Clinton goes to N. Korea, gets propoganda-gathering journalists released

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I'm happy to have the hostages home, even if some people will claim we traded arms for hostages.
 
BTOWN_HUSTLA said:
Yes, they were just shooting a documentary news piece on North Korea, on the North Korean border..but didn't even go into North Korea..the decided to do it in China...right......why not do it in China town then? Much cheaper and they would have the asian people as back drop.
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Because the news piece was about human trafficking on the North Korean/Chinese border. That's right, it may surprise you to learn that they share a border.

There are conflicting reports on whether or not they ever actually crossed the Tumen river.

Wikipedia said:
However, other sources such as Reporters Without Borders, echoing reporting by South Korean television station YTN, claim that North Korean border guards crossed the Tumen to the Chinese side to detain Ling and Lee.[9]
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_imprisonment_of_American_journalists_by_North_Korea


And compromise or no compromise, North Korea is using this as an opportunity to garner sympathy for their own gains. They are using Clinton as propoganda, otherwise they wouldn't pose with him and take those photos.
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I have to agree with this.
 
all that matters is that they were copped. perhaps they are trumped up charges, only the reporters (who will not say if they were I bet) and North Korea would know for sure.
 
wonder if Current TV made a deal NOT to produce any anti-North Korean segments in exchange?
 
BTOWN_HUSTLA said:
he did. i wonder if this was done with taxpayer dollars though? It was an "unofficial" visit....who paid for it....a letter from Obama was given to our apparant new friend, Kim Jong Il?
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You guys take the cake. 2 Americans are held hostage by a nut in North Korea, the Obama administration and Bill Clinton get them out safely, you you still find something to bitch about.

UnAmerican, that's what you are.
 
I don't see that Obama had anything to do with it.

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D99SSVU80&show_article=1

Wealthy Hollywood producer paid for NKorea flight

WASHINGTON (AP) - A wealthy Hollywood producer paid for the flight that carried former President Bill Clinton and two American journalists home from North Korea, a California businessman confirmed Wednesday. Stephen Bing, a close Clinton friend and longtime Democratic fundraiser, is the plane's owner, said Marc Foulkrod of Burbank, Calif., chairman of Avjet Corp., the company that manages the aircraft.

Foulkrod said the Federal Aviation Administration "at the highest levels" cleared the flight plan, which required an exception because U.S. planes are not allowed to fly into North Korea.

The effort to set up and clear the flight only started four to five days ago, he said, adding that officials in Washington worked through the weekend to get the necessary diplomatic and flight exemptions.

Heir to a New York real estate fortune, Bing raised at least $100,000 for Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton's 2008 presidential campaign, in addition to giving the maximum $2,300. He also donated at least $10 million to Bill Clinton's presidential library and charitable foundation.

Bing was a multimillion-dollar donor to pro-Democratic groups that ran ads against Republican President George W. Bush in the 2004 campaign. He also donated at least $5 million to pay for a new Democratic National Committee headquarters in 2002, when Clinton loyalist Terry McAuliffe headed the party.

Bing contributed $40.1 million of the total $45.7 million raised to support a failed 2006 California ballot initiative that sought to tax companies drilling for oil in California. Bing's contributions were funneled through his Shangri-La Entertainment company.

Bing produced "Shine A Light," a 2008 Martin Scorcese documentary of a Rolling Stones performance filmed at Bill Clinton's 60th birthday party in New York. He also produced the film "Beowulf" (2007) and financed the film "The Polar Express" (2004).

Calls to Shangri-la Entertainment and Bing's publicist were not immediately returned.

Foulkrod said the costs for the flight have not yet been tallied but would be significant.

"It was a very unique set of organizational efforts that resulted in a level of cooperation that was unprecedented," Foulkrod told The Associated Press.

The plane flew from Burbank to Elmendorf Air Force Base, Alaska, then to Misawa Air Base in Japan_ refueling in both places_ and then went on to North Korea, said Foulkrod. On the way back it had enough fuel to skip Elmendorf, flying from Misawa directly to Burbank.
 
