Game Thread GAME# 22: KINGS @ BLAZERS - DECEMBER 4, 2019 - WEDNESDAY, 7:00 PM, NBCSNW

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Do you want the Blazers to tank for a good lotto pick at this point in the season?

  • Total voters
    36
  • Poll closed .
SIeepwalker said:
Everytime we pass the ball more than 2 time in a possession we get a wide open shot. I wish we would do that more often.
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I was counting for a bit last night. They do get a better look with three passes no question but it's not just one player. CJ takes a bunch of blame but Dame also seems to be a culprit. The Blazer guards could drive and kick a bit more. I understand why they don't. They got used to Aminu and Harkless missing wide open looks. Hood, Melo and Baze have been hitting those shots so it's got to change. The Guards need to continue to find open shooters. Also Whiteside is starting to see the floor a bit more and get used to where shooters are.
 
It should be noted that it's easier to "move the ball around" against an injured Kings team or a young Bulls team than it is against a skilled defensive team like the Clippers.

Let's see how much we're going to "get everyone touches" against the Lakers, while Rondo is yelling Terry's playbook to his teammates on every possession.:bgrin:


And another thing - We need a tough PF who gets rebounds and can switch. We needed it for 2 years now. Maybe we should chase Tristan Thompson.
 
kjironman1 said:
I was counting for a bit last night. They do get a better look with three passes no question but it's not just one player. CJ takes a bunch of blame but Dame also seems to be a culprit. The Blazer guards could drive and kick a bit more. I understand why they don't. They got used to Aminu and Harkless missing wide open looks. Hood, Melo and Baze have been hitting those shots so it's got to change. The Guards need to continue to find open shooters. Also Whiteside is starting to see the floor a bit more and get used to where shooters are.
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Most of the people decrying the lack of passing blame it on Stotts' offense rather than on CJ. However, it's certainly been nice to see an uptick in ball-movement.
 
kjironman1 said:
I was counting for a bit last night. They do get a better look with three passes no question but it's not just one player. CJ takes a bunch of blame but Dame also seems to be a culprit. The Blazer guards could drive and kick a bit more. I understand why they don't. They got used to Aminu and Harkless missing wide open looks. Hood, Melo and Baze have been hitting those shots so it's got to change. The Guards need to continue to find open shooters. Also Whiteside is starting to see the floor a bit more and get used to where shooters are.
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Yes, I've seen a bit of early in the shot clock contested 2 from Dame and I was shaking my head at those too. There's no point.

Also we seem to do some drive-kick-shoot, but never something like drive-kick-swing-swing-shoot which could potentially result in a better shot. All of our starting lineup except whiteside is a shooting threat and we need to take advantage of that
 
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kjironman1 said:
I was counting for a bit last night. They do get a better look with three passes no question but it's not just one player. CJ takes a bunch of blame but Dame also seems to be a culprit. The Blazer guards could drive and kick a bit more. I understand why they don't. They got used to Aminu and Harkless missing wide open looks. Hood, Melo and Baze have been hitting those shots so it's got to change. The Guards need to continue to find open shooters. Also Whiteside is starting to see the floor a bit more and get used to where shooters are.
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I'd rather we collapse the defense by passing the ball to the interior rather than driving, but that requires a package of good, creative, and different sets that we don't quite have. Dame and CJ aren't going to be able to consistently break down the defense, draw multiple defenders, and then complete the kickout pass, and our ball movement shouldn't be reliant on them having to do that, which I think it is. Look at the Clippers game and how we didn't move the ball at all.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Most of the people decrying the lack of passing blame it on Stotts' offense rather than on CJ. However, it's certainly been nice to see an uptick in ball-movement.
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I honestly think the reasons are pretty obvious. Dame has been making passes, but watching open look after open look clank off the top of the backboard year in and year out gets old. Lillard is human. He wants to win. To do that you have to stay in the game. Look at the Clipper game. There was easy 5 mins or more where wide open looks from three just didn't fall. Then they couldn't contain Harrell. As the lead got bigger and bigger Dame started pushing. Next thing you know "Hero Ball"!
This is where i do blame Stotts. He has got to call a timeout and rally the team. Draw up a play and get the offense a bucket. I don't care if you have to call two TO's in a minute. Get something to work. Even three???? Who cares? If you go 20 or more down in the last 10 mins of a game you are done anyway when its against a team as good as the Clippers.
 
