Fox News offered to hold a Town Hall for the democrats

[SlyPokerDog]

You think Police get to pick and choose what laws they get to enforce?

Police pick all the time what types of crime to focus on.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

"Oh, it's a dumpster fire. Better leave it alone...there's a hospital on fire across town."

You do realize that they will send more trucks, fire fighters and resources to the hospital fire, right?

You're advocating that both fires be fought equally, same amount of trucks, personal and resources.

 

[Jade Falcon]

You do realize that they will send more trucks, fire fighters and resources to the hospital fire, right?

You're advocating that both fires be fought equally, same amount of trucks, personal and resources.

But Racism isn't a fire. You can't claim "hey, I don't want to be called a nigger. Oh, white people are called Honky, Crackers, and Rednecks? Well....sorry, but we had racism first."

That's a school yard mentality. And if you honestly feel that way, then you can't claim to be against racism, since you're not taking ALL racism seriously.

You're against RACISM. Not "against Racism for black people". Or "against racism for Hispanic people". Racism touches EVERYONE. So why not treat it with equal disgust and disdain?

Why is that so hard to understand? No-one for a minute is suggesting that black people have it easy when it comes to racism. ALL I am saying is that racism effects EVERYONE, and it's about time EVERYONE got on board to fight it, and stop picking sides. Especially when it comes to Politics! All that does is divide this country even further, not bring us together.

King marched and held hands with white people during the Civil Rights era. Why don't we see Sharpton or Jackson do that?

 

[Further]

King marched and held hands with white people during the Civil Rights era. Why don't we see Sharpton or Jackson do that?

And if you want, I can post hundreds of additional pictures showing the same.

 

[Jade Falcon]

And if you want, I can post hundreds of additional pictures showing the same.

Alright. Fair enough.

But boy, it sure doesn't seem like they do. And no, it's not just Fox News saying that.

And have they addressed gang violence in poor areas around this country? Or just when there's cameras pointed at them?

 

[Further]

Alright. Fair enough.

But boy, it sure doesn't seem like they do. And no, it's not just Fox News saying that.

And have they addressed gang violence in poor areas around this country? Or just when there's cameras pointed at them?

You seem to be biased in what you notice. Sure, there are going to be more Blacks marching with them because so many of their marches are on black-centric topics, but especially over the past 20 years they have both been very inclusive.

 

[Jade Falcon]

You seem to be biased in what you notice. Sure, there are going to be more Blacks marching with them because so many of their marches are on black-centric topics, but especially over the past 20 years they have both been very inclusive.

And why is racism a "black-centric topic"?

There's nothing biased about what I'm noticing. I'm simply asking the hard questions, like why they believe that racism only applies to them.

And you have to be blind not to notice that.

 

[Further]

And why is racism a "black-centric topic"?

There's nothing biased about what I'm noticing. I'm simply asking the hard questions, like why they believe that racism only applies to them.

And you have to be blind not to notice that.

It's usually not just about racism, but specifically about how Blacks are being unequally treated. Incarcerated at much higher rates, abused by police at higher rates, live in areas with lesser education and job prospects, and so on. These issues should matter to you, and me, and everyone, but the fact is that most of the people who are moved to go join marches are people who are affected by the policies or actions being protested. So there may be 10% Blacks in a city, but if there is a march on the killing of a Black person by police, likely 90% + of the protesters that show up will be black. This doesn't mean that whites aren't included in the march, or that Jackson et al. aren't happy to march with White people. Just that those who are affected tend to be the ones who show up.

A non-race related example. Certainly over 51% of the population voted to legalize weed in OR, but just about everyone who actively worked on the campaign was a regular pot smoker. It doesn't mean that they weren't happy to have the support of non-smokers and occasional-smokers, but the laws were going to affect pot smokers more, so they were the ones naturally moved to work on the campaign.

Both Jackson and especially Sharpton have made some horrible comments in their past. But they have also worked for many great and noble causes. Over the past 20 years, the positive greatly outweighs the negatives.

 

[Jade Falcon]

It's usually not just about racism, but specifically about how Blacks are being unequally treated. Incarcerated at much higher rates, abused by police at higher rates, live in areas with lesser education and job prospects, and so on. These issues should matter to you, and me, and everyone, but the fact is that most of the people who are moved to go join marches are people who are affected by the policies or actions being protested. So there may be 10% Blacks in a city, but if there is a march on the killing of a Black person by police, likely 90% + of the protesters that show up will be black. This doesn't mean that whites aren't included in the march, or that Jackson et al. aren't happy to march with White people. Just that those who are affected tend to be the ones who show up.

A non-race related example. Certainly over 51% of the population voted to legalize weed in OR, but just about everyone who actively worked on the campaign was a regular pot smoker. It doesn't mean that they weren't happy to have the support of non-smokers and occasional-smokers, but the laws were going to affect pot smokers more, so they were the ones naturally moved to work on the campaign.

