Greg Oden's last 5 Games

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Shooter said:
Let's face it. He WAS a bust at that point. His play was horrendous. It was so bad it was painful to watch. Now he's starting to come around, and we're all thrilled. But let's not forget how badly he was playing a few weeks ago.
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He wasn't, though. His rebound rate was great and he was making an impact defensively when he was on the floor.

Ed O.
 
Shooter said:
Let's face it. He WAS a bust at that point. His play was horrendous. It was so bad it was painful to watch.
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Wow, we must have been watching a different player. Yes, Oden struggled with consistency and struggled with foul trouble, but he also made a big impact at both ends of the court, when he manged to get on the court.

1/4 of the way into his rookie year (at the 20 game point of the Blazers season), Oden had 6 double-doubles in 14 games played and had blocked 2 or more shots in 7 of those 14 games. This in spite of him clearly not being close to 100% physically, or mentally. Anybody who labeled him a bust at that point was either totaly clueless about basketball, had ridiculous expectations, or most likely both.

BNM
 
Shooter said:
Let's face it. He WAS a bust at that point. His play was horrendous. It was so bad it was painful to watch. Now he's starting to come around, and we're all thrilled. But let's not forget how badly he was playing a few weeks ago.
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Well with that logic, 99% of NBA players are apparently "busts", since pretty much every rookie I've ever known has gone through stretches of poor play. :rolleyes:
 
Shooter said:
Let's face it. He WAS a bust at that point. His play was horrendous. It was so bad it was painful to watch. Now he's starting to come around, and we're all thrilled. But let's not forget how badly he was playing a few weeks ago.
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Being a "bust" is a permanent condition. If Oden isn't one now, then he never really was.
 
Boob-No-More said:
Wow, we must have been watching a different player.
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I guess we were. The Oden I saw was sluggish, slow to react, confused, and out of sync. He showed no passion for the game, and admitted to being depressed. Sometimes he seemed like he wanted to be somewhere else.

I don't know why everyone is having such a hard time remembering this. It was the subject of many a thread around here for weeks.
 
TehChad said:
Well with that logic, 99% of NBA players are apparently "busts", since pretty much every rookie I've ever known has gone through stretches of poor play. :rolleyes:
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I can't recall ever seeing a No. 1 pick struggle as much as Oden did. Granted, he missed a year due to injury, but he was still struggling in ways that most people didn't anticipate.
 
Shooter said:
I guess we were. The Oden I saw was sluggish, slow to react, confused, and out of sync. He showed no passion for the game, and admitted to being depressed. Sometimes he seemed like he wanted to be somewhere else.

I don't know why everyone is having such a hard time remembering this. It was the subject of many a thread around here for weeks.
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The people disagreeing with you now disagreed with you then.

Looking sluggish and confused is irrelevant to production and is a matter of opinion. The facts were that he was putting up pretty good numbers when he was on the floor.

Ed O.
 
Shooter said:
I guess we were. The Oden I saw was sluggish, slow to react, confused, and out of sync. He showed no passion for the game, and admitted to being depressed. Sometimes he seemed like he wanted to be somewhere else.

I don't know why everyone is having such a hard time remembering this. It was the subject of many a thread around here for weeks.
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And yet, he was still producing on the court in about every other game. He was a rookie and inconsistent. That shouldn't be a surprise to anyone - and that's not even considering he was coming off microfracture surgery.

Some people only see the negative. Anyone calling him a bust only saw the 8 games out of 14 where he didn't have a double-double, not the six where he did. People were actually comparing him to Darko - and they were serious. All after just 14 games in the NBA, half of which were actually pretty darn good.

BNM
 
Shooter said:
I can't recall ever seeing a No. 1 pick struggle as much as Oden did. Granted, he missed a year due to injury, but he was still struggling in ways that most people didn't anticipate.
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Michael Olowokandi ring a bell? LaRue Martin? Pervis Ellison? They were all older with more college experience - and no microfracture surgery - and yet all struggled more than Oden.

More recently, Andrea Bargnani didn't have a single double-double his entire rookie year and didn't score in double figures six times until his 17th game - and that's all Bargnani could do. He didn't rebound and he didn't play defense. And, again, no microfracture surgery.

Also Kwame Brown. Only two double-doubles his rookie season and only scored in double figures nine times all season. Oden had scored in double figures 9 time by his 18th game. And, again Oden was coming off microfracture surgery and Kwame wasn't.

And yet, people were seriously comparing Oden to Darko and Kwame. Ridiculous.

You seem to have a very selective and biased memory.

BNM
 
None of the No. 1 picks mentioned above -- Olowokandi, LaRue Martin, Pervis Ellison, Bargnani, Kwame Brown -- were as highly rated coming out of college as Oden. In fact, it's not even close. Oden was hailed as the second coming of Bill Russell and other great big men--and every team in the league was dying to get him. Hence, his struggles were more surprising than those of the aforementioned picks.

However, I will agree that anyone who declared Oden a "bust" was jumping the gun. I certainly never called him a bust, I only commented on how remarkably tentative and out-of-sync he looked. And I was certainly not the only one to comment on this.
 
Shooter said:
None of the No. 1 picks mentioned above -- Olowokandi, LaRue Martin, Pervis Ellison, Bargnani, Kwame Brown -- were as highly rated coming out of college as Oden. In fact, it's not even close. Oden was hailed as the second coming of Bill Russell and other great big men--and every team in the league was dying to get him. Hence, his struggles were more surprising than those of the aforementioned picks.

