Blazers make another pitch for Amare?

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Batum is really good but you don't hang onto him when you can upgrade as significantly as Deng would be. We improve both of our weaker starting positions with guys who fit into our timeframe. I don't know how you pass that up.
 
Batum has showed more, as a rookie, than Prince his rookie year. He has the defensive instincts and length to become an elite defender. I would not want to trade him. I really don't think we'll have to considering the package we apparently already have on the table.
 
Fez said:
Batum has showed more, as a rookie, than Prince his rookie year. He has the defensive instincts and length to become an elite defender. I would not want to trade him. I really don't think we'll have to considering the package we apparently already have on the table.
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Exactly.... pick up Amare for Bayless and table scraps, then move either Amare or LMA for something quality. I don't see why Batum should even be included in the discussion.
 
Natebishop3 said:
Exactly.... pick up Amare for Bayless and table scraps, then move either Amare or LMA for something quality. I don't see why Batum should even be included in the discussion.
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I'd rather Batum were in the conversation than Bayless, basically. I think Bayless can be an elite level player at a tough to fill position. I like Portland's chances of swinging a deal for a top young wing more than I do of finding a top young point guard, so I definitely view Batum as more expendable than Bayless.
 
Minstrel said:
I'd rather Batum were in the conversation than Bayless, basically. I think Bayless can be an elite level player at a tough to fill position. I like Portland's chances of swinging a deal for a top young wing more than I do of finding a top young point guard, so I definitely view Batum as more expendable than Bayless.
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Well ya, but it seems that the talks have centered on Bayless. He seems to be the sticking point for Phoenix, and I don't think the Blazers get Amare without dealing away Jerryd.
 
Minstrel said:
Within 24 or 48 hours (I forget which), you can trade the newly-acquired player as part of a package.
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I can't find any evidence for that in the Coon FAQ. He says:

Coon said:
85. When can't a player be traded? Can players be given "no-trade" clauses in their contracts?

[...]

In addition, teams cannot trade players under the following circumstances:

* For two months after receiving the player in trade or claiming him off waivers, if the player is being traded in combination with other players. However, the team is free to trade the player by himself (not packaged with other players) immediately. This restriction applies only to teams over the salary cap. (Also see question number 72 for a special case where players can be traded together in less than two months.)
[...]

There seems to be a lot of confusion about the first bullet item above. Many media reports mistakenly say that a player cannot be re-traded for two months under any circumstances, even by himself. This is not true -- Danny Manning's trade from Phoenix to Orlando, and soon thereafter to Milwaukee is one example of the correct application of this trade rule. Other media reports confuse the sign-and-trade rule with this one, claiming that the player can be re-traded within 48 hours or after 60 days, but not in between.
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Question #72 says:

Coon said:
The legal combining of exceptions sometimes creates the appearance of teams getting away with illegal trades. For example, as detailed in question number 85, when a team is over the cap and acquires a player in trade, they cannot re-trade that player in combination with other players for two months. Technically, however, this applies only to players traded together using the same exception (i.e., aggregated). For example, Orlando acquired Danny Manning from Phoenix (as part of a package for Penny Hardaway) on 8/5/99. They then traded Manning and Dale Ellis to Milwaukee on 8/19/99. This trade did not violate the two-month rule because Orlando technically traded the players separately -- Ellis completed an earlier, non-simultaneous trade. Therefore the trade was legal.
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barfo
 
My rubric for trading away young players usually boils down to, "How much do I fear them playing the Blazers two years down the line?" Bayless tops that list with Rudy and Batum closely behind.
 
Natebishop3 said:
Well ya, but it seems that the talks have centered on Bayless. He seems to be the sticking point for Phoenix, and I don't think the Blazers get Amare without dealing away Jerryd.
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*nod* If that's the case, so be it. Portland still wins on talent in a big way. But I'd even do Rudy + Batum, to avoid losing Bayless.
 
I don't see this one going down. Phoenix would have to go through Portland to get to the Finals, and Roy+Amare+ Oden/Aldridge + whatever they trade Oden/Aldridge for is too much damn talent.
 
I would first try to get Butler, Harris, Price, Granger etc but if we didn't make a trade it might not be that bad. Everyone is going to think I'm crazy but I would try playing all 3 Oden, LMA and Amare together. If that didn't work bring Oden off the bench and play Amare or LMA at center and bring oden in to replace one of them. I think the only problem would be where is Joel going to get time. I doubt it happens but even with Bayless being my favorte or second favorite Blazer I would do that trade and not look back as long as we don't include LMA.
 
barfo said:
I can't find any evidence for that in the Coon FAQ. He says:



Question #72 says:
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Hmm, okay. I had read that there was a window...I guess it's the incorrect media reports he mentions.
 
