Fletcher Mackel believes Rudy will be a Hornet

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Sounds like he has Cunningham included as well.
Joel, Rudy, Bayless and Cunningham for Collison and Posey? Must really like Collison.
 
...

They must REALLY like Collison or else they are really screwing themselves.
 
Am I the only one here who overrates Collison? The dude is amazing. Getting him for Rudy would be robbery for us. I don't see New Orleans doing that trade.
 
RR7 said:
Sounds like he has Cunningham included as well.
Joel, Rudy, Bayless and Cunningham for Collison and Posey? Must really like Collison.
Click to expand...

Oops missed Dante ... anyway, yeah it sounds like Collison is somebody they really like a lot ... I think it's a good move.
1) Rudy wants to be gone and doesn't really have a role here any more with the Matthews signing.
2) Bayless behind Miller might get 12 minutes a night and would have almost no minutes at the 2 with Matthews here, he won't stay content for long, and I'm dubious about his longterm prospects of ever becoming a capable point guard (minimum of 2 years if ever).
3) Dante is also going to be a low minute reserve, so the opportunity cost isn't as great as it appears (I do like Inferno quite a bit though, losing him would stink).
4) Joel may never be healthy enough to provide meaningful production.

Final roster if this move happened:
Miller/Collison/Johnson?
Roy/Matthews/Williams
Batum/(Matthews)/Posey/Babbitt
LMA/(Camby)/Pendergraph/(Babbitt)
Oden/Camby/(Pendergraph).

()=secondary position

I like that team's chances quite a bit.
 
RR7 said:
Sounds like he has Cunningham included as well.
Joel, Rudy, Bayless and Cunningham for Collison and Posey? Must really like Collison.
Click to expand...

I've liked Collison for years while he was at UCLA. You know he had to play defense there, unlike Kevin Love. The funny thing about Howland at UCLA is that he can recruit very good players, but his style of coaching makes Nate McMillan look like Paul Westhead.

UCLA should have an NCAA title in the past 5 years with the players they had on their team. Collison/Westbrook/Shipp/Love/Mbah a Moute, and they could not win one title when the NCAA is typically dominated by good guards in the tournament? Are you kidding me?
 
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Miksaid said:
Am I the only one here who overrates Collison? The dude is amazing. Getting him for Rudy would be robbery for us. I don't see New Orleans doing that trade.
Click to expand...

So throw in Okafor for Pryzbilla and New Orleans likes this deal better!?

add Bayless and it makes this deal a "NO" brainer for the Hornets?

Rudy
Bayless
Pryz

for

Collison
Okafor
 
Miksaid said:
Am I the only one here who overrates Collison? The dude is amazing. Getting him for Rudy would be robbery for us. I don't see New Orleans doing that trade.
Click to expand...

In my opinion, if he's actually as good as he was as a starter, then yes...he is amazing. But if he's only as good as he was overall last season, he's solid, but not that great.
 
Nikolokolus said:
Oops missed Dante ... anyway, yeah it sounds like Collison is somebody they really like a lot ... I think it's a good move.
1) Rudy wants to be gone and doesn't really have a role here any more with the Matthews signing.
2) Bayless behind Miller might get 12 minutes a night and would have almost no minutes at the 2 with Matthews here, he won't stay content for long, and I'm dubious about his longterm prospects of ever becoming a capable point guard (minimum of 2 years if ever).
3) Dante is also going to be a low minute reserve, so the opportunity cost isn't as great as it appears (I do like Inferno quite a bit though, losing him would stink).
4) Joel may never be healthy enough to provide meaningful production.

Final roster if this move happened:
Miller/Collison/Johnson?
Roy/Matthews/Williams
Batum/(Matthews)/Posey/Babbitt
LMA/(Camby)/Pendergraph/(Babbitt)
Oden/Camby/(Pendergraph).

()=secondary position

I like that team's chances quite a bit.
Click to expand...

