Politics Can our Republican friends here please explain something...

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riverman said:
This one just let the Russians have the place....got it.
Click to expand...

The Russians built bases in the middle east for the first time in decades under Obama's watch. Just one of several times Obama got punked by Putin. Remember the infamous red line in the sand?

Meanwhile, we recently bombed and killed dozens of Russians in Syria.


Left wing think tank:
https://www.brookings.edu/blog/order-from-chaos/2018/03/05/dont-rehabilitate-obama-on-russia/

But not everything is relative; we should not slip into collective amnesia over the Obama administration’s weak and underwhelming response to Russian aggression.

...

Nevertheless, the president resisted calls from Congress, foreign policy experts, and his own cabinet to provide lethal weapons to Ukraine that would have raised the costs on Russia and helped Kyiv defend itself against Russian military incursion into the Donbas. As Obama told Jeffrey Goldberg, he viewed any deterrent moves by the United States as fundamentally not credible, because Russia’s interests clearly trumped our own; it was clear to him they would go to war much more readily that the United States ever would, and thus they had escalatory dominance. Doing more simply made no sense to Obama.

...

Has the Trump administration been tougher on Russia than Obama, as the president claims? Trump’s own boasting feels like a stretch, especially given how he seems to have gone out of his way to both disparage NATO and praise Putin during the course of his first year in office. Still, many of his administration’s good policies have been obscured by the politics of the Mueller investigation and the incessant furor kicked up by the president’s tweets. As Tom Wright has noted, the Trump administration seems to pursue two policy tracks at the same time: the narrow nationalism of the president’s inflammatory rhetoric openly clashing with the seriousness of his administration’s official policy decisions.​

Who is the Manchurian Candidate, really?

Trump did provide arms to Ukraine. So much for him being soft on Russia, or in Putin's pocket.

Shocking that a president might have his own ideas about how to handle foreign affairs.

The bomb throwers might let this bit from Brookings, above, sink in.
 
Trump is Putin's puppet, indeed!

http://www.newsweek.com/russia-blames-obama-trump-failures-white-house-658468

BY TOM O'CONNOR ON 9/1/17 AT 11:58 AM

Russia announced Friday it plans to retaliate against the latest U.S. diplomatic attack that saw Moscow forced to shutter assets in three major U.S. cities.

Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov told students that the White House on Thursday had given Moscow only 48 hours to close down its consulate in San Francisco and two other buildings in New York and Washington. The U.S.’s move came in response to Russia’s decision to slash the number of U.S. diplomatic staff allowed in Moscow, a strike that itself followed Congress rolling out new sanctions against Russia earlier this month. Lavrov said Russia was preparing to react strongly to President Donald Trump’s administration, but blamed Trump’s predecessor for sabotaging bilateral relations in the first place.

“But I want to say that this whole story with [the two countries] exchanging tit-for-tat sanctions was not started by us. It was started by the Obama administration to undermine U.S.-Russia relations and to not allow [President Donald] Trump to advance constructive ideas or fulfil his pre-election pledges,” Lavrov said, according to Reuters.

...

In April, Trump ordered an airstrike on a Syrian military base after accusing Syrian President Bashar al-Assad of conducting a chemical weapons attack on civilians, something Assad and Putin denied. The incident led to a bitter fallout between the two and an escalation of aggressions between their respective allies abroad. As the White House and the Kremlin sought rapprochemen tlast month, Congress instituted new sanctions against Russia that were reluctantly signed into law by Trump, who said relations had reached an “all-time and very dangerous low.”
 
Denny Crane said:
The Russians built bases in the middle east for the first time in decades under Obama's watch. Just one of several times Obama got punked by Putin. Remember the infamous red line in the sand?

Meanwhile, we recently bombed and killed dozens of Russians in Syria.


Left wing think tank:
https://www.brookings.edu/blog/order-from-chaos/2018/03/05/dont-rehabilitate-obama-on-russia/

But not everything is relative; we should not slip into collective amnesia over the Obama administration’s weak and underwhelming response to Russian aggression.

...

Nevertheless, the president resisted calls from Congress, foreign policy experts, and his own cabinet to provide lethal weapons to Ukraine that would have raised the costs on Russia and helped Kyiv defend itself against Russian military incursion into the Donbas. As Obama told Jeffrey Goldberg, he viewed any deterrent moves by the United States as fundamentally not credible, because Russia’s interests clearly trumped our own; it was clear to him they would go to war much more readily that the United States ever would, and thus they had escalatory dominance. Doing more simply made no sense to Obama.

...

Has the Trump administration been tougher on Russia than Obama, as the president claims? Trump’s own boasting feels like a stretch, especially given how he seems to have gone out of his way to both disparage NATO and praise Putin during the course of his first year in office. Still, many of his administration’s good policies have been obscured by the politics of the Mueller investigation and the incessant furor kicked up by the president’s tweets. As Tom Wright has noted, the Trump administration seems to pursue two policy tracks at the same time: the narrow nationalism of the president’s inflammatory rhetoric openly clashing with the seriousness of his administration’s official policy decisions.​

Who is the Manchurian Candidate, really?

