual cure” programs to recruit gays and lesbians for what he called “Sexual Reorientation” conferences and his church offers an ongoing “Out of the Wilderness” ministry to help convert homosexuals into heterosexuals.[14] In 2004, Long led a march with Bernice King to the grave of her father, Martin Luther King, Jr. The march was a protest against same-sex marriage and in support of a national constitutional amendment to protect marriage "between one man and one woman."[15] A 2007 article in the Southern Poverty Law Center's magazine called him "one of the most virulently homophobic black leaders in the religiously based anti-gay movement."

**Not the finest source I know, but you can follow the links from there.

The fact that he's a flaming hypocrite only proves he's religious.

 

[ABM]

The fact that he's a flaming hypocrite only proves he's religious.

Well, for the record, the Pharisees were "religious". Heh, Jesus had a few other choice descriptions for them, as well.

 

[BrianFromWA]

There are numerous laws on the books forbidding neglect of the elderly, and you have a twisted interpretation of the word fornication.

One man's religion is another man's haven for child abuse.

Who said anything about elderly?
What, pray tell, is my view of fornication? And what's yours?

 

[MARIS61]

Who said anything about elderly?
What, pray tell, is my view of fornication? And what's yours?

You said parents. Most of ours are elderly. Otherwise I have no idea what you were referring to.

FORNICATION: "Voluntary sexual intercourse between unmarried persons. In the Bible -a. Adultery, b. Idolatry."

I assume that's your def.

Since it's a made-up bible word invented to judge other people's personal behavior, I don't consider it of any value, don't define or use it personally.

 

[MARIS61]

Here's a definition I use that the Bible uses also:

Hypocrite: One who claims to follow god's word but deliberately kills people.

Tap-dance your way around that one.

 

[BrianFromWA]

Bible doesn't use that one, Maris. You seem to be wrong (again), which happens frequently when you delve into the areas of politics, religion, science, the military and Spanish guards.

Your contention that you have "no idea what I'm referring to" is absolutely correct and in keeping with your online persona. Yet instead of asking a question, you make a ill-conceived and attacking assertion. It's hard to waste time in an attempt to teach someone who doesn't want to understand.

 

[BrianFromWA]

Maris, I'll put it bluntly. What is your problem with anyone having consensual sex with anyone else?

 

[ABM]

Maris, I'll put it bluntly. What is your problem with anyone having consensual sex with anyone else?

God has a problem with fornication - of any kind. That much I know for sure.

 

[BrianFromWA]

You and I believe that. Maris doesn't want anything to do with God, so I'm trying to figure out what Maris' issue is.

 

[BLAZER PROPHET]

I've come into that too late, but I applaud BrianFromWA for clear thinking and maintaining a consistent point of view.

To me, homosexuality is deviant behavior from a Biblical view.

 

[MickZagger]

I've come into that too late, but I applaud BrianFromWA for clear thinking and maintaining a consistent point of view.

To me, homosexuality is deviant behavior from a Biblical view.

Sure, if you want to let a book rule your life.

 

[agoo]

What about all the other stuff in the Bible? Are you going with all of that too? The stuff on fabrics, crops, pork, shellfish, and such?

Or are you just picking the one that allows you to hate homosexuals because they make you feel icky?

 

[BrianFromWA]

Please, PLEASE, point out a single sentence in this thread by someone who says that Christians can hate homosexuals, biblically based or not?

Those who don't believe in the Bible are the ones who are condemning a man for having consensual sex with other men, and who has been shown not to have broken any laws of the US. When asked why they do so, personifications of felines and attempts to channel Noah Webster occur instead.

No one seems to want to answer why bias against someone for their faith allows you to be bigoted, judgmental and hypocritical.

BTW, your questions about fabrics, shellfish, cheeseburgers, etc. have already been answered.

 

[BrianFromWA]

Why would one feel "icky" about a sexual practice of someone?

 

[The Sebastian Express]

Oh for the love of Jesus Christ on a motherfucking pogo stick. The problem they have is that he rails against homosexuality, is a hypocrite, and some feel he has been preying on these young boys since a young age to lead to this moment. Please note the use of young, boys, and again young, then the words lead to.

It really isn't that hard to process.

 

[MickZagger]

Oh for the love of Jesus Christ on a motherfucking pogo stick. The problem they have is that he rails against homosexuality, is a hypocrite, and some feel he has been preying on these young boys since a young age to lead to this moment. Please note the use of young, boys, and again young, then the words lead to.

It really isn't that hard to process.

Repped

 

[BrianFromWA]

Seems that you still can't. In the AJC article even other defense lawyers who practice in the realm of "coersion" complaints say that they were above the age of consent, actually did consent to the alleged sex, and that the alleged acts weren't coercive.

Please note the words ABOVE THE AGE OF CONSENT, ACTUALLY DID CONSENT, and then get back to me. Sucks when two play this game, right?

Hypocrisy is not a illegal offense, or many in this thread would be in jail.