BonesJones said:
I'd rather we collapse the defense by passing the ball to the interior rather than driving, but that requires a package of good, creative, and different sets that we don't quite have. Dame and CJ aren't going to be able to consistently break down the defense, draw multiple defenders, and then complete the kickout pass, and our ball movement shouldn't be reliant on them having to do that, which I think it is. Look at the Clippers game and how we didn't move the ball at all.
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They do draw multiple defenders but yes i agree. We also watched the beginnings of another set of plays i hope Stotts starts to use. That is Melo posting up and looking for an open shooter or a cutter. Maybe we will see more? I hope so?
 
BonesJones said:
I'd rather we collapse the defense by passing the ball to the interior rather than driving, but that requires a package of good, creative, and different sets that we don't quite have. Dame and CJ aren't going to be able to consistently break down the defense, draw multiple defenders, and then complete the kickout pass, and our ball movement shouldn't be reliant on them having to do that, which I think it is. Look at the Clippers game and how we didn't move the ball at all.
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The Clipper game was indeed a textbook on what they need to work on for sure. I think they have the weapons but it's gonna take some time to get better at using what they have?
 
kjironman1 said:
The Clipper game was indeed a textbook on what they need to work on for sure. I think they have the weapons but it's gonna take some time to get better at using what they have?
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What makes the Clippers so tough this year is their extremely deep bench. We would likely be a serious contender with the Clippers bench.
 
Blazers Roy said:
It should be noted that it's easier to "move the ball around" against an injured Kings team or a young Bulls team than it is against a skilled defensive team like the Clippers.

Let's see how much we're going to "get everyone touches" against the Lakers, while Rondo is yelling Terry's playbook to his teammates on every possession.:bgrin:


And another thing - We need a tough PF who gets rebounds and can switch. We needed it for 2 years now. Maybe we should chase Tristan Thompson.
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The problem against the Clippers we they didn't even try to move the ball.
 
James lamphear said:
The problem against the Clippers we they didn't even try to move the ball.
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I factor Clippers defense for a lot of that. We did a decent job in the first half but Clippers stepped up their defense in the second half and they are able to match up with length and size against our two better players in Lillard and McCollum to make it more difficult to make the entry pass and get the ball moving.
 
kjironman1 said:
Maybe one that just won 4 of the last 5 games? Just a thought?
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Yeah against garbage teams, i'm not saying that he should go James Harden and take 40 shots, but we can not afford our best best player being passive for long stretches. You a Superstar Dame, so play like one
 
Blazers Roy said:
It should be noted that it's easier to "move the ball around" against an injured Kings team or a young Bulls team than it is against a skilled defensive team like the Clippers.

Let's see how much we're going to "get everyone touches" against the Lakers, while Rondo is yelling Terry's playbook to his teammates on every possession.:bgrin:


And another thing - We need a tough PF who gets rebounds and can switch. We needed it for 2 years now. Maybe we should chase Tristan Thompson.
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When a defense is really good like the Clippers it's even more important to have crisp ball movement. Otherwise you're going ISO against guys like Paul George, Kawhi Leonard, and Patrick Beverley. Unless that seems like a good strategy to anyone?
 
H.C. said:
Maybe Stotts will employ the Kahwi Leonard defense.
Leave the corner man wide open in hopes he misses the three.
I'm sure Kuz or Danny Green will oblige with misses right?
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The corner three is the hardest shot to hit because you don't have a backboard to bounce the ball off of. It is a sound strategy.
 
Labinot41 said:
Yeah against garbage teams, i'm not saying that he should go James Harden and take 40 shots, but we can not afford our best best player being passive for long stretches. You a Superstar Dame, so play like one
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This is such a horrendous take.

