OT Coronavirus: America in chaos, News and Updates. One million Americans dead and counting

[Orion Bailey]

You stated earlier that your mom is in a nursing home. And that nursing home has tested positive for the virus.

Now suppose a resident has a heart attack.

Before the virus paramedics would rush in, remove the patient, and take them to the hospital.

Now, with the virus, paramedics have to take much more precautions, establish a safe zone around the patient, take steps to protect the first responders and the patient. And then transport the patient to a small sized hospital that hopefully isn't at capacity and has the beds available.

With heart attacks, minutes matter. In this situation the minutes from heart attack to hospital treatment are going to increase, and increase a lot. So the virus is having a direct effect on other medical problems.

Again, I get all that. But unless I missed some other posts, he never mentioned anything about services. He mentioned why the panic in the stores and in the market. Why don't car accidents impact the market? Why dont we all flood the stores for extra safety gear for our cars?

From what I read, he is not questioning the isolations and shut downs, he is questioning why people are panicking in the market, in the stores and on the streets.

This panicking is also hurting the availability of items for the public. So again unless I missed some posts, which is very likely, I get what he is saying.

 

[Orion Bailey]

The panic, in my opinion is from the media fear mongering.

 

[hoopsjock]

That article is from Feb 5th. Many of those deaths will turn to be the virus since we weren't testing for it then. I believe so far only the state of Washington has tested some of the dead and that was only the people who died in the Kirkland nursing home.

Also, when there is a serious health threat like an unknown virus people are going to contact their doctors more frequently than if it was just a normal flu season.

When I'm sick I usually just take some Nyquil and try to power through it. Normally I'd wait until I was sick and getting worse for a week or so before actually going to the doctor. Right now I'd email my doctor immediately if I was sick.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Car accidents are definitely bad but when someone dies in a car accident it's over. The next car accident is unrelated and has nothing to do with a car accident from weeks ago.

For the virus we're still in the early stages. You take drastic measures now so that this virus DOESN'T end up on that top-10 causes of death list. If you don't think it's important by the time it is near that list than it would already be too late.

Again, I get it. I get the measures. What I beleive T is asking and I second the question is why are these measure creating such a panic and chaos in individuals swarming stores and etc.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Again, I get all that. But unless I missed some other posts, he never mentioned anything about services. He mentioned why the panic in the stores and in the market. Why don't car accidents impact the market? Why dont we all flood the stores for extra safety gear for our cars?

From what I read, he is not questioning the isolations and shut downs, he is questioning why people are panicking in the market, in the stores and on the streets.

This panicking is also hurting the availability of items for the public. So again unless I missed some posts, which is very likely, I get what he is saying.

We continually take steps to make cars safer and the numbers show that they work.

 

[donkiez]

The panic, in my opinion is from the media fear mongering.

For once, the media fear mongering is justified.

 

[hoopsjock]

Again, I get it. I get the measures. What I beleive T is asking and I second the question is why are these measure creating such a panic and chaos in individuals swarming stores and etc.

Because people are idiots and selfish.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Again, I get it. I get the measures. What I beleive T is asking and I second the question is why are these measure creating such a panic and chaos in individuals swarming stores and etc.

Have you increased the number of meals eaten at home? My home and those of my family members have stopped eating fast food and take out. That has increased the amount of food used at home. We have shopped for that and increased the amount of food stored at home. Is the hoarding or responding to increased home demand?

 

[Lanny]

Are you sure? Seems when i get it a bunch of people around me get it as well.

Oh great, now my hay fever has made you get it as well. Sorry about that but that's what you get for hanging around me in this forum.
Don't ever meet me in person or soon you'll be requiring dialysis as well.

 

[BigGameDamian]

The panic, in my opinion is from the media fear mongering.

So you think this is all overblown?

 

[TBpup]

Again, it's not an either/or situation.

All of these other problems that you point out will continue.

What officials are trying to do is to lessen the impact of the virus so it doesn't overwhelm our hospitals and staff.

There are videos in this thread that shows the desperate situations in Italian hospitals.

That is starting to happen here.

You continually make posts saying that A is worse than B so response to B is not needed.

No, B is bad, very bad, but also B will make A worse. A + B is going to cause a lot of deaths in a short amount of time. We can help with the increase in both A and B by focusing on reducing B.

And again, nowhere is it mentioned it is an either/or situation. And NO WHERE have I made any post that says that A is worse than B so response to B is not needed. You are way better than that and I'm surprised that would even be suggested. From the beginning, I have suggested context and bigger picture as well as difference in reaction to now versus just as recent as H1N1.