Stevenson said:
You guys take the cake. 2 Americans are held hostage by a nut in North Korea, the Obama administration and Bill Clinton get them out safely, you you still find something to bitch about.

UnAmerican, that's what you are.
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again, held hostage how?

they illegally entered North Korea and were tried in the courts. find any credible evidence that they were "held hostage".
 
Denny Crane said:
I don't see that Obama had anything to do with it.
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Well of course they did. The whole thing was worked out diplomatically well before Clinton left, you know that. He didn't just show up and save the day.
 
Great idea. Let's arrest all those who come within sight of the US border, "try" them, and sentence them to 12 years in a place that makes Gitmo look like the Ritz Carlton. That little act of sovereignty should curb our illegal immigration problem a bit, though Gitmo would swell to roughly the size of New York City. But hey! They're daring to tread in a dangerous area. And as such, shouldn't have the protection of any entity, government or otherwise.

Just as an aside, wasn't it Perot that launched an attack to free the Iran hostages in 80 with his own money?
 
Stevenson said:
Well of course they did. The whole thing was worked out diplomatically well before Clinton left, you know that. He didn't just show up and save the day.
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I've seen nothing that indicates the administration had anything to do with it. If they did, it gives fodder to the "arms for hostages" type accusations I alluded to in my first post. If they didn't, it's not much different than Ross Perot dealing with terrorists who took some of his employees hostage.

The most I've seen is along the lines of Clinton's plane refueled at an air base in Alaska. I've not seen that the US even gave him a plane on which to fly there and back. Seems like if the administration were involved that Clinton wouldn't have had to borrow a plane.

I meant what I wrote in my first post. I'm pleased the hostages are home, and I find it shameful that people claim there's some sort of evil deal that made it possible.

Hostages. Taken against their will. Charges against them trumped up. Held for some sort of ransom.
 
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Denny Crane said:
I'm happy to have the hostages home, even if some people will claim we traded arms for hostages.
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i dont think anyone is suggesting that other than right wing lunatics. and obama did all the leg work according to most news outlets like cnn- president bill clinton of course was the courageous dude who brought the two americans back home. kudos to diplomacy!!!
 
deception said:
i dont think anyone is suggesting that other than right wing lunatics. and obama did all the leg work according to most news outlets like cnn- president bill clinton of course was the courageous dude who brought the two americans back home. kudos to diplomacy!!!
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I still see no indication Obama did all the legwork, even on CNN. I expect the administration had to be asked to approve Clinton going over there.

But they'll try to take credit for it, no doubt.

Meanwhile, diplomacy has kept North Korea from launching a number of rockets on the 4th of July. No it didn't. Diplomacy kept those journalists from being taken in the first place. No it didn't.
 
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Denny Crane said:
I still see no indication Obama did all the legwork, even on CNN. I expect the administration had to be asked to approve Clinton going over there.

But they'll try to take credit for it, no doubt.

Meanwhile, diplomacy has kept North Korea from launching a number of rockets on the 4th of July. No it didn't. Diplomacy kept those journalists from being taken in the first place. No it didn't.
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john bolton, bush's ambassador to the un has publicly said that the administration shouldnt have done this. bolton doesnt believe in diplomacy with hostile nations and he certainly has a blatant disregard for these americans. u guys have had 8 years of these mad men in charge. now sanity has been restored and u guys might have a chance at legitimate engagement. im not a diplomatic scholar but im almost certain that if u get china on board in the much lauded six party talks and they wield meaningful sanctions in deterrence- lil kim will give up everything and his mother. north korea as u might know is propped by china.
 
Denny Crane said:
I still see no indication Obama did all the legwork, even on CNN.
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u need to watch cnn more often. their white house correspondent said 99% of the negotiations were complete when clinton arrived in north korea. obama is a superhero!!!
 