Dame having to score like 20 points in a quarter to beat bad teams is going to result in both more losses and Dame getting more worn out. The dude scored 60 points in a game and they lost.

If Dame consistently got 10 assists and 24 points on 12 shots he'd not only be the most efficient star in the NBA but the team would be true contenders for a title.
 
THE HCP said:
CJ tonight ties his career high with 10 straight games with 20+ points.
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Impressive. We was hard on this dude including myself in the beginning of the season. I can’t believe we wanted to trade this dude and hand the job to Simons. Ant is not that good.
 
noknobs said:
If you're judging him by his last 4.25 seasons, as I am, then I'm not sure how you can dislike him so much.
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wut? I'm not the only one critical of CJ. There are lots of people who don't like CJ's game. And I'm confident everybody here is judging him based on the last 4.25 season. It's no surprise at all that people have reached different subjective conclusions about CJ. I mean, there are even a few posters here who trash Dame all the time....although one them trashes Dame as a way to defend CJ

noknobs said:
He's been consistently a top ten SG for five seasons now and has career averages of 45.5 FG%, 40 3P% and 83.8 FT%... That's 433 games, not 10.
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top-10?...maybe...probably...barely...ok

here's the thing: Ive been trashed for years (4.25?) in this CJ debate for using stats to support my assertions. But every person trashing me uses stats to support their assertions...every single one, just about every single time. And you just did the same thing. Raw shooting percentages are stats; mid-range shooting percentages are stats; 10 game sample-sizes are stats. They are limited stats that don't tell the whole story, but still stats

I tend to use more than just raw shooting stats to try and develop a broader picture. And I've been derogatorily called something like a "stat-head" in this very thread....by somebody who has used stats

You're right, I dislike CJ's game. But more than that is I've always disliked his mesh with Dame. They are way too redundant as a starting back-court and their mesh has settled into my-turn-your-turn iso ball; and since they dominate the ball, that dominates the offense, and it's ugly a lot of the time. Dame and Matthews had a much better offensive synergy and Matthews could play the defense that CJ can't. Dame and Nurkic developed a greater synergy in 2 weeks than Dame and CJ have in 4 years. Dame and Melo have developed a better synergy in 7 games. CJ doesn't seem to really develop synergy with anybody

I'd be ok with a different CJ....one who was coached to play to his strengths, which is a lot more spot-up and catch and shoot; step backs and 1-2 dribble moves. One who significantly increased his assisted FG rate while reducing his ball-stopping and over-dribbling. That would be a much better CJ, but for 4 of those 4.25 years, the trends have been headed the opposite direction. I will admit he seems to be making a conscious effort to share the ball more over the last few weeks and pound the ball less. A step in the right direction. We'll see if that continues
 
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THE HCP said:
My sources tell me this actually IS Coach Stotts.
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Of course its me John. Who else would it be? That is why I had Dale set up my account with my real name so everyone would know that I am actually reading your posts. I care about the fans, I'm here for them. Although I must say some of these guys go a bit far with the criticism!
 
Terry Stotts said:
Of course its me John. Who else would it be? That is why I had Dale set up my account with my real name so everyone would know that I am actually reading your posts. I care about the fans, I'm here for them. Although I must say some of these guys go a bit far with the criticism!
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John....you've finally figured out a way to like your own posts! Took years but, congrats!
 
hoopsjock said:
When a defense is really good like the Clippers it's even more important to have crisp ball movement. Otherwise you're going ISO against guys like Paul George, Kawhi Leonard, and Patrick Beverley. Unless that seems like a good strategy to anyone?
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Look, i'm not out there on the court so i call it as i see it.
I'm saying going 1 on 1 against PG,Kawai and Beverley might seem easier for them than to pass the ball. Maybe they feel as if their passing lanes are not open?

I just think there's a reason we pass less against tall,skilled defensive teams. We saw the same ball movement (or lack-thereof) against AD,Rondo and Holiday.

A lot of our passes are transparent too, i can guess where the ball is going and i'm just a fan.
 
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