Game 1

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Rangers94 said:
Ok, so after having a night to absorb I honestly feel like MSL needs to go back to the third line, move Miller or Kreider to line one. D pairings need to be McD/Girardi (EVERYTIME OV IS ON THE ICE, NOT LIKE LAST NIGHT) Staal/Hunwick, Klein/Yandle. I don't let Boyle near the ice, and if we had someone to replace MSL out there he wouldn't see the ice either. They're good for their locker room leadership, but on the ice they are both huge liabilities.
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I couldn't agree with you more on MSL. I didn't like breaking up the Miller/Hayes/MSL line at all. Should have left that line together and the Step line together. Move Fast or Sheppard up.

As for the D, I have no issue putting Hunwick in for Boyle, I just don't think it happens. To me on the PK it should be McD/G and Staal/Klein that is all. As we get into the 3rd if the game is tied or we're ahead, those pairs should be the top 2. Yandle/Boyle should be put out there every 5th or 6th d shift. When we are behind I can see playing Boyle more with Staal since we need to score (and then Yandle/Klein).

Hopefully tomorrow we'll see a little line juggling and MSL back on the 3rd line.
 
They can certainly change things this playoff year but Washington with Ovechkin have a lot of playoff choke jobs on their resume. That's why they're playing up on television how much more of a leader he is this year and all the things he's doing. Forget the fact that this is his tenth season. I'm sorry but he's not suddenly Mark Messier because they won a game seven against the Islanders in round one.
 
I've been saying it for a while now, but there's simply NO WAY I bring MSL back next year. He's done. He has nothing left in the tank. We all thought maybe his injury would help because he'd be rested, but he's not. He looks his age. He's slow skating, he's slow decision making, he's slow shooting. He's at least two steps slower than he needs to be in these playoffs. I wouldn't bring him back for free. And if Zucc's injury is as serious as it possibly seems, we will need to sign a good winger and hope one of our young guys is ready to come up and be productive.
 
As for my morning after the Rangers should be ashamed and embarrassed and that better show with a much better effort in game two. Also, AV needs to stop his blind allegiance to guys like Boyle. Boyle is doing absolutely nothing except hurting this team yet he's out there in huge spots such as the penalty kill which lead to a goal and the end of the game which lead to a goal. I realize they iced the puck so couldn't change up the players in the final seconds but why was Boyle out there instead of Girardi to begin with?
 
Rangers94 said:
I've been saying it for a while now, but there's simply NO WAY I bring MSL back next year. He's done. He has nothing left in the tank. We all thought maybe his injury would help because he'd be rested, but he's not. He looks his age. He's slow skating, he's slow decision making, he's slow shooting. He's at least two steps slower than he needs to be in these playoffs. I wouldn't bring him back for free. And if Zucc's injury is as serious as it possibly seems, we will need to sign a good winger and hope one of our young guys is ready to come up and be productive.
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I think there's a better chance he retires than the Rangers bring him back.
 
I find myself being a bigger Giants fan than a Rangers fan now. Never used to be that way.
 
I thought MSL did better after the first period. He got some chances but could not bury one like everyone else. I agree AV had a questionable game but how is his fault that these guys can't finish in the playoffs all of sudden? I am 100% sure, AV will bounce back with a better coached game. Also, Holtby was really good all night. He is a much better goalie at this point than the last time we beat them. Not having Zucc freaking sucks.
Lets play game 2 already.
 
Messiah717 said:
As for my morning after the Rangers should be ashamed and embarrassed and that better show with a much better effort in game two. Also, AV needs to stop his blind allegiance to guys like Boyle. Boyle is doing absolutely nothing except hurting this team yet he's out there in huge spots such as the penalty kill which lead to a goal and the end of the game which lead to a goal. I realize they iced the puck so couldn't change up the players in the final seconds but why was Boyle out there instead of Girardi to begin with?
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It wasn't an icing. The Rangers were offsides and changed their line and AV actually put Boyle out there for that scenario.
 
AV did not have his best game. I still believe he is a better coach than Trotz though
 
Stepupstepan said:
AV did not have his best game. I still believe he is a better coach than Trotz though
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I agree he's the better coach and yes he certainly didn't have a good one last night. Boyle hasn't been good all season so I don't get the obsession. He played right into Ovechkin's hands on Washington's first goal. Get right in his face instead of going backwards and you don't allow him to get off that wrist shot.
 
chuckd3534 said:
Wait, no one ever said he wasn't a beast or a great player. He 100% is a tank and led the NHL by a MILE in hits by a forward. So yeah he is all those things.

