G Damian Lillard, F LaMarcus Aldridge selected as All-Star reserves!

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RoyToy said:
That Lance Stephenson is a more talented player than Batum on offense. More natural ability.

He can handle the ball, create his own shot and get to the rim + create for others. He can do it on a much more consistent basis than Batum (and Kawhi Leonard)
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So you're backing away from Lance being more talented overall?
 
Natebishop3 said:
Isn't that exactly what you're saying when you say one is much more talented than the other?
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A guy like J.R. Smith has more natural talent on offense than Batum. That doesn't mean I would trade J.R. Smith for Batum, or that I think J.R. Smith is better than Batum.
 
RoyToy said:
A guy like J.R. Smith has more natural talent on offense than Batum. That doesn't mean I would trade J.R. Smith for Batum, or that I think J.R. Smith is better than Batum.
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Okay now that's hilarious. You think J.R. Smith has more natural talent on offense than Batum?
 
Natebishop3 said:
So you are backing away from your claim that he's more talented overall?
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So now you're putting words in my mouth.

I already said I never made that claim. Even after the confusion I showed it's clear I was talking about offense.
 
RoyToy said:
No question.
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By what metric are you judging this? Because JR Smith is a streaky shooter who can hit a few shots? I mean.... seriously man..... he's having a HORRIBLE season.

He's shooting 37% from the field. He's shooting 60% from the line. Batum is pretty much dominating him in every way this season. I really have no idea how you think he's better than Nic at anything on offense.
 
RoyToy said:
So now you're putting words in my mouth.

I already said I never made that claim. Even after the confusion I showed it's clear I was talking about offense.
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Didn't need to put words in your mouth. I linked your post. Black and white. No qualifiers.
 
Natebishop3 said:
By what metric are you judging this? Because JR Smith is a streaky shooter who can hit a few shots? I mean.... seriously man..... he's having a HORRIBLE season.

He's shooting 37% from the field. He's shooting 60% from the line. Batum is pretty much dominating him in every way this season. I really have no idea how you think he's better than Nic at anything on offense.
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I guess you just don't get what I mean when I use the word talent

Talent = natural ability. It's not something you judge by looking at various stats. This is only judged by watching the player.

There are a lot of guys with a lot of talent that never do anything in the NBA because of various reason (work ethic, maturity, etc). A guy like Anthony Randolph epitomizes this. Remember Terrence Williams?
 
I think everyone has heard the difference between "talent" and "skill"

Talent - what you're naturally born with. Your natural ability.

Skill - what you acquire over the years from working on your game.
 
RoyToy said:
I guess you just don't get what I mean when I use the word talent

Talent = natural ability. It's not something you judge by looking at various stats. This is only judged by watching the player.

There are a lot of guys with a lot of talent that never do anything in the NBA because of various reason (work ethic, maturity, etc). A guy like Anthony Randolph epitomizes this. Remember Terrence Williams?
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And I think you're trying to shrink down offensive ability to just scoring the basketball, and it's not that simple. I think Nic is one of the most naturally gifted players in the league, but it's desire (not talent) that's holding him back. He is lacking the killer instinct that makes someone like Durant great. He could be much better than he is right now, but that has nothing to do with being limited by talent. That's what drives some people nuts about him. They want him to have something in his head click so that he'll start playing more like Dame or LA, but that's not who he is.

I guess I just don't understand how you don't see how rare it is for a guy like Nic, or Lance to come along and do so many things so well. It's not common for a guy to be able to be a threat to put up a triple double every night. Guys like JR Smith are a dime a dozen. There's a bunch of guys who can score in the league. There are very few guys who can do what Nic and Lance do.

I think the game comes too easily to Nic, and that's why he is the way he is. If he had to work harder to get to where he is, he would probably feel very differently. Dame is Dame because people doubted him his whole life. Nic is one of those guys that was just born with a ton of basketball talent. If he ever puts it all together, he could be one of the best players in the league. He just doesn't have that desire. I've come to accept him for who he is.
 
I guess where we differ is I don't see a ton of talent when I look at Batum, and it mostly comes back to him not being able to handle the basketball that well, especially against pressure. And at 6-9 with long arms, it's disappointing to see that his post game is non-existent. Wesley Matthews has more of a post game than Nic.

We do agree that he lacks a "killer instinct". I've been saying that for years. I think everyone has. I feel at times he lacks toughness as well.

That Euro reputation really seems to fit him.
 
RoyToy said:
I guess where we differ is I don't see a ton of talent when I look at Batum, and it mostly comes back to him not being able to handle the basketball that well, especially against pressure. And at 6-9 with long arms, it's disappointing to see that his post game is non-existent. Wesley Matthews has more of a post game than Nic.

