Detroit Revisited........

[Paxil]

CEO's getting such ridiculous wages for sending jobs to China etc. isn't noble either. The fact is America has gone way downhill as far as personal integrity and work ethic regardless of the strata of society. We're gonna learn the hard way what results from that.

I agree with you that it is very sad that many companies now put profits and shareholders over their own employees. I see it all the time. It used to be that you knew if you worked hard and did an outstanding job, you knew you would always have a job. Not so anymore. Boeing reorganized so many times it was like musical chairs... every few years someone else coming in randomly moving things around without regards to what it really did to the people at the bottom.

Now re outsourcing... I know Boeing didn't just do it for profit. They tried for a long time to work with the unions to be able to be profitable... but they were fought every step of the way... and some of the work that was outsourced (much of it in the US by the way... I don't remember anything going to China) ended up coming back to them. Turns out the the processes the FAA requires you to follow when making parts for planes is very rigid... and many of the places they outsourced work to were less than steller. Sometimes you get what you pay for. =)

I wouldn't say American workers suck ... we are the most productive workers on the planet and there are all kinds of benefits to NOT outsourcing work... and some companies are learning lessons now. The things I have personally seen where 1) shoddy work 2) communication barriers 3) poor worker productivity. I work personally with people all around the globe... and American's care for more about their work than I see in other countries.

 

[BlazerBeav]

It truly is a amazing what a wasteland such a major metropolitan city has become. I'm fascinated by watching these beautiful downtown football and baseball stadiums on TV filled with people paying a ton of money to be there, and then contrast that with reports that there are 20,000 abandoned homes in that city. How is it that Detroit has the money for such fantastic sports facilities, and we can't even build a minor league ballpark?

 

[mook]

It truly is a amazing what a wasteland such a major metropolitan city has become. I'm fascinated by watching these beautiful downtown football and baseball stadiums on TV filled with people paying a ton of money to be there, and then contrast that with reports that there are 20,000 abandoned homes in that city. How is it that Detroit has the money for such fantastic sports facilities, and we can't even build a minor league ballpark?

I think that might be a pretty good example of badly prioritizing government energy. I'm as big a sports fan as the next guy, but if I were forced to live in Detroit I'd be voting for politicians who focus on education and infrastructure.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Believe it or not, Michigan is one of the biggest vacation draws in the country. Surrounded on all sides by fresh water, boating in the summer, skiing, snowmobiling and icefishing (if that's your thing) in the winter. Put that in your "location" pipe and smoke it. And mook, don't you live in Idaho, fer chrissakes?

 

[Rastapopoulos]

As for Detroit, yes, it is an urban hellhole, but there are great parts of it (Ferndale, Royal Oak, Grosse Pointe, et. al.).

 

[espn_hall_of_famer]

Believe it or not, Michigan is one of the biggest vacation draws in the country. Surrounded on all sides by fresh water, boating in the summer, skiing, snowmobiling and icefishing (if that's your thing) in the winter. Put that in your "location" pipe and smoke it. And mook, don't you live in Idaho, fer chrissakes?

Do you have a link for that? I'm just curious if there's a stat on that somewhere or you're from the area and just giving a defensive statement. Personally as someone whose been around, I've known a lot of people to visit Las Vegas, California (in general), Florida, Arizona, Texas, New Orleans, Alaska, national parks of the west (Yellowstone, Grand Canyon, Zion, Rushmore, etc.), some parts to midwest, but primarily Chicago, and then in general to the NE (NY or Boston). But throughout my life and living and travelling around this nation, I've rarely heard anyone say they were going to Michigan for a vacation. Maybe some folks from the midwest when I was in the midwest, but never out East or on the West coast. And even then most seemed to make Upper Peninsula of Michigan a vacation destination. Never heard anywhere that Detroit or the surrounding mainland was a good place to take a vacation. But then I've also never heard anyone say they wanted to vacation to West Virginia or Rhode Island and a handful of other spots, so maybe I just missed it.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

As for Detroit, yes, it is an urban hellhole, but there are great parts of it (Ferndale, Royal Oak, Grosse Pointe, et. al.).

Yeah, just hope that you don't get shot on the way there.

 

[mook]

Believe it or not, Michigan is one of the biggest vacation draws in the country. Surrounded on all sides by fresh water, boating in the summer, skiing, snowmobiling and icefishing (if that's your thing) in the winter. Put that in your "location" pipe and smoke it. And mook, don't you live in Idaho, fer chrissakes?

lol. Really? Biggest draws in the nation? Come on, you have to back that up with some stats. I've never met anybody who proudly declares, "I'm going to Michigan this summer! (or winter!)"

So it's got lakes and snow (few mountains, but snow). Gosh, that puts it pretty much on par with about 35 or so other states.

I have met more than a few people, including Bruce Willis, who have vacation residences in Sun Valley, Idaho. And really quite a few internet startups came out of Idaho (bodybuilder.com being probably the most famous). A lot of the people who did so were drawn to Idaho's mountains. There's more roadless wilderness here than any US state outside Alaska.

Tourism is actually a pretty big money maker in this state now. Hunting, skiing, fishing, whitewater rafting. Not huge total dollars, but per capita quite a bit. There are only about 1.3 million people here, so you don't have to have a lot of tourists before it makes a big difference.

 

[MickZagger]

Look up East St. Louis. Make Detroit look like paradise. Or at least it's comparable and has been that way for a lot longer.

I've been there several times. Its absolutely horrible, the whole city is pretty much boarded up. My uncle was always leary of driving through because as a white guy you stick out like a sore thumb. The thing about it is, the state of Illinois could give two shits about the St. Louis suburb.

