Courtside is On

[andalusian]

You would trade all of them, including Batum, Rudy or Joel, for a teenage point guard who won't contribute for a couple years and you don't even know if he will contribute well then? I know you and others have their speculation but personally I don't feel comfortable risking so much on an 18 year old point guard from Spain who isn't a shooter, doesn't play above average defense and will have to rely on his "imagination" to finish at the rim. Yeah we probably could wait a couple more years to be contenders, but why? On the hopes of this kid being great?

What part of the "I am glad I am not the one to make this decision" is unclear? I do not know if he is worth Rudy/Batum/Joel/JB and I am glad it is not my decision to make - because I do not know.

I am pretty sure that if it was up to me - I would send Webster/Outlaw/Sergio/Money and Picks for him.

Sergio hurts the team more than he helps it. Webster did not contribute one bit last year and we won 54 games. Outlaw is the easiest piece that contributed last year I see us willing to trade for the potential.

Easier to understand my position on this now?

 

[RickyRubio]

I love this time of year. This is when all the armchair general managers come out of the woodwork suggesting we trade up to get player X in the draft. This year is especially funny. We won 54 games, but were exposed for having a lack of toughness and veteran leadership in the playoffs, and people want Rubio. LMAO.

Even Rudy, who played with Rubio on the national team and on their club team back in Europe, said he's not ready for the NBA.

I wish Rubio all the luck in the world in one of the armpits of the NBA, where he can be on SportsCenter Top 10 every other week and be the starting point guard for a 20 win team. I have bigger aspirations for the Blazers.

-Pop

Good points. We need to look to better things. For me, I kinda just get caught up in the hype of having Rudy and Ricky playing on the same team. Kinda like how it's cool to see Sergio and Rudy play.

 

[RickyRubio]

Rudy said he "might" not be ready - and even if it takes him a year or two - this team is built for the long run - so if the opportunity is there - it would be foolish not to pursue it.

Or maybe Rudy is jealous and doesn't want to see the younger Spaniard come over and own him? lol

 

[maxiep]

I talked to Kidd.

Did you ask him for one of his kid's french fries?

 

[hasoos]

Did you ask him for one of his kid's french fries?

Or how he beats his wife without leaving marks?

 

[THE HCP]

Or how he beats his wife without leaving marks?

This is gonna be sweet, wonder how many people I am gonna piss off with this little gem...........

Wish he could teach me that trick! HAHAHAHAHAHA!

 

[Rodolfo]

what part of courtside is your call HCP?

 

[Natebishop3]

I watched Rubio during the Olympics last summer. I wasn't really all that impressed, but I don't think his defense is that bad. He's aggressive. I like that. He has quick hands too. He is a guy that could get 1-2 steals a night.

 

[THE HCP]

what part of courtside is your call HCP?

Before the first guest, about a half an hour in.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

Courtside I saw on TV the other day had two intersting points:

1- Antonio Harvey said that players he has spoken with say that Andre Miller is a big headache and there is a reason he was traded.

2-Unlikely Magic will resign Hedo . . . and that he would be a perfect fit here in Ptd.

 

[Rodolfo]

Courtside I saw on TV the other day had two intersting points:

1- Antonio Harvey said that players he has spoken with say that Andre Miller is a big headache and there is a reason he was traded.

2-Unlikely Magic will resign Hedo . . . and that he would be a perfect fit here in Ptd.

If we could get Hedo, holy shit we are looking damn good next season.

 

[Nikolokolus]

If we could get Hedo, holy shit we are looking damn good next season.

Yup, I totally agree. We'd essentially be trading "Big Shot Trav" for "Big shot Turkey Glue" ... who's actually bigger, got a better handle, sees the floor better and has a better hoops IQ.

 

[MARIS61]

How does Rubio help us exactly? He is basically Sergio at this point. I will say that in some ways I hope KP goes after him because in my mind it will show that he is at least serious about pushing the tempo, and it may force Nate to change his slow paced ways.

The day Nate is fired is the day KP gets serious about pushing the tempo and winning titles.