However, I will agree that anyone who declared Oden a "bust" was jumping the gun. I certainly never called him a bust, I only commented on how remarkably tentative and out-of-sync he looked. And I was certainly not the only one to comment on this.
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Dude, did any of those other guys have microfracture surgery directly before their rookie year? Get it?
 
Shooter said:
None of the No. 1 picks mentioned above -- Olowokandi, LaRue Martin, Pervis Ellison, Bargnani, Kwame Brown -- were as highly rated coming out of college as Oden.
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Aside from the fact that Brown and Bargnani didn't "come out of college," that was simply not what you said.

However, I will agree that anyone who declared Oden a "bust" was jumping the gun. I certainly never called him a bust, I only commented on how remarkably tentative and out-of-sync he looked. And I was certainly not the only one to comment on this.
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Oden looked tentative and confused in his first 20 games, I would agree. But that's honestly not a surprise, considering he's still learning the NBA game.

At the same time, I think it's easy to exaggerate how great Oden seems after the last five games. He's only faced a tough center once - Emeka Okafor - and he was playing the second night of a back-to-back, in which the first game went into double OT. I'll reserve judgment on whether Oden has truly broken through after I see another few weeks of games.

Pulling for you, Greg.
 
He'll make the All Star game next season, taking Shaq's spot as the reserve center.
 
See what a difference starting a true PG makes?

Sergio makes everyone better.
 
He'll make the All Star game next season, taking Shaq's spot as the reserve center.
 
Shooter said:
None of the No. 1 picks mentioned above -- Olowokandi, LaRue Martin, Pervis Ellison, Bargnani, Kwame Brown -- were as highly rated coming out of college as Oden.
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So, that's not what you said originally. You said:

Shooter said:
I can't recall ever seeing a No. 1 pick struggle as much as Oden did.
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You didn't mention expectations, hype, highly rated, etc. You only asked about No. 1 picks that struggled more than Oden and I gave several examples that did, including some very recent. If you change the question, of course the answer changes.

Shooter said:
However, I will agree that anyone who declared Oden a "bust" was jumping the gun. I certainly never called him a bust...
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Actually, you did. Again, in your own words:

Shooter said:
Let's face it. He WAS a bust at that point.
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This is what I meant by a selective memory.

BNM
 
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Public Defender said:
At the same time, I think it's easy to exaggerate how great Oden seems after the last five games. He's only faced a tough center once - Emeka Okafor - and he was playing the second night of a back-to-back, in which the first game went into double OT. I'll reserve judgment on whether Oden has truly broken through after I see another few weeks of games.
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Taking the whole season into account, he does have the highest PER of any rookie in the game. His rebounding rate is fantastic and his field goal percentage is excellent. On the non-numerical tip, his passing has looked excellent and his defense definitely seems to make a positive impact.

Really, his only weakness has been fouls limiting his minutes. For a rookie center, he's been having a pretty great rookie season. That's just hard for some to see because his limited minutes keep his raw per-game averages down and the expectations were way too high, making him disappointing in a relative sense even if he's been objectively very good.
 
I wish we could find all the super cynical posts about Oden and have them on one thread...it would be pretty funny to check them all out
 
Here's what David Thorpe had to say about Oden on January 28th

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=thorpe_david&page=Rookies-090128

I'm not nearly as impressed with the nine offensive rebounds Oden got against Washington as I am with how he got them. He made a living in the paint. No pop-outs for open jumpers. No leaving a bit early to get back on defense. No giving up on balls that he was unlikely to possess.

He knew the Wizards had no one who could push him inside, and he made them pay. That is a great sign. The league is filled with bigs who don't love to pound inside. But Oden loves the tough stuff.

And I can't wait for him to get his full bounce back. He's averaging 10 points and 7 rebounds in just 24 minutes in January, and I think his athleticism output is at 50-60 percent of what he'll be capable of down the road. Watch out.
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Minstrel said:
Taking the whole season into account, he does have the highest PER of any rookie in the game. His rebounding rate is fantastic and his field goal percentage is excellent. On the non-numerical tip, his passing has looked excellent and his defense definitely seems to make a positive impact.
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speights still has him beat in per.
 
OdenRoyLMA2 said:
16.4 PPG

11.4 RPG

1.6 STLS

1.4 BLKS

65.9% FG

31 MPG

Slowly but surely he is becoming the beast we've all expected him to become. And he still has so much room for improvement! It's scary how good this kid can become. I just want Nate to give him more minutes and touches so he can continue to develop.
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Manchild.
 
The only reason he will not likely put up Dwight Howard-like offensive numbers (20+ ppg) is due to the offensive balance this team has. Put him on a shite team and make him the focal point, and he averages over 25 ppg/15 boards.
 
KingSpeed said:
He'll make the All Star game next season, taking Shaq's spot as the reserve center.
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That doesn't exactly answer the question. Weren't you one of those that were worried that Oden was a bust?
 
oldguy said:
That doesn't exactly answer the question. Weren't you one of those that were worried that Oden was a bust?
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Is he not allowed to change his mind with more evidence?

Would you rather, like so many of us do on this board, continue holding an opinion no matter what happens in the real world?

Or are you trying to goad him into stating that he was wrong and to throw himself on the mercy of the RC2 community?

Ed O.
 
Ed O said:
Is he not allowed to change his mind with more evidence?

Would you rather, like so many of us do on this board, continue holding an opinion no matter what happens in the real world?

Or are you trying to goad him into stating that he was wrong and to throw himself on the mercy of the RC2 community?

Ed O.
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The next time that happens (regardless of who it is), will be the first?
 
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