Great defense on that team. PF looks weak. I'd rather try for Okafor over Posey and that 1st needs to be unprotected.
 
Collison / Miller / Johnson
Roy / Matthews / Williams
Batum / Cunningham / Babbitt
LMA / Camby / Pendergraph
Oden / Okafor

This is a start. Eventually Miller will not like taking a back-seat, so he gets moved (perhaps with Camby) by the trade deadline.
 
BoomChakaLaka said:
Collison / Miller / Johnson
Roy / Matthews / Williams
Batum / Cunningham / Babbitt
LMA / Camby / Pendergraph
Oden / Okafor

This is a start. Eventually Miller will not like taking a back-seat, so he gets moved (perhaps with Camby) by the trade deadline.
Click to expand...

Collison/Roy/Batum/Aldridge/Oden + Miller/Matthews/Camby/Okafor looks like a damn good 9-man rotation to me. Also could be the most expensive 2nd unit in the league. :)
 
BoomChakaLaka said:
Collison / Miller / Johnson
Roy / Matthews / Williams
Batum / Cunningham / Babbitt
LMA / Camby / Pendergraph
Oden / Okafor


This is a start. Eventually Miller will not like taking a back-seat, so he gets moved (perhaps with Camby) by the trade deadline.
Click to expand...

Miller would be the clear cut starter over Collison, but I'd wager they'd take steps to monitor his minutes and try to play him no more than around 30 per night. Ideally, if Miller is kept, you keep him around for the length of his contract, groom Collison (and Armon?) to be your eventual starter and take the cap savings when he expires. Camby isn't going anywhere this season either.
 
Nikolokolus said:
2) Bayless behind Miller might get 12 minutes a night and would have almost no minutes at the 2 with Matthews here, he won't stay content for long, and I'm dubious about his longterm prospects of ever becoming a capable point guard (minimum of 2 years if ever).
Click to expand...
I know it seems like I'm harping on you about Bayless in every thread, but if Bayless behind Miller only gets 12 minutes a night, how much does Collison get?
 
Nikolokolus said:
Miller would be the clear cut starter over Collison, but I'd wager they'd take steps to monitor his minutes and try to play him no more than around 30 per night. Ideally, if Miller is kept, you keep him around for the length of his contract, groom Collison (and Armon?) to be your eventual starter and take the cap savings when he expires. Camby isn't going anywhere this season either.
Click to expand...

Yup. Agreed. Miller should still be the starter and play the most minutes, but the depth should be leveraged to keep everyone fresh for the playoffs.

And it's interesting...they want to dump Okafor so much that they (supposedly) toyed with dealing Paul. I wonder if Portland could get Collison for almost nothing (Rudy) if they took back Okafor. Portland gets a talented guard very cheaply in terms of talent and they get a good big man to boot. If Allen can bankroll it, that's free loot.
 
Fletcher Mackel morphs into "Holy Mackeral" when I see this thread.

Carry on....
 
B-Roy said:
I know it seems like I'm harping on you about Bayless in every thread, but if Bayless behind Miller only gets 12 minutes a night, how much does Collison get?
Click to expand...

Probably about 18. I see the team looking to limit Miller's minutes somewhat and having a guy who can actually set up the offense and run a team would make it possible. I think Bayless would get about 12 (max) because the team would be forced to play Brandon at the point more when Miller sits.

Edit: I should say 18 minimum, but probably closer to 22, with Miller given even more time to rest.
 
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Nikolokolus said:
Probably about 18. I see the team looking to limit Miller's minutes somewhat and having a guy who can actually set up the offense and run a team would make it possible. I think Bayless would get about 12 (max) because the team would be forced to play Brandon at the point more when Miller sits.
Click to expand...

I question how much development Collison gets playing 18 MPG behind Miller. This guy is coming off a season where he played 28 MPG, so if we're serious about him being our PGOTF, I'd reckon we'd need to try and give him as much game experience as possible. I get the whole "mentor" thing behind Miller, but the most effective way to develop a player is still to play him, a lot.

