Dame named as Top 75 Player

[Stevenson]

Mutumbo is one of the greatest defensive players of all time.

 

[handiman]

I love Dame as much as anyone, but no way he is, right now, one of the best 75 players of all time. No way.

To me, it's a pretty easy counter-argument. Dame is a great scorer, but a fairly average play-maker and a weak defender. So, from the perspective of an all-time greats list, his scoring is the only relevant factor. (I don't see how personal qualities would come into play, but he's obviously also great there.) And he's just cracked the top-100 in scoring, so he can't by that reasoning be in the top-75 overall when many of those ahead of him on the scoring list were surely better in other areas.

The only other angle would be his affect on the game, but most of that credit goes to Curry for reshaping our thinking of shot selection. Dame has simply co-elevated it.

I agree that it's a marketing move more than anything. But, it's nice to see the Blazers as part of a league marketing push for a change, so I'm not complaining.

 

[Minstrel]

McGrady in about a 3 year window was arguably the best player in the league. He was so dynamic.

I agree. McGrady was as talented as Kobe, but Kobe didn't have the back injuries that McGrady did.

McGrady, Penny Hardaway and Grant Hill were all-time talents but just didn't have the necessary health. A (major) injury free career and each one of them would have easily made it on the list.

 

[KSF-ERIC]

No Vince, no Tracy, not sure Dame has achieved as much as these so far - but I certainly expect him to pass them both by the end of his career. I suspect this is really a marketing exercise by the league and they need some current players that are not that far from the end of their career, so with that in mind, Dame certainly makes sense. Congrats.

Tracy never won a playoff series except for late in career riding pine in SA. Lillard is way ahead of him. Carter never did much either.

 

[KSF-ERIC]

They let Westbrook in and well, yeah.

MVP who averaged triple double in multiple seasons and played in an NBA Final. No brainer.

 

[THE HCP]

10/21/21
10:40PM
“Carter never did much either”

Good Lord Almighty…….

 

[KSF-ERIC]

Totally disagree. Guys like Tony Parker, Pau Gasol, and Ginobili won multiple titles playing team basketball on both ends. Westbrook got empty stats and playoff losses. He should be behind those guys.

Hell I think I would put him behind Irving and I can't stand Irving.

I hate Westbrook. He will bring down the Lakers. BUT his record when getting triple double is good so you can’t call them empty stats. Also he’s played in an NBA Final.

 

[KSF-ERIC]

10/21/21
10:40PM
“Carter never did much either”

Good Lord Almighty…….

His only playoff highlight is missing what would have been a series winner in round 2, 2001. He played many seasons. Won a dunk contest. Not much else.

 

[PDXFonz]

It’s a pretty solid list.

HCP brought up some good names

McGrady is the biggest snub I can come up with.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

Wine and Spirits

That’s a blatant lie. There’s nothing on the W&S website about this. I’m a subscriber.

 

[crandc]

Any time a list is made of greatest something there are always controversies. I still haven't forgiven baseball for leaving Rickey Henderson off their greatest 100.

 

[mook]

I have a hard time seeing Dame on there and not Tony Parker or Dwight Howard.

Tony Parker especially. He never put up the numbers Dame did, but he was so damned good for so long, and his teams far outstripped ours in terms of results. You could pencil in the Spurs as a contender for pretty much every year he was there.

The Spurs were the most consistently great team of this millennium. It deserves more than just Duncan in the 75.

(Yeah, I guess Robinson is also on the list, but he's there for what he did in the 90's, not for the incredible run the Spurs put out between 1999 and 2015.)

 

[TBpup]

Any time a list is made of greatest something there are always controversies. I still haven't forgiven baseball for leaving Rickey Henderson off their greatest 100.

Unbelievable! Henderson single-handedly affected every game he played from the moment he stepped into the batters box.

 

[STOMP]

Though expected, very happy to see my favorite player GP make it.

STOMP

 

[tlongII]

No Artis Gilmore? Come on man!

 

[THE HCP]

Unbelievable! Henderson single-handedly affected every game he played from the moment he stepped into the batters box.

Affected or Effected?

 

[UncleCliffy'sDaddy]

Being the consummate grumpy old man…..I’ve always hated lists like this one, regardless of the sport. Comparing athletes from different eras is impossible and asinine. Rules change, athletes and conditions improve, talent gets diluted as leagues expand, etc, etc, etc. The only things these lists provide is endless, futile debate. So I guess there is that…….

 

[crandc]

Affected or Effected?

Affect.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

Being the consummate grumpy old man…..I’ve always hated lists like this one, regardless of the sport. Comparing athletes from different eras is impossible and asinine. Rules change, athletes and conditions improve, talent gets diluted as leagues expand, etc, etc, etc. The only things these lists provide is endless, futile debate. So I guess there is that…….

Grump on old man. Grump on.