Both Jackson and especially Sharpton have made some horrible comments in their past. But they have also worked for many great and noble causes. Over the past 20 years, the positive greatly outweighs the negatives.

Now that was a reasonable answer, thank you.

Both Jackson and especially Sharpton have made some horrible comments in their past.

Yes, they have. And I'm not totally convinced that it hasn't been just for political purposes. It's those kinds of comments that further divide this country, rather than bringing us together.

I will say this: I am utterly convinced that the Media is the biggest culprit in all of this; racism and political divide alike. On BOTH sides of this issue.

For example, and this is MY opinion, I don't believe that police violence happens AS MUCH against black people as the media attempts to portray it. And I'm talking about UNJUSTIFIED violence, NOT such things as justified shootings.

And yet, what's the first thing that the media portrays? The RACE of each individual involved. They don't even wait to put it in the body of the article; they splash it right across the headlines.

That's just wrong. And it's one of the many things, when it comes to issues such as race, which continue to divide this country.

I'm a Gun Owner. I also tend to vote Republican. I have NO issues against anyone who's black. I've gone to the range with black people, I smoke cigars with black people at lounges, and I've even gone to sporting clubs and games with black people. They don't wake up every day, blaming me or other white people for their woes in life. Nor do I believe the majority of them do.

But you wouldn't know that when the headlines you read are "Racist People support Trump". Do you know how insulting that is? It makes me want to spit. And that is the kind of bullshit we ALL need to get rid of.

It's kind of hard for me to try and not be racist myself when I read about such things like that. I go "you know...why even bother? Are they really that racist, that they think of US as racist just because of the party we support? And what does that say about THEM and their party?"

It's difficult, and I don't have all the answers here. But I will say that BOTH sides need to stop this shit and work harder to bring people together. We don't always have to agree on everything. But I would hope that this is one area where we DO agree on something.

 

[Further]

Now that was a reasonable answer, thank you.



Yes, they have. And I'm not totally convinced that it hasn't been just for political purposes. It's those kinds of comments that further divide this country, rather than bringing us together.

I will say this: I am utterly convinced that the Media is the biggest culprit in all of this; racism and political divide alike. On BOTH sides of this issue.

For example, and this is MY opinion, I don't believe that police violence happens AS MUCH against black people as the media attempts to portray it. And I'm talking about UNJUSTIFIED violence, NOT such things as justified shootings.

And yet, what's the first thing that the media portrays? The RACE of each individual involved. They don't even wait to put it in the body of the article; they splash it right across the headlines.

That's just wrong. And it's one of the many things, when it comes to issues such as race, which continue to divide this country.

I'm a Gun Owner. I also tend to vote Republican. I have NO issues against anyone who's black. I've gone to the range with black people, I smoke cigars with black people at lounges, and I've even gone to sporting clubs and games with black people. They don't wake up every day, blaming me or other white people for their woes in life. Nor do I believe the majority of them do.

But you wouldn't know that when the headlines you read are "Racist People support Trump". Do you know how insulting that is? It makes me want to spit. And that is the kind of bullshit we ALL need to get rid of.

It's kind of hard for me to try and not be racist myself when I read about such things like that. I go "you know...why even bother? Are they really that racist, that they think of US as racist just because of the party we support? And what does that say about THEM and their party?"

It's difficult, and I don't have all the answers here. But I will say that BOTH sides need to stop this shit and work harder to bring people together. We don't always have to agree on everything. But I would hope that this is one area where we DO agree on something.

Well I agree that all sides need to take racism seriously and work on fixing racial inequities. But sweeping real issues under the rug doesn't fix things. Believe it or not, what we are doing right now, even with the vitriolic baiting, is what will hopefully help over the long run.

I think calling people racist is the wrong way to go in most circumstances, which is done too often on these boards, but that's not because the term is correct or incorrect, it's because that word inhibits conversation and lessens the chance of growth. But especially when talking in the abstract, like "racists support Trump" I think we need to call things as they are. And yes, racists do support Trump at a much higher rate than they support other candidates. This does not mean that all, or even most Trump supporters are racist. It also doesn't mean that some racist don't support other candidates. But as evidenced by Duke supporting Trump, the White power robo-calls, and the 16% of Trump supporters thinking that the white race is superior, I think it's pretty evident and clear to say that racists do tend to follow Trump.

Personally, I have no idea if Trump is racist, but I do think he is using race and racial tensions very purposefully to get a pool of voters that most candidates wouldn't go after. I think this is wrong, but it does not make him a racist. It could just make him sleazy. This is my opinion.

 

[MarAzul]

I do think he is using race and racial tensions very purposefully to get a pool of voters that most candidates wouldn't go after

I think you pop off. Then I think you should point to where you have any firm evidence to back up your wild claim.

