Gordie Clark

[mrmel29]

No longer head of personnel. Now moved in a front office scouting capacity. The new hire here will be very important to see who drury goes with. Clark is 68 and it’s time.

 

[Ranger71]

He seemed to have gotten a bit lazy with it in the last few years.

 

[kreidertime]

I just think Clark was too Euro happy. JD changed the way they drafted his first season. I really don't think Dolan wanted to fire JD but he made him because of his Gorton stance. I think Huska is going to follow the Talbot career path and will eventually be an outstanding backup goalie. So, Georgiev IMO will be dealt in the next 2 years. That was a good pick by Clark. I think Drury is going to draft players like him over the next few years which is really what this team needs to fill out the bottom 6 up front. I can see him absolutely trading for Jack Drury from the Canes. Teams have a trading history.

 

[Ranger71]

Isn't that his nephew? The team needs to draft more Canadien prospects to even out all the Swedes and Russians. Laf and Schneider were great starts but they were layups too.

 

[mrmel29]

That kravtsov pick instead of Wahlstrom bothered me then but really bothers me now. Wahlstrom is a man who plays a physical game with a big shot!

 

[NYR Fan]

I think Kravtsov has a higher ceiling than Wahlstrom. I rather have him if I were picking today. Now I do agree we obviously can use more grit/toghness, and Wahlstrom has more of that in his game than Kravtsov does, but we can add that elsewhere.

I think Kravtsov has a chance to be very good in 2 or 3 years, and reach a higher level than Wahlstrom. Plus Kravtsov does have some bite and feistiness to his game. He doesn't strike me as a soft guy.

 

[NYR2009]

Wahlstrom is playing on a 3rd line with Pageau and Palmeri, two vets. Our genious former coach played Kravtsov on the 4th line with Howden and Ges. I wonder how Kravtsov would fair with Palmeri and Paguau. Hopefully, we will get some players who will help these kids with a new coach.

 

[Greyvtrayn]

Kravtsov has actually played only 19 games in his entire NHL career and he played with several different line mates including Panarin and Strome. So there's that.

 

[kreidertime]

Wahlstrom is a bad skater. His goal today was put in by a Pitt teammate. He’s the type of player that will never generate any offense by himself. Quinn was a fucking idiot with young offensive forwards if they hire the right coach you’ll see the difference

 

[NYR Fan]

Once again, look at all the young forwards that played, and clearly improved their complete game under Quinn. But let's not let that get in the way of the nonsense peddling.

And yeah, I would expect a difference because they all went through a full season of NHL play, experience, and learning. And Kravtsov got an opportunity to play in the NHL and get his feet wet. If they don't show a difference as they mature, it would be a huge upset.

But that narrative is next I have no doubt. Of course the kids will keep improving as they play more NHL games, that's how this works, and then it will be see what a real coach does. The narrative is already written for most of you. Time to move on from Quinn in here.

 

[NYR2009]

grey, please stop with that crap. Quinn did not play Kravtsov on the second line, he gave a few looks on the second line for a period or so, a few shifts. There was one game that he played a full game on the second line, and he did very well actually, but after Quinn went back with Blackwell. Quinn did a horrible job with the youth. Kakko should have been on the second line with Panarin and Strom all season, from the beginning, and LFA should have been on the first line with Z all season. This was the year of developing kids, not trying to win games and make playoffs.

And please stop with the whole Fox and Lingren, etc...Fox is a Norris Trophy candidate and they both came into NHL much older than Kakko, LFA, Kravstov. They were already developed by the top they got here. I don't give Quinn any credit for the youth, none! He has done a poor job of developing kids and Gorton could have signed a vet center, like Eric Staal to help kids this year. I would have been perfectly okay with Eric Staal playing with Kakko or LFA.

I have full confidence in Drury, and I think this team will compete for the cup as soon as next year. I understand it is an overstatement, but they have the picks that will never make this team bring in players who will transform this team into a contender.

 

[NYR Fan]

Once again - young player does well, I give Quinn no credit. Young player has ups and downs, like young players do as they learn how to play in the NHL, it's all Quinn's fault.

Okay - this has all been established and talked about over and over and over again. Everyone knows where each poster stands on this. Can we please move on from Quinn now. He is no longer here, let's move forward.

This thread was about Wahlstrom and Kravtsov, but somehow Quinn gets sucked into it. I am on record as preferring Kravtsov over Wahlstrom if I were picking today. I see a clearly higher upside for him.