It's clear Nate doesn't understand how to coach a quick team, and seemingly has no interest in learning how.

 

[LittleAlex]

Yup, I totally agree. We'd essentially be trading "Big Shot Trav" for "Big shot Turkey Glue" ... who's actually bigger, got a better handle, sees the floor better and has a better hoops IQ.

As an added bonus, Hedo could start and not suck balls. Outlaw cannot.

 

[mgb]

The day Nate is fired is the day KP gets serious about pushing the tempo and winning titles.

It's clear Nate doesn't understand how to coach a quick team, and seemingly has no interest in learning how.

What about his 7-7 rule? If you can get something in the first 7 secs take it. That seems to indicate that he is willing to push it if it's there, that's the important part and what most good teams do. Run when it's there, play half court when it's not. Don't just run down and take a bad shot, that's not up tempo, it's just stupid. I think if we are playing good D we'll see a more up tempo game because good D produces easy fast breaks.

 

[Mediocre Man]

What about his 7-7 rule? If you can get something in the first 7 secs take it. That seems to indicate that he is willing to push it if it's there, that's the important part and what most good teams do. Run when it's there, play half court when it's not. Don't just run down and take a bad shot, that's not up tempo, it's just stupid. I think if we are playing good D we'll see a more up tempo game because good D produces easy fast breaks.

At what point do you stop believing Nate wants to push the ball?

He can talk all he wants about wanting to, but the fact is Portland is always at the bottom in pace. His Seattle teams never were really in the top of pace either.

 

[andalusian]

He can talk all he wants about wanting to, but the fact is Portland is always at the bottom in pace. His Seattle teams never were really in the top of pace either.

I hate this argument - because it ignores facts. Nate did not have the players to play fast in Seattle. Management wanted him to make it quicker - and in his 3rd year his team went up to be a middle of the pack team in pace - and it was the year they won least under him there (only 37 wins, all other years they were in the 40s or up). Next year he slowed them down and they won the most (52). A year after that - he left and management imposed a play fast rule - they jumped to 11th in pace in the entire league and won less games than any year they were under Nate (with basically the same roster and Ray Allen having a career year).

In other words - the roster was not going to work in a fast pace system, Nate knew it and he optimized the game plan to the roster - which is what good coaches do.

The fact of the matter is that this team is further ahead of where anyone expected it - and it is winning way more than a team as young as this should - and there is a reason for it - Nate understands his roster and designs plays to maximize it's efficiency...

 

[hasoos]

The day Nate is fired is the day KP gets serious about pushing the tempo and winning titles.

It's clear Nate doesn't understand how to coach a quick team, and seemingly has no interest in learning how.

Oh really? And who was running in the playoffs this year? *Crickets*

 

[Tince]

People trick themselves into believing that a fast pace system is best for this team, but it's only because they find it more entertaining. If you don't have a good half court offense, you won't be a championship team. You don't teach a team to run, then try to work in a half court offense. We are getting close to having a firm grip on our half court offense, and once our defense gets a little better, the opportunity to run will present itself.

 

[andalusian]

People trick themselves into believing that a face pace system is best for this team, but it's only because they find it more entertaining. If you don't have a good half court offense, you won't be a championship team. You don't teach a team to run, then try to work in a half court offense. We are getting close to having a firm grip on our half court offense, and once our defense gets a little better, the opportunity to run will present itself.

Bingo.

 

[LittleAlex]

Oh really? And who was running in the playoffs this year? *Crickets*

Orlando plays at a pretty fast pace, but they aren't a run and gun team.

I think people are talking about speeding up Portland's pace from the slowest in the NBA to something in the middle of the pack.

 

[andalusian]

Orlando plays at a pretty fast pace, but they aren't a run and gun team.

I think people are talking about speeding up Portland's pace from the slowest in the NBA to something in the middle of the pack.

I think you are going to see it as our team matures - but let's remember that Portland is not really the slowest team in the NBA - because they are the #1 offensive rebounding team - and offensive rebounds do not start a new possessions. Portland is just ultra-efficient with it's possessions because of great execution and great offensive rebounding that "extends" these possessions...

