Blazers Suck

[PapaG]

PapaG, I think you're way off on how Oden was tonight. (in a discussion, rather than insulting, way)

If you do the boxscore thing, it doesn't jump out as a great performance. But you're missing a huge part of the picture.

Forget "rebounds". I went back and counted "taps", since almost every time a shot went in the air OKC was sending 3 guys to the boards, two of which were blocking out Oden. This allowed Blazer guards to get a bunch of rebounds, but didn't help his box score. In addition, in the first half alone I counted 5 "tip-ups", where he tapped the ball on a missed shot but didn't come up with it (out of bounds, OKC got the tip, another Blazer got it, etc.).

He missed two shots today. One of them he was hacked from in front and behind, but no foul was called. I think he touched the ball 5 times in the first half...one 3-second call, 2 assists, 1 pass without assist (while being behind the 3pt line) and one foul against (no FTs). I don't know the usage rate on that, but it's not good.

And the "foul trouble" thing is bogus. He had 1 foul when he went out at the 6 minute point (trying to stay with a driving Durant going baseline on a busted switch). His last 2 fouls (30 sec. or so apart) were relatively cheap, and yet that caused Nate to sit him for the rest of the night. Maybe he was protecting Greg, since Haywood Workman et al were letting Greg get ambushed inside and not blowing the whistles.

The argument about "he's not open" is bogus as well. I counted twice today that Outlaw passed up passing to him when he was the only person in the key...wide open. Just didn't receive the ball. Sergio had a couple of times where he looked like he wanted to get it it, but didn't. Oden had more assists to guards today than guards had to him, which shouldn't happen unless he's getting triple-teamed. And why did we stop running the P&R.

I'm not saying Oden should be playing in the All-Star Game, but you're making it sound like he's Mark Madsen out there. He's not. He's being frozen out (innocently negligent or not) on offense and left out on an island on D b/c of switches and things. And yet, I can't remember the last time he fouled out (did he once in Jan?)

Nick Collison, Jeff Green, Joe Smith. Combined for 96 min at the PF/C spots. Joel and Oden? Combined for 30. LMA was having a good shooting night, and yet Roy missed more shots tonight than anyone else on the team took. I would say that once Oden gets consistent minutes and the ball passed to him on offense every once in a while, then you look more correct in you Oden assessments. I submit that if Kevin Durant had 3 shots tonight, he wouldn't have scored much more than Oden did.

I don't agree with most of this. He's not Mark Madsen; I've said I think he will be a very good to great player. My problem is that Oden was lost yet again on defense; that is nobody's fault but his own. As for the rebounding, that's an excuse that I don't buy. I saw him at times turn and retreat as a ball was in the air on offense, and he was consistenly out of rebounding position on defense.

I've praised Greg when he's shown fire and produces, but if you can honestly tell me over the past four games that you've seen consistent effort and production from him, please tell me the reasons for it.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I thought his effort in the first half was outstanding. Out-standing. I documented what he did on offense, and the work he was doing rebounding. If you didn't see that (or did, and didn't think he was working hard) then I don't know what else to say.

In the second half, he looked pretty down after the first foul, and you could see him deflate a bit running back down the court after he was hammered. When he was caught having to guard Durant AND Collison on the same play (that got him the second foul), well, he didn't have a chance.

And if Greg isn't interested, or taking up space, or boxing out, how does 6'3 Sergio get 6 boards? How does Roy get 9? Were they outleaping Collison, Green and Durant?

I think we're actually closer to agreeing on this than not...I'm not saying he performed great today, based on the team losing and his stat line. But I think it's quite unfair and incorrect to say that he wasn't consistently trying. Your part about "consistent production" is a fair one, and that one I've written a couple of posts on his production and consistency when taking 7 shots or more vs. when he doesn't get 7 shots. We generally shoot 85 or so times per game...we can't let our starting center get 8%?

As far as "not agreeing with most" of the previous posts, the 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and half of the 8th paragraph were facts and counting...what's not to agree with? Or were you just talking specifically about my Madsen comment?