 

[Jade Falcon]

Well I agree that all sides need to take racism seriously and work on fixing racial inequities. But sweeping real issues under the rug doesn't fix things. Believe it or not, what we are doing right now, even with the vitriolic baiting, is what will hopefully help over the long run.

I think calling people racist is the wrong way to go in most circumstances, which is done too often on these boards, but that's not because the term is correct or incorrect, it's because that word inhibits conversation and lessens the chance of growth. But especially when talking in the abstract, like "racists support Trump" I think we need to call things as they are. And yes, racists do support Trump at a much higher rate than they support other candidates. This does not mean that all, or even most Trump supporters are racist. It also doesn't mean that some racist don't support other candidates. But as evidenced by Duke supporting Trump, the White power robo-calls, and the 16% of Trump supporters thinking that the white race is superior, I think it's pretty evident and clear to say that racists do tend to follow Trump.

Personally, I have no idea if Trump is racist, but I do think he is using race and racial tensions very purposefully to get a pool of voters that most candidates wouldn't go after. I think this is wrong, but it does not make him a racist. It could just make him sleazy. This is my opinion.

That's fair enough, well said.

I think, overall, the Democrat party has used race and racial issues to both forward racism in this country through divide, or to garner votes. I believe, based on what I have seen and heard over the years, that many beliefs and policies forwarded by Democrats have actually divided many black communities by telling them "yes, you ARE inferior to white people and you DO need handouts from the government, so you should trust in the same government that enslaved you and denied you rights for decades."

And that's the lowest of the low, in my opinion. I mean, it's no wonder black people don't trust the government! I sure as fuck wouldn't! Hell, I don't even trust the Government with my Civil Right to own a gun! I can't even imagine what it's like to be denied basic Civil Rights to the point of being a second-class citizen.

Because that is NOT how many black people WANT to be spoken to. They don't want to be told they are inferior. They don't want special treatment. They don't want Government hand-outs or help. And they sure as hell don't want divide by using racist tactics.

So I suppose it works both ways. Like you, I too have heard about the 16% number of racist, and that White Power groups are using robo-calls in areas of the country. And I agree with you: that is below sleazeball; that's just wrong, and none of us should put up with it.

And the same goes for Sanders. Despite my statements otherwise on other threads here, I don't know for certain if Sanders is racist. But dammit, it pisses me right the fuck off when I hear "white people don't know what it's like to be poor." Because I've known TRUE poverty in my life, and I'm white. He's lucky he didn't say that to me; I would have had some choice words for him.

I'm glad we can come to some understandings on this topic, instead of bickering and moaning. It's good to have these conversations without getting all emotional. If we, as a country, want to move forward, and truly put a nail in the coffin of racism, then sooner or later we are going to have to move past this.

It DOES NOT mean that we forget the racism of the past, and stop acknowledging it. It simply means that we come together somehow and acknowledge problems on both sides of the isle and find common-ground and similarities in our differences that we can use to come together and bind up our wounds.

But it's going to take effort from both sides, and it won't happen over night. And I believe that the way it's being done right now is only further dividing this country instead of bringing us together.

 

[Denny Crane]

You do realize that they will send more trucks, fire fighters and resources to the hospital fire, right?

You're advocating that both fires be fought equally, same amount of trucks, personal and resources.

They'll start a dumpster fire and fight it as an excuse to not save homes in black neighborhoods.

 

[Further]

That's fair enough, well said.

I think, overall, the Democrat party has used race and racial issues to both forward racism in this country through divide, or to garner votes. I believe, based on what I have seen and heard over the years, that many beliefs and policies forwarded by Democrats have actually divided many black communities by telling them "yes, you ARE inferior to white people and you DO need handouts from the government, so you should trust in the same government that enslaved you and denied you rights for decades."

And that's the lowest of the low, in my opinion. I mean, it's no wonder black people don't trust the government! I sure as fuck wouldn't! Hell, I don't even trust the Government with my Civil Right to own a gun! I can't even imagine what it's like to be denied basic Civil Rights to the point of being a second-class citizen.

Because that is NOT how many black people WANT to be spoken to. They don't want to be told they are inferior. They don't want special treatment. They don't want Government hand-outs or help. And they sure as hell don't want divide by using racist tactics.

So I suppose it works both ways. Like you, I too have heard about the 16% number of racist, and that White Power groups are using robo-calls in areas of the country. And I agree with you: that is below sleazeball; that's just wrong, and none of us should put up with it.

And the same goes for Sanders. Despite my statements otherwise on other threads here, I don't know for certain if Sanders is racist. But dammit, it pisses me right the fuck off when I hear "white people don't know what it's like to be poor." Because I've known TRUE poverty in my life, and I'm white. He's lucky he didn't say that to me; I would have had some choice words for him.