With that said, I think it is crazy to compare a guy who has never been past round 2 to an all-time great with 6 cups. And I also think it is BS to say oh the supporting cast. That is BS for sure. Last I checked the Caps have won the Pres trophy with OV...and wnt nowhere. Had home ice in series many times...and lost. Won their division many times...and lost early. So stop with the oh the supporting cast BS.

Now were his teams as good as Mess' teams, HELL NO, but no team is nearly as talented or loaded as teams in the 80's and 90's pre cap. The NHL is way different now.

So yeah awesome player. A tank and a beast on the ice. But I cannot compare a guy who has never played in the 3rd round to an all-time great with 6 cups. Can't do it.
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So Hasek isn't Elite since he couldn't get his team to the finals year in and year out.
Hank isn't elite goalie either...but Dryden was all time best...Billy Smith all time best...

To throw away the fact Messier played with the greatest player the game has ever seen doesn't discount anything?
Come on..really.

Dan Marino not as good as Dilfer because Dan didn't win a ring.
Marino not as good as Jim Kelly because he didn't bring the phins to 4 Super Bowls?

No I in team. You can be a great leader but that brings to only a point. Guy is a point a game playoff perfomer.

Are they fluffying Ovie like they did with Crosby, yes a little...but I find Ovie's game to be very similar to Messier
 
All the faith in the world in AV, in that he will come up with a solution for the deep hole the zookster left, I also believe the rangers had too much time off , and the injury to zook and retur n of Klein created some hesitation on the ice,

the individuals that are being called out. Only 1 I believe is justified, Boyle, should see limited time , the rest will come through, Nash plays both ends well, it ain't easy scoring goals in PS play, just ask stamkos, and as far as st Louis goes, that's not the line he has played on, he has something left, he saving it! Lundy played very well.. One thing the rangers did consistently last nite and it ended up costing them the game, play it forward for gosh sakes when the puck was taken deeper into our own zone when they had nothing to lose by attacking with no time on clock for the rangers to do anything, I lost my breath, then bang, game over.

Tuff 1 to sleep on
 
What? Who said the word elite? Hank is elite. Hasek was elite. OV is elite. I think you are all over the map here Al. No one said the word elite until you mentioned it. Did anyone say those guys aren't elite? If someone did by all means please point it out.

All I said was do not compare OV to Mess when OV hasn't been out of the 2nd round in his career. He is a stud player that's for darn sure, and I'll never take that away from him.

And Hank simply cannot be greater than Roy or Brodeur with zero cups, just cannot happen in this case.

And here is why your Marino/Dilfer comment is off base, you are taking a journeyman player and comparing him to a half of famer. In this situation you are taking an all-time great like Mess with SIX cups and comparing him to a great elite player who has NEVER EVER been out of the 2nd round.

Comparing Dilfer/Marino to OV/Hank is like comparing apples to bowling balls.

And if your point is they play a similar game, sure you can "compare" them in that way, but to me that is not what Trotz is doing. I can also say Andrew Ladd plays a similar game to Messier as well. Sounds good.

But the overall player/level of player/level of leader simply cannot be compared when talking OV and Mess. Let OV get to a CF before we put him in the same conversation as Messier.
 
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Chuck is lost on this.

Trotz did not say OV is as great as Messier from a career perspective and was not comparing the 2 from a success standpoint, he was simply stating HIS STYLE OF PLAY is similar to Messier's.

“He’s very similar to Mark Messier,” Capitals coach Barry Trotz said after Washington’s stunning 2-1 victory. “That rare talent that can play a very heavy game, intimidate you with his speed, intimidate you with his skill and his physicality.”

How is this related to career achievements?
 
I will refrain from the rude comments...I know that is your bag though...LOL.

If you are simply talking about style of play and only style of play, sure they play a similar style. So does Andrew Ladd. So does Lucic.

I do not think that is what Tortz was saying though. I think he was comparing OV to Mess on a much bigger scale than simply style of play. If he wasn't why pick an all-time great like Mess? Why not take a player playing today like Andrew Ladd? Like other big physical scoring forwards? Because I 100% think Tortz was comparing OV as a great and he plays not another great...Messier. And to me OV couldn't carry Mess' jock.

Either way no one threw the word elite around other than Al. No one said OV wasn't elite today, he is.

But that's a takedown...LOL. Good to have you back posting 31. At least you are staying true to yourself...:).
 
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Again Chuck, his DIRECT QUOTE was comparing the style of play. YOU then assumed/thought the comparison was on a much bigger scale, but that's part of your own little world, because nothing in the quote posted makes any reference to anything other than his style of play.