 

[THE HCP]

Being the consummate grumpy old man…..I’ve always hated lists like this one, regardless of the sport. Comparing athletes from different eras is impossible and asinine. Rules change, athletes and conditions improve, talent gets diluted as leagues expand, etc, etc, etc. The only things these lists provide is endless, futile debate. So I guess there is that…….

I have MAJOR respect for the players from back in the day, but I really look at the athleticism of the guys. I mean can you imagine what Dame would do playing against point guards in the 1960-61 season? I mean c'mon FAMS!

 

[Fairly-Hard]

I have MAJOR respect for the players from back in the day, but I really look at the athleticism of the guys. I mean can you imagine what Dame would do playing against point guards in the 1960-61 season? I mean c'mon FAMS!

And Dame could buy a team from back then as well.

 

[UncleCliffy'sDaddy]

I have MAJOR respect for the players from back in the day, but I really look at the athleticism of the guys. I mean can you imagine what Dame would do playing against point guards in the 1960-61 season? I mean c'mon FAMS!

My point exactly………..

 

[handiman]

McGrady, Penny Hardaway and Grant Hill were all-time talents but just didn't have the necessary health. A (major) injury free career and each one of them would have easily made it on the list.

72. Tracy McGrady* 18381
97. Grant Hill* 17137
100. Damian Lillard 16835

McGrady and Hill have to be on the list. Even with how shortened their careers were by injury, they were still proficient enough to rank ahead of Dame as an all-time scorer. "Grant"ed, not for much longer, but the list wasn't made a season from now.

I suppose an interesting question could be asked, is it better to be a 30 pts/game guy for 5 seasons and counting, or a 20 pts/game guy for 10 seasons? Which one is more significant historically? The per game and per season average, or the career totals?

I have a hard time seeing Dame on there and not Tony Parker or Dwight Howard.

Tony Parker especially. He never put up the numbers Dame did, but he was so damned good for so long, and his teams far outstripped ours in terms of results. You could pencil in the Spurs as a contender for pretty much every year he was there.

Parker's [continuing] problem is, he was never really viewed as a top PG. Every match-up, the opposing team's PG was considered the superior player. But, Parker always ended up being the best PG on the floor. If there's a best underdog, or biggest overachiever list, of all-time, he's surely #1.

 

[KSF-ERIC]

I have a hard time seeing Dame on there and not Tony Parker or Dwight Howard.

Tony Parker especially. He never put up the numbers Dame did, but he was so damned good for so long, and his teams far outstripped ours in terms of results. You could pencil in the Spurs as a contender for pretty much every year he was there.

The Spurs were the most consistently great team of this millennium. It deserves more than just Duncan in the 75.

(Yeah, I guess Robinson is also on the list, but he's there for what he did in the 90's, not for the incredible run the Spurs put out between 1999 and 2015.)

Robinson was on the 1999 and 2003 championship teams. Also didn’t Kawhi make it?

 

[wizenheimer]

72. Tracy McGrady* 18381
97. Grant Hill* 17137
100. Damian Lillard 16835

McGrady and Hill have to be on the list. Even with how shortened their careers were by injury, they were still proficient enough to rank ahead of Dame as an all-time scorer. "Grant"ed, not for much longer, but the list wasn't made a season from now.

well, that's the problem when comparing retired players to active ones

McGrady played in 938 games
Hill played in 1026 games
Dame has played in 683

if Dame had played in 938 games like McGrady, he'd win the scoring comparison 23,075 to 18,281 and the assist race 6,191 to 4,161

if Dame had played in 1026 games like Hill, he'd win the coring comparison 25,240 vs 17,137 and the assist race 6,772 vs 4,252

obviously, that assumes Dame can maintain his career pace for the next 3-4 years. That's very realistic by the way

 

[riverman]

You're only as popular as the last couple years you couldn't play in this league....sorry Klay ..

 

[SlyPokerCat]

You're only as popular as the last couple years you couldn't play in this league....sorry Klay and Kahwi.....

Kawhi made it.

 

[barfo]

Any list that leaves off the greatest center of all time is crap.

barfo

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Ginobili is underrated. He lead the key moments to beat a damn good Shaq and Kobe team.

Not to mention beating Team USA back when that meant something.

 

[handiman]

well, that's the problem when comparing retired players to active ones

McGrady played in 938 games
Hill played in 1026 games
Dame has played in 683

if Dame had played in 938 games like McGrady, he'd win the scoring comparison 23,075 to 18,281 and the assist race 6,191 to 4,161

if Dame had played in 1026 games like Hill, he'd win the coring comparison 25,240 vs 17,137 and the assist race 6,772 vs 4,252

obviously, that assumes Dame can maintain his career pace for the next 3-4 years. That's very realistic by the way

You conveniently omitted the next paragraph: "I suppose an interesting question could be asked, is it better to be a 30 pts/game guy for 5 seasons and counting, or a 20 pts/game guy for 10 seasons? Which one is more significant historically? The per game and per season average, or the career totals?"