 

[MickZagger]

lol. Really? Biggest draws in the nation? Come on, you have to back that up with some stats. I've never met anybody who proudly declares, "I'm going to Michigan this summer! (or winter!)"

So it's got lakes and snow (few mountains, but snow). Gosh, that puts it pretty much on par with about 35 or so other states.

I have met more than a few people, including Bruce Willis, who have vacation residences in Sun Valley, Idaho. And really quite a few internet startups came out of Idaho (bodybuilder.com being probably the most famous). A lot of the people who did so were drawn to Idaho's mountains. There's more roadless wilderness here than any US state outside Alaska.

Tourism is actually a pretty big money maker in this state now. Hunting, skiing, fishing, whitewater rafting. Not huge total dollars, but per capita quite a bit. There are only about 1.3 million people here, so you don't have to have a lot of tourists before it makes a big difference.

Bodybuilding.com has regional warehouses in different areas of the U.S. I know whenever I order something from the site it comes from Idaho, unless its out of stock it comes from Florida. I didn't realize that the site was started in Idaho though. Random.

 

[MickZagger]

It truly is a amazing what a wasteland such a major metropolitan city has become. I'm fascinated by watching these beautiful downtown football and baseball stadiums on TV filled with people paying a ton of money to be there, and then contrast that with reports that there are 20,000 abandoned homes in that city. How is it that Detroit has the money for such fantastic sports facilities, and we can't even build a minor league ballpark?

Detroit has a ton of suburbs where there is a load of wealth.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I had a good time in East St. Louis!

 

[THE HCP]

Ya, I have to agree with Michigan NOT being a vacation destination. I'm sure it has nice places like everywhere else, but who would want to go there to chill. I will say this, I go to Milwaukee every winter and I think the place is a shit hole..... but I am an hour north right now at Whistling Straits and it is gorgeous here on the water.

 

[BLAZER PROPHET]

I had a good time in East St. Louis!

Who was she?

 

[ABM]

Who was she?

Darius Miles.

 

[MARIS61]

To hire someone legally in Detroit, you must pay the mandated minimum wage of $10/hour - thus businesses can not afford to open and run businesses there, so the leave.

Good riddance to them!

Seriously, if you can't afford to pay your employees a piddling $10/hr it can only be because you lack the basic intelligence required to operate a business. Step aside and let someone with a clue take your place.

The truth is businesses (and it's original paler inhabitants) left Detroit because it became a mostly black town with a horrendous rate of violent crime, pollution and squalor, and once Reagan denuded the unions the last reason for staying there (income) began it's endless decline.

 

[maxiep]

Coleman Young did a tremendous amount of damage to Detroit. It can't be overstated.

 

[maxiep]

Look up East St. Louis. Make Detroit look like paradise. Or at least it's comparable and has been that way for a lot longer.

It's hard to find a mayor worse than Coleman Young, but Carl Officer managed to lap him.

 

[maxiep]

Detroit has a ton of suburbs where there is a load of wealth.

Grosse Pointe is one of America's most beautiful suburbs. SE Michigan has fled from Detroit.

 

[MickZagger]

Who was she?

Jackie Joyner Kersey

 

[MickZagger]

It's hard to find a mayor worse than Coleman Young, but Carl Officer managed to lap him.

Kwame Kilpatrick?

 

[maxiep]

Kwame Kilpatrick?

LOL! And Zagsfan20 for the win! Repped!

 

[MARIS61]

Grosse Pointe is one of America's most beautiful suburbs. SE Michigan has fled from Detroit.

This is an interesting read about The Gross Pointes and the exodus of whites from Detroit.

http://higley1000.com/archives/50

 

[BLAZER PROPHET]

This is an interesting read about The Gross Pointes and the exodus of whites from Detroit.

http://higley1000.com/archives/50

That was an interesting read. I'm not really sure what he's trying to say, but the stats he introduces are interesting.

 

[jlprk]

This part was good...
----------
In the spring of 1960, a civil court suit unexpectedly shed light on how the real estate market operated in Grosse Pointe. The trial revealed that there was a screening system in effect in the Grosse Pointes that required real estate brokers to submit the name of a potential property purchase to the Grosse Pointe Property Owners Association. The Association then engaged a private detective to fill out an investigative questionnaire. As was written in the pamphlet Rights, a publication of the Anti-defamation League of B’nai B’rith ( N. Braverman, 1960), “The filled out questionnaire was then turned over by the Association to a committee of brokers which totaled up the scored points and sent it back to the Association. They made the final evaluation as to whether or not the prospective buyer had made a passing grade.” Out of a maximum of 100 points, a passing grade was based on a sliding scale for different nationalities; “Poles would pass with 55 points, Southern Europeans with 75, Jews with 85.” Negroes and “Orientals” were not even eligible; their disqualification was automatic.” The point system considered such details as whether the prospective buyer was “American” or “Americanized,” if his occupation was typical of his own race, or if either the Mr. or Mrs. was “swarthy” in appearance or spoke with an accent. The private detective was also asked to find out about the prospective buyer’s reputation and how the outside and inside of his previous home was maintained.” (How this was determined without being a peeping tom was not in the court record!). “There was a question as to whether the buyer dressed “neat” or “slovenly;” and “conservative” or “flashy.” The trial even revealed that a new form had been introduced, the “blue form,” because too many Jews were passing the existing point system. The real estate brokers were constantly tinkering with the system to keep “undesirables” out of the Grosse Pointes. The trial also revealed that the system had been adopted in 1945