Trump did provide arms to Ukraine. So much for him being soft on Russia, or in Putin's pocket.

Shocking that a president might have his own ideas about how to handle foreign affairs.

The bomb throwers might let this bit from Brookings, above, sink in.
Click to expand...
Assad is your bad guy.....Obama wanted out of there...he was trying to bring the troops home ...as it is they've fired up the chemical gas attacks again since Trump took the job ....and Trump's claim ISIS is dead...well today they're attacking ISIS in Northern Iraq....what's changed? Obama said he wished he'd finished off Assad when he had the chance and he was wrong about that.....something Trump isn't capable of....
 
riverman said:
Assad is your bad guy.....Obama wanted out of there...he was trying to bring the troops home ...as it is they've fired up the chemical gas attacks again since Trump took the job again....and Trump's claim ISIS is dead...well today they're attacking ISIS in Northern Iraq....what's changed? Obama said he wished he'd finished off Assad when he had the chance and he was wrong about that.....something Trump isn't capable of....
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You're defending the indefensible, and you're all over the place/rambling.

Trump had a huge part in defeating ISIS in Syria and Iraq. Russia did, too. It is a good thing.

Instead of having to fight on two fronts (Assad and ISIS), we're now in a position to deal with Assad. At least we're not drawn into their civil war and at least ISIS was defeated.

http://www.post-gazette.com/news/wo...Syria-s-Assad-government/stories/201803050207

Trump’s White House considers new military action against Syria’s Assad government
 
Denny Crane said:
You're defending the indefensible, and you're all over the place/rambling.
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I'm not defending anybody .....other than one president admits his mistakes and the other doesn't.....it's not indefensible to make these comparisons....ISIS is still kickin'....on the run but still kickin'....as to being all over the place rambling....pot kettle black.....I'm sure you'll find a news feed to prop up some anti Obama vitriol.....if you think Trump is a champion of foreign diplomacy well........you have to ramble all over the place to tow that line....if Trump gassed the population with chemical weapons.....Trump would be the bad guy....Assad is the bad guy....you never acknowledge this simple fact...for some reason need it to be a democratic conspiracy...Obama promised to bring home the troops....he tried to do that....Trump promised to build a wall and make Mexico pay for it....he's trying to do that....I cheered for Obama's promise...you cheer for Trump's .....it is what it is
 
There are a lot of policy ideas of Trump that I cannot stand and do not support. My judgements are based upon the policies themselves, not on whether I perceive his skin to be orange.

Obama was going around saying ISIS would be around for many years to come and the battles in Iraq and Syria would take many years. Trump did end those within months. ISIS controls no land at all anymore. All the land ceded to them when Obama surrendered is not in their hands anymore. The issues facing the nations who fought ISIS are now what to do with the captured ISIS fighters, many of whom came from the very nations that fought ISIS.

So far, I feel like Trump has been more dove than hawk when it comes to military might. He talks like a Libertarian about building a stronger military to defend the homeland. He reluctantly keeps our troops overseas, but at least he's listening to the generals about those things. He hasn't started wars in countries he didn't inherit hot wars in (like Obama did in Libya and a number of other places).

And much to your horror, his difference in approach does seem to have some positive effect. Don't be fooled by the main stream news - they call him a warmonger and fear nuclear armageddon (but gave Obama a pass).

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/06/south-north-korea-to-hold-summit-in-april-south-korea-says.html
 
Denny Crane said:
Obama was going around saying ISIS would be around for many years to come
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Cheney said that too.....they are in several African countries today....we just don't pay much attention to Somalia
 
Denny Crane said:
his difference in approach does seem to have some positive effect.
Click to expand...

Denny Crane said:
He hasn't started wars in countries he didn't inherit hot wars in (like Obama did in Libya and a number of other places).
Click to expand...

Denny Crane said:
He talks like a Libertarian about building a stronger military to defend the homeland.
Click to expand...

These are astounding observations coming from a man, that had not a good word to say about the Candidate Trump.
I could gloat!
But I would rather admire the astuteness.
 
Denny Crane said:
So he should just say "fuck you" to you and do what his voters want.

Doesn't seem like the madman you'd make him out to be, after all.

Anyhow, you didn't answer the question.
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His voters are in the minority and getting smaller by the day. He needs to listen to ALL the people and stop calling the media, the Democrats or anyone who speaks out against his plans as the enemy. That is seriously a sick outlook.
 
Denny Crane said:
There are a lot of policy ideas of Trump that I cannot stand and do not support. My judgements are based upon the policies themselves, not on whether I perceive his skin to be orange.
Click to expand...

I can respect this. Even though he is very vain, I try to not let that sway my opinion of him. I base my opinion on actions, not words. I'm not necessarily impressed, to be fair.

Obama was going around saying ISIS would be around for many years to come and the battles in Iraq and Syria would take many years. Trump did end those within months. ISIS controls no land at all anymore. All the land ceded to them when Obama surrendered is not in their hands anymore. The issues facing the nations who fought ISIS are now what to do with the captured ISIS fighters, many of whom came from the very nations that fought ISIS.
Click to expand...