BLAZER PROPHET said:
True, but he also forced thru the greatest tax increase in the history of known civilization that cost hundreds of thousands of people their living and was impeached for lies to Congress- were it not for deeply partisan politics he would have been removed from office. Every member of his cabinet was indicted by a grand jury except one wbho was censured by a democratic congress for refusing to investigate a securities scam his wife was involved in. Also, tens of millions of dollars were given to friends for bogus 'research'... He also oversaw the greatest swing in congress in US history outside of the civil war and was generally inept in foreign affairs (there's a pun there somewhere...).
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good grief... deeply partisan politics are the only reason those charges were pursued in the first place. Partisan politics completely fueled that ridiculous waste of the President's and Congress's time and taxpayers money. Trying to spin that as BC's fault... wacky

STOMP
 
Denny Crane said:
I still see no indication Obama did all the legwork, even on CNN. I expect the administration had to be asked to approve Clinton going over there..
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"The release also amounted to a successful diplomatic foray for the former president, who traveled as an unofficial envoy, with approval and coordination from the administration."

- The Associated Press, yesterday

Again, he didn't just show up and save the day. I read a report that the administration has been negotiating for months, of course, that they wanted to send Al Gore, N Korea wanted Clinton, etc. It was the Obama admin.
 
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Stevenson said:
"The release also amounted to a successful diplomatic foray for the former president, who traveled as an unofficial envoy, with approval and coordination from the administration."

- The Associated Press, yesterday

Again, he didn't just show up and save the day. I read a report that the administration has been negotiating for months, of course, that they wanted to send Al Gore, N Korea wanted Clinton, etc. It was the Obama admin.
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From what I've seen, it's a lot of people working behind the scenes to get the reporters freed, all of them outside the West Wing. John Kerry being one of them.

Coordination? What do you think that means? To me it means as little as "sure, you can refuel at an air force base." Or something along the lines of "you may go on Tuesday."
 
Denny Crane said:
From what I've seen, it's a lot of people working behind the scenes to get the reporters freed, all of them outside the West Wing. John Kerry being one of them.

Coordination? What do you think that means? To me it means as little as "sure, you can refuel at an air force base." Or something along the lines of "you may go on Tuesday."
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John Kerry? I wonder if he asked for the release to be re-created so he could be filmed "in action".
 
MARIS61 said:
We "fetched" Jessica Lynch didn't we?

At least they weren't murdering anyone like she was.
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You know, I missed the definition of murdering being changed to "a supply clerk sitting in the back of a convoy which turned the wrong way, being ambushed, wounded and captured." Sure glad that you're here to help point those things out.
 
BrianFromWA said:
You know, I missed the definition of murdering being changed to "a supply clerk sitting in the back of a convoy which turned the wrong way, being ambushed, wounded and captured." Sure glad that you're here to help point those things out.
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Brian, I've learned not to take anything he says seriously.
 
Denny Crane said:
From what I've seen, it's a lot of people working behind the scenes to get the reporters freed, all of them outside the West Wing. John Kerry being one of them.

Coordination? What do you think that means? To me it means as little as "sure, you can refuel at an air force base." Or something along the lines of "you may go on Tuesday."
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Denny - it truly strikes me as odd, and surprisingly naive, that you would think that the State Department has not been working for months to get these high profile women released. I get that you don't like Obama, but it should not be that hard to give credit where credit is due.
 
BrianFromWA said:
You know, I missed the definition of murdering being changed to "a supply clerk sitting in the back of a convoy which turned the wrong way, being ambushed, wounded and captured." Sure glad that you're here to help point those things out.
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It has certainly cut down the number of murders in our cities, that's for sure.

barfo
 
Stevenson said:
Denny - it truly strikes me as odd, and surprisingly naive, that you would think that the State Department has not been working for months to get these high profile women released. I get that you don't like Obama, but it should not be that hard to give credit where credit is due.
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It has nothing to do with a perceived dislike of Obama. I actually do like him, but I don't think he's some sort of saviour. More like in over his head and learning the ropes.

I would take NKorea's launching of a number of missiles on July 4 as a sign that any diplomacy wasn't happening all along.

I also wouldn't put it past any administration to try and take some of the credit here. And I don't think Kerry or Gore or other democrats who were involved would deny the administration their claim to the credit.

I do think Clinton played this for all it's worth though.
 
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