As for hosptials, I just got an update from a Dr with number for C-19 patients.. They have 518 patients nationwide admitted for C-19. That is around 50 per state. Again, context. Not that it won't continue or numbers will go up, but context. That part didn't get answered. Instead, baseless or entirely incorrect statements about what was said.

Happy to have a discussion about real numbers and things that were actually said.

 

[Lanny]

Settle down. What do you think MERS stands for?

Middle Eastern Respiratory Syndrome

Why? Because that's where it originated.

Middle Eastern is not like saying Chinese. The first refers to a region and no particular country while the second refers specifically to a country. Apples and oranges, my friend.

 

[Lanny]

Because people are idiots and selfish.

I wouldn't be so quick to label all people as being like me.
Oh, and I'm also vain.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Have you increased the number of meals eaten at home? My home and those of my family members have stopped eating fast food and take out. That has increased the amount of food used at home. We have shopped for that and increased the amount of food stored at home. Is the hoarding or responding to increased home demand?

I've ordered more meals honestly, we've had food delivered a lot more because like I said most of the grocery stores don't have much. I don't know where @hoopsjock shops (he's close to me), but the Corntown Fred Meyers is basically empty, the Walmart is mostly empty, the winco in Hillsboro doesn't have much either from what my wife has said. - To be fair she's picky and that could be the problem I havent been there. - Either way our amount of having food delivered has gone way up.
I do have photo's she's sent though of aisles completely empty at all those stores.

 

[Orion Bailey]

For once, the media fear mongering is justified.

We shall have to disagree then. I thknk the last thing we shold be doing is instilling a panicky fear. This is absolutely the time to remain calm and use common sense. Common sense is not buying a cart of toilet paper.

Have you increased the number of meals eaten at home? My home and those of my family members have stopped eating fast food and take out. That has increased the amount of food used at home. We have shopped for that and increased the amount of food stored at home. Is the hoarding or responding to increased home demand?

Okay, now you are sidetracking the panic. Buying some extra meat and eggs is not panicking. Buying a cart full of TP is.

Im pretty sure T is referring to those doing the panic buying. Not the common sense buying. And if he isnt, well, I am.
Lets try to stick with apples and apples and not apples and oranges shall we?

 

[SlyPokerDog]

And again, nowhere is it mentioned it is an either/or situation. And NO WHERE have I made any post that says that A is worse than B so response to B is not needed. You are way better than that and I'm surprised that would even be suggested. From the beginning, I have suggested context and bigger picture as well as difference in reaction to now versus just as recent as H1N1.

As for hosptials, I just got an update from a Dr with number for C-19 patients.. They have 518 patients nationwide admitted for C-19. That is around 50 per state. Again, context. Not that it won't continue or numbers will go up, but context. That part didn't get answered. Instead, baseless or entirely incorrect statements about what was said.

Happy to have a discussion about real numbers and things that were actually said.

Again, you have made multiple posts saying this (flu, suicides, etc) yearly numbers are worse than the current numbers of the virus. I have repeatedly pointed out to you that the virus numbers are going to go up and are going to make the numbers you keep posting worse. You are comparing A to B when the problem is A + B.

 

[ABM]

Middle Eastern is not like saying Chinese. The first refers to a region and no particular country while the second refers specifically to a country. Apples and oranges, my friend.

OK, but as noted above, what about the Spanish Flu and/or the German Measles?

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Again, you have made multiple posts saying this (flu, suicides, etc) yearly numbers are worse than the current numbers of the virus. I have repeatedly pointed out to you that the virus numbers are going to go up and are going to make the numbers you keep posting worse. You are comparing A to B when the problem is A + B.

I guess the question is h1n1 + everything else was also the case it wasn't an either or then. Should they have reacted this way for that? The answer might be yes. I don't know. The number of people who are tested positive well certainly go way up. That may actually be comforting though if it proves that a very high percentage of people can contract it with no or little effects.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

We shall have to disagree then. I thknk the last thing we shold be doing is instilling a panicky fear. This is absolutely the time to remain calm and use common sense. Common sense is not buying a cart of toilet paper.



Okay, now you are sidetracking the panic. Buying some extra meat and eggs is not panicking. Buying a cart full of TP is.

Im pretty sure T is referring to those doing the panic buying. Not the common sense buying. And if he isnt, well, I am.
Lets try to stick with apples and apples and not apples and oranges shall we?

I know that some people are panic buying but do we know that all empty store shelves are the result of panic buying?

 

[BigGameDamian]

Fauci just rolled his eyes at Trump.

 

[Orion Bailey]

So you think this is all overblown?