I don't think any of us (RC2 forum members/general public) know that ISIS is gone.

So far, I feel like Trump has been more dove than hawk when it comes to military might. He talks like a Libertarian about building a stronger military to defend the homeland. He reluctantly keeps our troops overseas, but at least he's listening to the generals about those things. He hasn't started wars in countries he didn't inherit hot wars in (like Obama did in Libya and a number of other places).
Click to expand...

I think this paragraph speaks to your stance on Trump more than anything you've said in the past. I truly appreciate your opinion, but it seems that you are trying to fit a square peg in a round hole here. Trump isn't a Libertarian more then Bernie Sanders is a communist. The "War on ISIS" wasn't restricted to borders. This makes it unique in comparison to most other modern wars, from my (admittedly limited) knowledge. There were attacks on numerous countries on the behalf of this ideology. Idk, I have issues with drone attacks and the number of innocent civilians that were murdered under Obama's watch too, but those same ISIS (ISIL, Deash.. whatever the F you'd like to call them) are now just putting their guns down and hiding back into that 'innocent civilian' population. Not sure that is defeating the "enemy".

And much to your horror, his difference in approach does seem to have some positive effect. Don't be fooled by the main stream news - they call him a warmonger and fear nuclear armageddon (but gave Obama a pass).

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/06/south-north-korea-to-hold-summit-in-april-south-korea-says.html
Click to expand...

Squirrel!
 
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...y-said-thats-not-true/?utm_term=.8d6f960aac36

Polls show 'no one' cares about the Russia investigation, White House press secretary said. That's not true.

White House press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders said President Trump will not address the ongoing investigation into collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia because no Americans care about the issue.

At Monday's White House briefing, Sanders said: “We spend more time on that than we do any other topic despite the fact that time and time again, poll after poll says that frankly no one cares about this issue, and it's certainly not the thing that keeps people up at night.”

Sanders did not cite a poll showing that “no one” cares about the Russia investigation. It is highly unlikely that a reliable poll exists with results showing that zero people care about the Russia investigation.

It was also surprising, if not inconsistent, to see Sanders point to polls as proof that Americans don't care about the Russia probe despite how often Trump surrogates dismiss polls when they do not paint the Trump White House in a favorable light.​

What is of much use now is a recent Washington Post-ABC poll showing just how interested the American people are in the Russia investigation.

The poll found that nearly half — 49 percent — of Americans believe Trump tried to interfere with the Russia investigation in a way that amounts to obstruction of justice. And about a quarter — 26 percent — of Americans believe there is “solid evidence” supporting their belief.​

Here's the least favorable poll for Trump:

http://news.gallup.com/poll/1675/most-important-problem.aspx



upload_2018-3-7_6-47-13.png

...

Way down on the list:

upload_2018-3-7_6-48-12.png

Dissatisfaction with government is about the same as it was during the Obama administration.

We know what's not true, WaPost. You aren't.
 
CupWizier said:
His voters are in the minority and getting smaller by the day. He needs to listen to ALL the people and stop calling the media, the Democrats or anyone who speaks out against his plans as the enemy. That is seriously a sick outlook.
Click to expand...

Right. And the blue wall was going to save Clinton's presidential election, too.
 
Shaboid said:
I think this paragraph speaks to your stance on Trump more than anything you've said in the past. I truly appreciate your opinion, but it seems that you are trying to fit a square peg in a round hole here. Trump isn't a Libertarian more then Bernie Sanders is a communist. The "War on ISIS" wasn't restricted to borders. This makes it unique in comparison to most other modern wars, from my (admittedly limited) knowledge. There were attacks on numerous countries on the behalf of this ideology. Idk, I have issues with drone attacks and the number of innocent civilians that were murdered under Obama's watch too, but those same ISIS (ISIL, Deash.. whatever the F you'd like to call them) are now just putting their guns down and hiding back into that 'innocent civilian' population. Not sure that is defeating the "enemy".



Squirrel!
Click to expand...

I don't at all think Trump is a Libertarian, or even a libertarian (small l). Just that some things he does will make Libertarians happy. Like reducing government, cutting taxes, reducing regulations, etc.

Many things he does, especially on immigration/building wall, do not make us Libertarians happy. Or his proposed massive budget deficits (tax cuts are OK, but increased spending instead of cutting spending is foolish).

Classical Conservatism (e.g. Goldwater/Reagan/Burke) is a 3 legged stool, so to speak. One is Libertarianism, one is traditional values, and one is anti-communism. What passes for conservatism today is warmongering, bible thumping, and intolerance toward non European immigrants (count me out). Yet there still is an actual Liberty Caucus in the republican party - something you won't find in the democratic one.

It's not surprising to see some of that Libertarian philosophy in Trump's "conservative" ideology.

It is quite clear that our troops remain in Afghanistan only because he had to be talked into keeping troops there.
 
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