 

[Mediocre Man]

I hate this argument - because it ignores facts. Nate did not have the players to play fast in Seattle. Management wanted him to make it quicker - and in his 3rd year his team went up to be a middle of the pack team in pace - and it was the year they won least under him there (only 37 wins, all other years they were in the 40s or up). Next year he slowed them down and they won the most (52). A year after that - he left and management imposed a play fast rule - they jumped to 11th in pace in the entire league and won less games than any year they were under Nate (with basically the same roster and Ray Allen having a career year).

In other words - the roster was not going to work in a fast pace system, Nate knew it and he optimized the game plan to the roster - which is what good coaches do.

The fact of the matter is that this team is further ahead of where anyone expected it - and it is winning way more than a team as young as this should - and there is a reason for it - Nate understands his roster and designs plays to maximize it's efficiency...

And I hate this arguement because it ignores Nate. Nate says in almost any interview that he wants to push the pace. Yet his teams never do. I think at some point one needs to start thinking that Nate doesn't truly want to play faster.

You might also want to mention that in the 37 win year the Sonics lost 126 total man games due to injury. I am just guessing, but I think that had a lot more to do with their record than anything else. Two of those players, Ray Allen (leading scorer) and Brent Barry (5th leading scorer), were really important to that team as well.

As for the difference in pace between the 37 win season and the 52 win season it was .6. Yes, you all heard me correctly, it was a difference of just about 1/2 of 1 point. 91.8 to 91.2

Stats for the 37 win team, 52 win team and the year Nate left in that order.

EFF - offense
104.9
108.1
106.9

This shows that with their 2 all-stars playing the entire year the Sonics were at their best


PPG - offense
97.1
98.9
102.6

This shows that when Nate left the scoring went way up, but the win total went way down......Not because of offense though.



Pace - offense
91.8
91.2
94.5

This shows that despite having very different records, Nate coached the teams the same in 03 and 04. In 05 the new coach had a much higher pace.


Now defense

EFF - Defense
105.4
105.5
111.3

This shows that Nate's teams were never very good defensively, but got a lot worse after he left. Also virtually the same for both the 37 and 52 win teams.


PPG - defense
97.8
96.6
105.6

This shows that Nate's teams play better defense than Bob Weiss' and Bob Hill's teams did.




I think since those first two numbers on each stat are so close I think the big difference between the 37 and 52 win teams is all about injuries, and not at all about pace

 

[Mediocre Man]

People trick themselves into believing that a fast pace system is best for this team, but it's only because they find it more entertaining. If you don't have a good half court offense, you won't be a championship team. You don't teach a team to run, then try to work in a half court offense. We are getting close to having a firm grip on our half court offense, and once our defense gets a little better, the opportunity to run will present itself.

No one is talking about being Phoenix part II. Take this years finals and you will see that both the Lakers and a Magic are in the top 12 of pace.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Oh really? And who was running in the playoffs this year? *Crickets*

Actually for the regular season....

Denver was 5th in pace
LA was 6th in pace
Orlando was 12th in pace


Only Cleveland was low at 25th

In the playoffs Denver, LA and Orlando again were in the top half while Cleveland came in 11th out of 16 teams for pace

 

[Mediocre Man]

I think you are going to see it as our team matures - but let's remember that Portland is not really the slowest team in the NBA - because they are the #1 offensive rebounding team - and offensive rebounds do not start a new possessions. Portland is just ultra-efficient with it's possessions because of great execution and great offensive rebounding that "extends" these possessions...

In Seattle's 52 win season with two mature all-stars they only averaged a pace of 2 higher than ours last year. That team would still have been 25th in the league this last season.

NATE DOES NOT WANT TO PUSH TEMPO.

 

[andalusian]

As for the difference in pace between the 37 win season and the 52 win season it was .6. Yes, you all heard me correctly, it was a difference of just about 1/2 of 1 point. 91.8 to 91.2

I do not know where you got your numbers from - but they differ from basketball reference's number. The 37 wins team was 2 possessions per game faster than the 52 wins team and was 15th in the NBA compared to the 52 win team that was 27...