 

[ehizzy3]

I thought his effort in the first half was outstanding. Out-standing. I documented what he did on offense, and the work he was doing rebounding. If you didn't see that (or did, and didn't think he was working hard) then I don't know what else to say.

In the second half, he looked pretty down after the first foul, and you could see him deflate a bit running back down the court after he was hammered. When he was caught having to guard Durant AND Collison on the same play (that got him the second foul), well, he didn't have a chance.

And if Greg isn't interested, or taking up space, or boxing out, how does 6'3 Sergio get 6 boards? How does Roy get 9? Were they outleaping Collison, Green and Durant?

I think we're actually closer to agreeing on this than not...I'm not saying he performed great today, based on the team losing and his stat line. But I think it's quite unfair and incorrect to say that he wasn't consistently trying. Your part about "consistent production" is a fair one, and that one I've written a couple of posts on his production and consistency when taking 7 shots or more vs. when he doesn't get 7 shots. We generally shoot 85 or so times per game...we can't let our starting center get 8%?

As far as "not agreeing with most" of the previous posts, the 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and half of the 8th paragraph were facts and counting...what's not to agree with? Or were you just talking specifically about my Madsen comment?

nice posts. oden is already a beast on the boards 40 games in. just cuz his box score doesnt say it. again odens value and impact is not in the box score at this point in his career.

 

[RayDavies]

Ugh, this game hurt because we could have had the guy that murdered us last night. I hate to say it, but... it hurts. I think Oden will continue to improve, but, as much as KD? It was an off night, even for Roy... Our shooting and Defense were terrible.

At any rate, I am still confident we will close the season well once Blake returns, get into the playoffs and keep improving next year. The Blazers do not suck- Blazer "fans" who suggest the team sucks, suck.

 

[STOMP]

I can't tolerate losing to a lottery team, no matter the excuse. Add to that we have somewhat of a rivarly and need to get some revenge for our Northern Neighbors in Seattle, we fell flat on our face to a bad team.

maybe you should drop following hoops and take up knitting? You'll eventually find other knitters who you can form calming real relationships with to replace the strong bonds you've formed with posters here and you won't be subject to these intolerable lows. We won't be subject to pathetic bait threads... it's a win - win

STOMP

 

[ucatchtrout]

You might read that kind of shit around these fickle forums. But, anybody with a semblance of knowledge about the NBA understands that coming back from microfracture surgery and relearning your body compared to a full year of playing is like apples and oranges. One game is a sure a great outlook when comparing draft picks when speaking about guys who are 21 and 22 years old respectively.

and you might read that Oden got only a couple shots and he only got a couple shots because the team didn't get him the fucking ball. THAT is a problem. Its a big fucking problem. As is Nates stupid defense.

 

[STOMP]

And if Greg isn't interested, or taking up space, or boxing out, how does 6'3 Sergio get 6 boards? How does Roy get 9? Were they outleaping Collison, Green and Durant?

because the Bigs (Greg included) are boxing the opponent's Bigs out and the guards clean up and/or the caroms outside the paint that result from long jumpers would be the main reasons. The Thunder are a perimeter team but this is true for every game where guards get a lot of boards.

STOMP

 

[hasoos]

I don't know how anybody expect Oden to succeed when he is set up for failure. Nothing going on the court right now is setting him up to succeed. He never gets the ball except up near the top of the key. Greg should never get the ball at the top of the key.

Several times I watched various players on the team launch an outside shot, and nobody (Greg, Lamarcus, or Pryzbilla) had any idea it was going up, nobody was even close to being ready to rebound for it. That is the type of shit that Damon Stoudemire used to do that pissed me off beyond all belief. The thing that totally blew me away was that one of the guys doing stuff like that was Brandon. The other has a lot of fans that wear shirts that say they love him. Do you love 1 for 6 too? Do you love long rebounds going for transition dunks that hit so hard they tear the rim off the net? Go love that a while.

 

[Uther TheGardener]

NAte's subbing STINKS!