Денг Гордон said:
I don't see this one going down. Phoenix would have to go through Portland to get to the Finals, and Roy+Amare+ Oden/Aldridge + whatever they trade Oden/Aldridge for is too much damn talent.
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Phoenix is done thinking about going to the finals for quite some time I'd wager -- their youth movement is about to happen in full force.
 
Денг Гордон said:
I don't see this one going down. Phoenix would have to go through Portland to get to the Finals, and Roy+Amare+ Oden/Aldridge + whatever they trade Oden/Aldridge for is too much damn talent.
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Phoenix is so far from championship contention, I doubt that's a primary issue. I think creating a solid basis to rebuild from is their concern.
 
Денг Гордон said:
I don't see this one going down. Phoenix would have to go through Portland to get to the Finals, and Roy+Amare+ Oden/Aldridge + whatever they trade Oden/Aldridge for is too much damn talent.
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For Phoenix it's all about cap relief and prospects. Raef's contract is the most valuable expiring in the NBA. Unmatched value. And it's not even close. We can offer a better package than any team after Amare.
 
JFizzleRaider said:
Batum is really good but you don't hang onto him when you can upgrade as significantly as Deng would be. We improve both of our weaker starting positions with guys who fit into our timeframe. I don't know how you pass that up.
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I wouldn't trade Batum for Deng straight up.
 
Minstrel said:
Phoenix is so far from championship contention, I doubt that's a primary issue. I think creating a solid basis to rebuild from is their concern.
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Yeah, but the problem I see with this, is it would set Portland up to contend for a decade with that core. And not just contend, but be pretty dominant in doing it. And I'm sure Phoenix's rebuilding plan is to rebuild fast, and be in contention within the decade. They're obviously a team who goes for the championship rather than just being good.

I do think though, that we will see the money makers in the NBA get more and more loaded at the deadline. By that, I mean Cleveland, Chicago, Lakers, Blazers, and maybe the Spurs are going to look to stock up on talent while other teams are hurting from the recession. The Bulls beat guy on the Score said that the Bulls are planning on completely revamping the team at the deadline, and could make two, three, maybe four trades.

I think Portland will get something nice at the deadline using Raef's contract, just not Amare, at least for the Bayless package. I think if they offer Aldridge, they will lock up Amare. Rudy Fernandez might be enough to get Phoenix to trade within conference. The Bayless package just doesn't look like enough to get it done.
 
Fez said:
Deng is this generations Shareef Abdur-Rahim.
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Whatever that means.

Brandon Roy is this generation's Shareef Abdur-Rahim. Durant is. Granger is. You can make such vaguely negative claims about anyone.

Deng's game doesn't resemble Abdur-Rahim's at all. Not to mention, Abdur-Rahim was a tremendous player who played his prime on a team largely devoid of talent.
 
Minstrel said:
Hmm, okay. I had read that there was a window...I guess it's the incorrect media reports he mentions.
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I was gonna post the link to the FAQ, but barfo beat me to it.

There IS no window to package a guy within 24, 48, or any other number of hours. He needs to be part of a three-way day, traded by himself, or after two months after the trade happens.

Ed O.
 
And you think mediocre prospects like Tyrus Thomas and Jokim Noah can get it done? Phoenix would be the door mat of the NBA for many moons to come if they took that. But I'm pretty sure they aren't that stupid.
 
Minstrel said:
Whatever that means.

Brandon Roy is this generation's Shareef Abdur-Rahim. Durant is. Granger is. You can make such vaguely negative claims about anyone.

Deng's game doesn't resemble Abdur-Rahim's at all. Not to mention, Abdur-Rahim was a tremendous player who played his prime on a team largely devoid of talent.
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but Shareef is Shareef :devilwink:
 
Денг Гордон said:
The Bayless package just doesn't look like enough to get it done.
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I'm also skeptical that the Bayless package is enough. Then again, I really have no idea how much Phoenix wants cap relief. The rumoured Bulls offer (Thomas, Noah, Gooden, draft pick) looks extremely poor, also. So Phoenix may not have many choices if they're determined to get significant expiring deals.
 
The Bulls package is very poor. PHX would get an expiring but neither Tyrus or Noah are starters on a playoff team. Thomas, though having a good stretch of games, is still a 6'7" PF with no post game or jumper. He's a hustle player you'd bring off the bench.

Talent wise, Phx best bet is the Blazers.
 
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