As to why he didn't make the comparison to Ladd or Lucic, i wonder if picking a former Ranger to compare style of play has something to do with them playing the Rangers in this playoff round. Heck, you never know.

But keep telling us what Trotz really meant to say, lol.
 
I don't think that is the case. I think he picked a player of Messier's level to compare OV to because he feels he's on that level.

We all know you and I don't EVER agree on anything, so let's just add this to the list and move on...LOL.
 
and i forgot to mention stepan, did he think that was a preseason game last nite?
 
chuckd3534 said:
What? Who said the word elite? Hank is elite. Hasek was elite. OV is elite. I think you are all over the map here Al. No one said the word elite until you mentioned it. Did anyone say those guys aren't elite? If someone did by all means please point it out.

All I said was do not compare OV to Mess when OV hasn't been out of the 2nd round in his career. He is a stud player that's for darn sure, and I'll never take that away from him.

And Hank simply cannot be greater than Roy or Brodeur with zero cups, just cannot happen in this case.

And here is why your Marino/Dilfer comment is off base, you are taking a journeyman player and comparing him to a half of famer. In this situation you are taking an all-time great like Mess with SIX cups and comparing him to a great elite player who has NEVER EVER been out of the 2nd round.

Comparing Dilfer/Marino to OV/Hank is like comparing apples to bowling balls.

And if your point is they play a similar game, sure you can "compare" them in that way, but to me that is not what Trotz is doing. I can also say Andrew Ladd plays a similar game to Messier as well. Sounds good.

But the overall player/level of player/level of leader simply cannot be compared when talking OV and Mess. Let OV get to a CF before we put him in the same conversation as Messier.
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You said you can not compare OV to a player of Messier's stature because Mess has 6 cups. Greg Gilbert has 2 cups and 4 final appearances, does that make him better than OV. That is where I am comparing the Marino with Dilfer and Marino with Kelly. Can you say that OV's teams should have gone further, perhaps. I haven't gone through all the teams that the Caps lost to, well we know 2 of those times were against the Rangers.

The style OV plays, plus in the commentators opinion the current leadership qualities, has him comparing OV to Messier for you to say its way off base to me, in my opinion, would be incorrect.
 
I think we can stop beating this to death. They're down 1-0 and need to win tomorrow. Who gives a shit about this.
 
Can they just dress up Messier for the next game and have Messier elbow Ovie in his head? I would love to see that.
 
I'm with Mess here, we have more important things to discuss/focus on. Although I will say this was a good topic to distract us from being down 1-0.

As for tomorrow, must win game and I would expect this team to show up with a strong effort. AV will coach a better game playing Klein more and Boyle less. Moving MSL off the 1st line. And hopefully someone will get these guys to shoot the puck more and crash the net.
 
From Brett Cyrgalis. So I guess I am not the only one who thinks it was much deeper than Tortz saying his style of play is similar to Messier:


So that leaves us with what Trotz said on Thursday. The comparison to Mark Messier sounded like such a stretch (or a little dig at Rangers fans) because Messier was the consummate leader. Guy had a ring in Edmonton at the age of 23, and his sixth at the age of 33. The final one was on Broadway in 1994, when Messier’s game looked absolutely nothing like the game that Ovechkin played on Thursday.


But I digress...LOL.
 
Awesome to see AV call out the NHL for their bogus officiating regarding the Caps and boarding calls.
 
He did, but I also don't want him to become a whiner. He said what he needed to, now we need to move on and play hockey. All that matters.
 
Rangers94 said:
Mostly because in the playoffs you score more ugly goals and you need to crash the net. This team is allergic to that. They stay outside, shoot from far out and have no one down low screening or looking for the ugly goal. Everyone wants the pretty goal, and that's where AV's system hurts. It's not a gritty, ugly goal scoring system. It's a stretch pass, use your speed and get pretty goals type of system. There's a reason he didn't win a Cup in Vancouver. He's a great coach, but his system needs a few tweaks to be a great playoff system. Look at the Ducks. They're up 5-0 and they've scored ugly goals and have attacked the net and been aggressive.
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The Kings last year. It should be simple. Play tough defense, skate hard, hit even harder, and when you get the puck into the offense zone, throw the puck towards the goal and get bodies in front of the net. That's a winning combination ...
 
Good start to the 2nd round in the East. Both home teams (NYR and Habs) lose very tough 2-1 games. Us with 1.3 seconds left and Montreal in double OT. Tough L's to come back from, but both teams face pretty much must wins in game 2. Interesting to see if both/either team gets it done.
 
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