I'm glad we can come to some understandings on this topic, instead of bickering and moaning. It's good to have these conversations without getting all emotional. If we, as a country, want to move forward, and truly put a nail in the coffin of racism, then sooner or later we are going to have to move past this.

It DOES NOT mean that we forget the racism of the past, and stop acknowledging it. It simply means that we come together somehow and acknowledge problems on both sides of the isle and find common-ground and similarities in our differences that we can use to come together and bind up our wounds.

But it's going to take effort from both sides, and it won't happen over night. And I believe that the way it's being done right now is only further dividing this country instead of bringing us together.

I couple things.

The Democrats certainly do use racial issues for votes, just as the Republicans do. Some of those Dems and Repubs may be truly genuine in their statements while others may be purely conniving in their selection of sides and exploitation of racial and other topics for their own political gain. In fact, this is at the heart of why I'm not a Hilary supporter (Although I may end up voting for her) I believe her to be fair weather regarding most issues, no real convictions. I don't see the D's views however as racist in general, but the way some of them may placate one group or another for votes as extremely distasteful.

In all honesty, this is what I see Trump doing, but I see him choosing certain sides that I see as dangerous and racist. So he and Hillary may have the same motives for their political stances, to garner votes, but I see the brown-scare coming from Trump as having deleterious effects on our nation. I am well aware that views of wanting to secure boarders, minimize visas, limiting relations with other nations and many of the other stances can all be easily justified without any racial prejudice. But when those views are all pooled together with statements about women, about the evils Mexicans often bring, concerning the Kenyan birthright of Obama, and a host of other topics they tend to leave me feeling like what's at the root of all this is something more sinister. It also leads the KKK, White separatists and many other extremist groups to vocally endorse Trump.

We don't live in a world where one side own the virtuousness and the other the evilness in life. The lines are blurred for several reasons, there are individuals advocating for their beliefs, there are multiple reasons why one person might hold a single belief. It's a complex issue but I think the least Trump, or Hillary, or Bernie or anyone can do is be blatantly clear regarding their motives. When questioned about Duke and the Klan supporting Trump, there shouldn't have been a moments thought that didn't include condemnation. Sure, hours later Trump said the right things, but this was a long enough time to let the hate groups feel like this guy is really on their side. Nobody decent, be they R or D should for a split second consider not wanting to piss of the Klan. It proved to me that he and Hillary are the same personalities, just that Hillary agrees on the issues with me more.

 

[MarAzul]

Nobody decent, be they R or D should for a split second consider not wanting to piss of the Klan

Bull shit, this is simply righteousness to the point of naive.The Klan was broken and discounted years ago, but whom ever remains you think of as Klan has a right to vote, as do most Americans.
It will be a sad day when the righteous gain the power to decide who votes. If there is a Klansman voting, I hope he votes with me, although I suppose it would be helpful if he bragged about supporting Hillary.

It strikes me as more of a problem having the righteous beginning to determine who is decent by the support they receive from Americans.

 

[riverman]

Bull shit, this is simply righteousness to the point of naive.The Klan was broken and discounted years ago, but whom ever remains you think of as Klan has a right to vote, as do most Americans.
It will be a sad day when the righteous gain the power to decide who votes. If there is a Klansman voting, I hope he votes with me, although I suppose it would be helpful if he bragged about supporting Hillary.

It strikes me as more of a problem having the righteous beginning to determine who is decent by the support they receive from Americans.

He never said they couldn't vote Marz or that he was righteous. Those are your definitions which are sort of calling his stance bullshit, naïve...isn't that in fact determining decency?

 

[MarAzul]

sn't that in fact determining decency

nope.

 

[Denny Crane]

Hillary, when asked about her emails during tonight's debate.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Hillary, when asked about her emails during tonight's debate.

I remember during the 2008 election cycle a big deal being made over Obama using a Black Berry to check his emails. It would be interesting to see if Hillary ever said anything about this.

 

[Denny Crane]

I remember during the 2008 election cycle a big deal being made over Obama using a Black Berry to check his emails. It would be interesting to see if Hillary ever said anything about this.

As candidate, they can use whatever they like.

Blackberry was also likely approved to access the government email system.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

As candidate, they can use whatever they like.

Blackberry was also likely approved to access the government email system.

When Obama became pres Blackberry built a super secret one for him.

 

[Denny Crane]

When Obama became pres Blackberry built a super secret one for him.

I'm pretty sure the blackberry OS was secure enough for government purposes.

 

[Denny Crane]

http://us.blackberry.com/enterprise/industries/government.html

 

[Denny Crane]

Haha. Hillarity looks really bad.

http://electrospaces.blogspot.com/2013/04/how-obamas-blackberry-got-secured.html