 

[strudwickisthebest]

Kakko and LAF weren’t going to develop well under Quinn. He coached too scared and overplayed scrub vet players or bad young ones. They need to cut out the entire 4th line and replace it with a good one

 

[mrmel29]

Don’t know why all the other comparisons with KAKKO and Laf came in and my point had nothing to do with Quinn. Just my opinion and observation that Wahlstrom was the big hard nosed player with a big shot that we needed and not the soft player that kravtsov looks like to me. I don’t know that Wahlstrom is a bad slater but he always seems to be where the puck is and is a physical player to boot!

 

[theProdigy223]

Wahlstom is a pure shoot-first player and we can certainly use more of those. It was a hole at the time of that draft and it continues to be one now.

 

[kreidertime]

Nonsense. Kakko can easily be a pure shoot first player. Same with Gauthier. Same with Zibanejad. Same with Chytil. They aren't being coached properly. It's not that hard. You tell guys this is your role. You don't shoot, you don't play north-south, you pass up good shooting opportunities, you get benched. Real simple. Players aren't retarded. Especially players with that talent level. It's simple coaching which Quinn couldn't do.

 

[theProdigy223]

Nonsense. Kakko can easily be a pure shoot first player. Same with Gauthier. Same with Zibanejad. Same with Chytil. They aren't being coached properly. It's not that hard. You tell guys this is your role. You don't shoot, you don't play north-south, you pass up good shooting opportunities, you get benched. Real simple. Players aren't retarded. Especially players with that talent level. It's simple coaching which Quinn couldn't do.

Kakko is not a shoot first player at all. Sure he “can be”, but it would take away from his natural style and strengths, which is being a possession player who draw in the defense or gets tough shots off in traffic. If he was a shoot first player he would not spend the time along the boards with the puck that he likes to do. Chytil is also a possession player who would rather carry the puck than play off puck and find open ice. Gauthier, I’m not even sure what he is and neither was Carolina which is why they gave up on him. Zibanejad is a very well rounded player offensively, but he’s also very adept at keeping the puck, drawing the defense and hitting the open man.

I’m not trying to split hairs here, having complimentary styles is important to building a balanced roster. Ideally you want a shoot first player to compliment these types of players and the playmakers like Panarin. Such as Wahlstrom, whose strength is finding open ice and putting himself in position to receive a pass and get off a shot. Playing that style allows him to get by with below average skating.

I’m happy with Kravtsov’s development so far but Wahlstrom is a different style than any of the guys you mentioned and brings something that this team still lacks.

 

[Ranger71]

In general they just need to shoot more as a team. Kakko's gotten better with it and took a big leap in year 2 overall. As good as Fox is becoming I'd still like to see him use that sneaky wrist shot more.

 

[theProdigy223]

In my post I completely forgot about Lafreniere, who has a lot of that type of game in him.

 

[NYR Fan]

Good discussion. Lack of a shooting mentality has been a concern for this team for a while now. It didn't just start over the past couple of years. A lot of it has to do with types of players as has been mentioned, most of the guys on this team, through AV's time and Quinn's time, have been guys who like the pretty goal. Not enough guys who are okay with the dirty goal. I think a new coach who pounds a shoot mentality into them, and holds them accountable when they don't, will help, but I also think we need to add some players who fit that bill - a lot of times that goes hand and hand with toughness/grit.

I think that was the hidden downside of the 4 Devil games before the Isles, Bruins, Caps games. We had so many pretty goals against the weak and poor defensively Devs, it carried over even worse than usual into the next games. It was a bad situation to begin with, made worse by the schedule.

It is also why I can still see Buch being the odd man out. First his contract concerns me. I just don't see how we can give him 5.5 mill or more per considering the team needs. Plus, I think Buch is the king of the pass first, second, and third guys. He always passes. He has value off a great season, and is still controllable - despite being arbitration eligible. Now may be the best time to move him, Strome, a few kids, and picks for a C upgrade, and some added toughness.

With regards to the Kravtsov/Wahlstrom discussion, I truly believe in 2 years we'll be happy we have Kravtsov. I really liked what I saw, high hockey IQ, and didn't appear to be a soft play on the outside guy either. As he gets more comfortable and fills out, I expect him to be a very well rounded player. We'll see.

 

[kreidertime]

Yes Kakko is a shoot first player. Our dumb fuck coach had him on the wrong side of the PP not one timing it all year. One of the many reasons the stupid fuck was fired.