I'd rather see if we could try and hang onto Bayless and move Miller instead. I realize that may not be possible, but I don't feel comfortable giving up that much to bring in Collison, only to have him play 8th man minutes. (Because you know Andre ain't getting injured)
 
Minstrel said:
Yup. Agreed. Miller should still be the starter and play the most minutes, but the depth should be leveraged to keep everyone fresh for the playoffs.

And it's interesting...they want to dump Okafor so much that they (supposedly) toyed with dealing Paul. I wonder if Portland could get Collison for almost nothing (Rudy) if they took back Okafor. Portland gets a talented guard very cheaply in terms of talent and they get a good big man to boot. If Allen can bankroll it, that's free loot.
Click to expand...

I like that idea a helluva lot more than taking back James Posey, that's for sure. But just how do you justify paying him 10 million+ per year to play behind LMA, Greg and Camby (because I think it's pretty clear he's the fourth best big man in that rotation)? It seems like something would have to give sooner or later (probably sooner).
 
Nikolokolus said:
I like that idea a helluva lot more than taking back James Posey, that's for sure. But just how do you justify paying him 10 million+ per year to play behind LMA, Greg and Camby (because I think it's pretty clear he's the fourth best big man in that rotation)? It seems like something would have to give sooner or later (probably sooner).
Click to expand...

You mentally separate the $10M in to $3M for our backup PF, and $7M for our Oden-injury-insurance policy.
 
Nikolokolus said:
I like that idea a helluva lot more than taking back James Posey, that's for sure. But just how do you justify paying him 10 million+ per year to play behind LMA, Greg and Camby (because I think it's pretty clear he's the fourth best big man in that rotation)? It seems like something would have to give sooner or later (probably sooner).
Click to expand...

You justify it by saying that Camby is a temp and in a season or two, you're looking at Oden/Aldridge/Okafor taking all the "large man minutes."

In the short term, Oden and Camby are both injury risks and it's unlikely that everyone will stay healthy all season long. So everyone will likely get to play a significant amount.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
You mentally separate the $10M in to $3M for our backup PF, and $7M for our Oden-injury-insurance policy.
Click to expand...
So true.

That $7 Million would have went to Joel anyways, to be an insurance policy.
 
SnakeOiler said:
Based on what? It will be insured.
Click to expand...

As I understand it, the league's insurer can designate a few players each season as "uninsurable." They can only do it to something like 10 players league wide, but you would have to think Oden would be a candidate.
 
Joel, Rudy, Bayless and Cunningham for a a 6' 160 lb back up PG who's bio reads "perimeter shooting is a work in progress"...........

Where are the homers on this thread?
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Joel, Rudy, Bayless and Cunningham for a a 6' 160 lb back up PG who's bio reads "perimeter shooting is a work in progress"...........

Where are the homers on this thread?
Click to expand...

I think it's too much. I would pull back Cunningham and Bayless and go for Rudy and Joel for Collison and Posey.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2675lmj

---------------------

I think though they are talking about this one with Okafor though I think. And he shores up the PF/C swing man position nicely:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2ebs5ou

You could then follow that up with this on September 14th:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=23zjlf4

PG: Miller/Collison/Johnson
SG: Roy/Matthews/Williams
SF: Batum/Butler/Babbit/Matthews
PF: LMA/Okafor/Pendergraph
C: Oden/Okafor/Ajinca

Me likey.
 
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Pinwheel1 said:
Joel, Rudy, Bayless and Cunningham for a a 6' 160 lb back up PG who's bio reads "perimeter shooting is a work in progress"...........

Where are the homers on this thread?
Click to expand...

Hi. I'm right here. He played behind Chris Paul, of course he'd be a back-up. He shot 40% from behind the arc, so he's progressing.

(That is too much to give up IMO, just pointing out he is a solid PG)
 
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