We do agree that he lacks a "killer instinct". I've been saying that for years. I think everyone has. I feel at times he lacks toughness as well.

That Euro reputation really seems to fit him.
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How many players in the league are averaging 12.6 ppg, 5.6 assists, 6.6 rebounds, and 1 steal?

Rounding DOWN, at 12 PPG, 5 assists, 6 rebounds, and 1 steal, there are THREE players in the league with similar or better numbers.

LeBron James
Kevin Durant
Nic Batum

Yup. I don't see a ton of talent there.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Yay, a thread that started out about having two Blazers on the all-star team for the first time in 20 years now has 5 pages of bickering over two tertiary players who aren't all-stars.

A couple guys on ESPN named Lillard as the West's "biggest surprise" (ie, least deserving all-star). Anyone have any thoughts on that?
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Good post as the other talk is getting boring now

Reading the link it sounds like they picked Lillard just to pick someone.

Overall I think this has been the least controversial all-star selections in recent memory
 
RoyToy said:
I guess where we differ is I don't see a ton of talent when I look at Batum, and it mostly comes back to him not being able to handle the basketball that well, especially against pressure. And at 6-9 with long arms, it's disappointing to see that his post game is non-existent. Wesley Matthews has more of a post game than Nic.

We do agree that he lacks a "killer instinct". I've been saying that for years. I think everyone has. I feel at times he lacks toughness as well.

That Euro reputation really seems to fit him.
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[video=youtube;uF7sKgFGeqk]

Not a great ball handler? He's got a higher turnover to assist ratio than your boy Stephenson...
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Yay, a thread that started out about having two Blazers on the all-star team for the first time in 20 years now has 5 pages of bickering over two tertiary players who aren't all-stars.

A couple guys on ESPN named Lillard as the West's "biggest surprise" (ie, least deserving all-star). Anyone have any thoughts on that?
Click to expand...

I think he could be, only because of how he was playing at the end before the break. He's slumping right now, but his overall stats and the team's record put him in. The Spurs are struggling right now too.
 
Natebishop3 said:
How many players in the league are averaging 12.6 ppg, 5.6 assists, 6.6 rebounds, and 1 steal?

Rounding DOWN, at 12 PPG, 5 assists, 6 rebounds, and 1 steal, there are THREE players in the league with similar or better numbers.

LeBron James
Kevin Durant
Nic Batum

Yup. I don't see a ton of talent there.
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What is it w/o stls in there?

I ask because Nic has a whole 14 more stls than Lance in 40+ games. That doesn't seem very significant.
 
Davis and Cousins are casualties of their team's records. There are simply too many gifted players on too many quality teams for a guy like Davis or Cousins to make it. When Tim Duncan doesn't get the nod, you know it was a tough decision. I figured that guy was going to be an All-Star until he retired, simply because the Spurs keep winning.
 
RoyToy said:
What is it w/o stls in there?

I ask because Nic has a whole 14 more stls than Lance in 40+ games. That doesn't seem very significant.
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Lance makes the list without steals. So there are four players in the league doing what Lance and Nic are doing. Nobody is saying Lance isn't a really good player, we just want you to admit that Nic is just as talented.
 
It think it helped Lillard a lot with the coaches that the Blazers greatly exceeded expectations and grabbed everyone's attention. They were the talk of the league during the first couple months of the season. The coaches were paying attention during the stretch were Lillard was dominating, and it apparently made a lasting impression - way more of one than I would have guessed.
 
Natebishop3 said:
Lance makes the list without steals. So there are four players in the league doing what Lance and Nic are doing. Nobody is saying Lance isn't a really good player, we just want you to admit that Nic is just as talented.
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On offense he isn't.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Yay, a thread that started out about having two Blazers on the all-star team for the first time in 20 years now has 5 pages of bickering over two tertiary players who aren't all-stars.

A couple guys on ESPN named Lillard as the West's "biggest surprise" (ie, least deserving all-star). Anyone have any thoughts on that?
Click to expand...

Some of us said that Dragic and/or Conley area at least as deserving. I even posted in another thread that Dragic deserved it over Lillard. Then again, we're not coaches, and we don't vote on it. So, what's your point? :dunno:
 
They're still talking about Stephenson as an All-Star snub, yet Ernie mentions that Detlef Schrempf also had 4 3dubs by the AS break one year.

Then Chuck blows it by saying that Noah should have been an AS, while saying earlier he shouldn't. It's entertainment, sure, but it's ridiculous, too.
 
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