Stats for the 37 win team, 52 win team and the year Nate left in that order.

EFF - offense
104.9
108.1
106.9

This shows that with their 2 all-stars playing the entire year the Sonics were at their best

I am not sure where these numbers are from - but Seattle had Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis for more games after Nate left and they still won only 35 games. Also - the 37 wins team had Lewis for more games than the 52 wins team.

PPG - offense
97.1
98.9
102.6

This shows that when Nate left the scoring went way up, but the win total went way down......Not because of offense though.

Of course because of the offense - their efficiency fell down, turn-overs were up, the other team was having a lot of success rebounding the ball, causing turn-overs (an extra 2.5 per game) and shoving it down their throat because their defense was not longer able to get back on time.

Pace - offense
91.8
91.2
94.5

This shows that despite having very different records, Nate coached the teams the same in 03 and 04. In 05 the new coach had a much higher pace.

Again - the numbers differ from what BBR shows - they were 15th in pace, 27th and 11th in this order - and the actual numbers are different as well - what is not different is how slow or fast they were compared to the rest of the league - this team worked well only when it was slower than the other teams because they were built on 3P shooting and did not make great decisions in a fast-pace.

Now defense

EFF - Defense
105.4
105.5
111.3

This shows that Nate's teams were never very good defensively, but got a lot worse after he left. Also virtually the same for both the 37 and 52 win teams.

Actually, this team was awful defensively all the time - which is the reason they needed to play slow - to minimize the possessions of the other team. They were 27th worst in the NBA under Nate, 30th worse without him. Not a surprise when your team does not have a defensive anchor or anyone good defensively on the perimeter. The reason they were better defensively under Nate was because the slow pace allowed them to take care of the ball better, limited the possessions for the other team and limited easy points against an unset defense that the fast pace dictated.

PPG - defense
97.8
96.6
105.6

This shows that Nate's teams play better defense than Bob Weiss' and Bob Hill's teams did.

Per BBR - the difference in possessions per game between the 52 wins team and the 35 wins team was 4. The difference in defense between these teams in PPG came down to 9 points - so yes, Nate's team was a tiny bit better defensively - but he help negate the bad defense by limiting possessions and easy fast break points because of turn-overs and inefficient offense by slowing them down.

I think since those first two numbers on each stat are so close I think the big difference between the 37 and 52 win teams is all about injuries, and not at all about pace

Hard to agree with that when the 35 teams actually had both Lewis and Allen play more than the 52 wins team and Lewis play more on the 37 wins team than he did on the 52 wins one.

 

[hasoos]

Actually for the regular season....

Denver was 5th in pace
LA was 6th in pace
Orlando was 12th in pace


Only Cleveland was low at 25th

In the playoffs Denver, LA and Orlando again were in the top half while Cleveland came in 11th out of 16 teams for pace

Pace has nothing to do with it. The problem is when you get intot he playoffs, the refs make so many calls that the game is stopped all the time. Phoenix was one of the most successful running teams there has been since the showtime Lakers, and they never could even make it to the finals. The reason? Playoff basketball reduces their chances of success due to all of the game stopage.

 

[Mediocre Man]

I got my numbers from www.databasebasketball.com


I am not sure where these numbers are from - but Seattle had Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis for more games after Nate left and they still won only 35 games. Also - the 37 wins team had Lewis for more games than the 52 wins team.

Allen, their best player, missed the majority of the games.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Pace has nothing to do with it. The problem is when you get intot he playoffs, the refs make so many calls that the game is stopped all the time. Phoenix was one of the most successful running teams there has been since the showtime Lakers, and they never could even make it to the finals. The reason? Playoff basketball reduces their chances of success due to all of the game stopage.

I wish I could find playoff fastbreak pts, but I can't.

The regular season this year shows Orlando was the closest team to us in fast break points at 11.2. (we were 9.0. 10.5 at home and 7.6 on the road)

Portland needs more easy baskets period.