What's hard to process is that those who are biggest into homosexual rights and "what I do in my bedroom with a consensual partner isn't anyone else's business" viewpoint are having problems. And it's only because of what you wrote about: hate against a man for his religious beliefs. Which seems to be against various parts of our legal system here in the US.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I'll quote it again:

Proving that (ed: Coercion) in the Long case will be difficult, because the plaintiffs were of legal age of consent, and don't assert they were forced to submit, made drunk or drugged, Parks said. Consequently, there must be proof that Long had so much control over his accusers they had no power to resist, the attorney said.

Three defendants charge that Long used his mega-church position to build a strong personal bond with them, by taking them on trips and giving them lavish gifts. They said the church leader convinced them that sex with him was part of a healthy spiritual life. They also have claimed that Long violated his legal responsibility as a spiritual adviser. Long adamantly denies the allegations.

 

[BrianFromWA]

then again, is it tough to see that there could be ulterior motives, here?

Carlson said the defense likely will stress that several years have passed between the alleged events and the lawsuit filings, that the plaintiffs simply are looking for money. The defense next could raise credibility issues, since one of the plaintiffs was arrested in June in connection with a burglary at the church. The defense also could stress Long's history of community and church service, the UGA educator said.

 

[MickZagger]

Seems that you still can't. In the AJC article even other defense lawyers who practice in the realm of "coersion" complaints say that they were above the age of consent, actually did consent to the alleged sex, and that the alleged acts weren't coercive.

Please note the words ABOVE THE AGE OF CONSENT, ACTUALLY DID CONSENT, and then get back to me. Sucks when two play this game, right?

Hypocrisy is not a illegal offense, or many in this thread would be in jail.

What's hard to process is that those who are biggest into homosexual rights and "what I do in my bedroom with a consensual partner isn't anyone else's business" viewpoint are having problems. And it's only because of what you wrote about: hate against a man for his religious beliefs. Which seems to be against various parts of our legal system here in the US.

Hypocrisy isn't illegal, but its a sin and he's going to hell for it. Well, atleast according to most people with bible blinders on.

Yah, I'm sure many around here will be in jail for it... Since were the ones that have to live up to the almighty book.

You might need to look up the word hypocrit again.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I don't get your entire first line. We agree that hypocrisy isn't illegal, and so any hypocrisy between Long's speeches and actions isn't illegal.
You're correct that hypocrisy is a sin. What is that to you, though, as someone who couldn't care less about the Bible? And who are you to judge anyone according to a religious text?
One of the fundamental tenets of Christianity that seems to be dropped by every single person on here attempting to bash Christians is the "going to hell" aspect. agoo wants to say that I'm going to hell for eating shellfish--crandc for eating a cheeseburger--, you for Long and his alleged hypocrisy. Yet as has been explained almost ad nauseum to you (were you in a position to actually listen to counterpoints) Christians understand a) that they're not perfect, and b) if they repent of those sins and accept that Jesus has already taken all of the punishment substitutionally for all the sins they've done and will do they will not go to hell (eternal separation from God).

If you don't get this, great. If you don't believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster, great. If you don't think that the Bible is true, great. You live according to the codes written by the government of whatever country you live in and that code alone. Great. All I've done in this is point out the hate-based hypocrisy shown by the more progressive members of this board toward a man whose sole problem seems to be alleged consensual homosexual intercourse outside of marriage. None of which is illegal according to the laws of the US that you live under. And if the alleged acts AREN'T true? I won't even go there.

 

[MARIS61]

Bible doesn't use that one, Maris.

Thou shalt not kill.

It's been awhile since I read the bible, but I do remember that being in there as a commandment.

You've hired yourself out as at least a "potential" paid assassin for the government, and yet claim to be a follower of god.

I'm calling you a hypocrite, and you're running from the charge because you have no defense.

 

[BrianFromWA]

Man alive, is the Old King James Translation the only one that gets any love from those who wish to disparage Christianity? The correct translation is "murder", not "kill". Maybe someone who understands Hebrew can tell you the difference between "ratsah" and "harag". Or you could just trust me when I say you're wrong and I'm right. But I doubt that'll happen.

I chosen to serve my country and my God as did Joseph, Caleb, Gideon, Samson, etc. have throughout the ages. And yes, I claim to be a follower of God and His Son, Jesus...if by "being a follower" you mean that I recognize that I have done things (and will do things) against the will of God, deserve eternal separation and punishment from Him because of it (the penalty for one single sin is death and eternal separation), and realize that my only chance of salvation is asking forgiveness for those things and to accept that Jesus has already taken any punishment I deserve for me.

Now that I've taken you to school, are you willing to answer the question I specifically addressed to you?

 

[MARIS61]

You and I believe that. Maris doesn't want anything to do with God, so I'm trying to figure out what Maris' issue is.

Abuse of position of authority for personal gain, and grooming children to become sex slaves.

 

[MARIS61]

Man alive, is the Old King James Translation the only one that gets any love from those who wish to disparage Christianity? The correct translation is "murder", not "kill".QUOTE]

Every line in the Big Idiot's Book of Loopholes & Excuses has a "correct" translation to fit any interpretation possible.

You have taken money on a promise to be ready to kill complete strangers at a moment's notice, no questions asked. Sounds like murder to me.

I say that's not at all what Jesus would do.

In fact, it makes you less Christain than I.