Yes. Is it something to dismiss? Hell no. But the media has people fighting in the stores for things. It is not needed or justified.

 

[hoopsjock]

Again, I get it. I get the measures. What I beleive T is asking and I second the question is why are these measure creating such a panic and chaos in individuals swarming stores and etc.

There also wouldn't be the threat of quarantine or lockdown because of a car accident.

A car accident you can see as well. The flu you can usually see as well. This virus is invisible and people who are completely asymptomatic could be spreading it for 2 weeks unknowingly.

That's scary as fuck! I agree it would be way better if there was no panic but people are scared.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

I know that some people are panic buying but do we know that all empty store shelves are the result of panic buying?

Well... If in two weeks peoples buying habits have changed that drastically it's probably noteable that at least a good portion of the empty shelves are from "panic buying". Just like the politicians panic selling millions in stocks.

 

[Orion Bailey]

I know that some people are panic buying but do we know that all empty store shelves are the result of panic buying?

Well of course not all, but to dismiss most of it as not panic buying is not being impartial in my opinion. Of course most of it is due to panic buying or other items would be all out as well. People are freaking out about specific things. The cereal isles still have plenty in them, Why are not these being bought out if its just taking precautions?

Its panic buying of certain items because if fear of running out, brought on buy people originally buying out of fear due to media influenced panic.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

I guess the question is h1n1 + everything else was also the case it wasn't an either or then. Should they have reacted this way for that? The answer might be yes. I don't know. The number of people who are tested positive well certainly go way up. That may actually be comforting though if it proves that a very high percentage of people can contract it with no or little effects.

Up until two weeks ago the triage protocol from the CDC in our hospitals was if a patient showed up with flu like symptoms and have not been in contact with someone who had been to China it was to be treated as the flu and no additional protocols, included isolation needed to be followed.

 

[yankeesince59]

Middle Eastern is not like saying Chinese. The first refers to a region and no particular country while the second refers specifically to a country. Apples and oranges, my friend.

You're wasting your breath, Lanny....I tried to explain this to him yesterday.

But the problem is that Trump is doing this so he can later claim that none of this situation in the US is his fault, when in fact, he and his administration were woefully tardy in their duties and being in denial early on.

 

[hoopsjock]

And again, nowhere is it mentioned it is an either/or situation. And NO WHERE have I made any post that says that A is worse than B so response to B is not needed. You are way better than that and I'm surprised that would even be suggested. From the beginning, I have suggested context and bigger picture as well as difference in reaction to now versus just as recent as H1N1.

As for hosptials, I just got an update from a Dr with number for C-19 patients.. They have 518 patients nationwide admitted for C-19. That is around 50 per state. Again, context. Not that it won't continue or numbers will go up, but context. That part didn't get answered. Instead, baseless or entirely incorrect statements about what was said.

Happy to have a discussion about real numbers and things that were actually said.

They're literally telling people who are sick to just stay home and are barely testing anyone so how can any "numbers" on this be accurate?

 

[Lanny]

OK, but as noted above, what about the Spanish Flu and/or the German Measles?

Not done with the same intent as the Chinese reference plus it was done quite a while ago and wouldn't be acceptable today. I guess you might say it's politically unacceptable to denigrate people because of their race, religion, ethnicity or sex.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Well of course not all, but to dismiss most of it as not panic buying is not being impartial in my opinion. Of course most of it is due to panic buying or other items would be all out as well. People are freaking out about specific things. The cereal isles still have plenty in them, Why are not these buying bought out if its just taking precautions?

Its panic buying of certain items because if fear of running out, brought on buy people originally buying out of fear due to media influenced panic.

Winco was out of Cocoa Pebbles.

 

[TBpup]

Have you increased the number of meals eaten at home? My home and those of my family members have stopped eating fast food and take out. That has increased the amount of food used at home. We have shopped for that and increased the amount of food stored at home. Is the hoarding or responding to increased home demand?

Much more food eaten at home, but also much less eaten out so the amount of food is nearly the same.

Again, you have made multiple posts saying this (flu, suicides, etc) yearly numbers are worse than the current numbers of the virus. I have repeatedly pointed out to you that the virus numbers are going to go up and are going to make the numbers you keep posting worse. You are comparing A to B when the problem is A + B.

No one is saying it's not A+B. What I'm questionning is the reaction to one that has 200+ deaths in the US (and yes is still going up) versus the 10's and hundreds of thousands of other deaths annually. Even the fairly recent H1N1...completely different reaction. I'm starting to wonder if people are even reading the whole post or just the first line or two and then responding.