Grizzlies sign F Miles to second 10-day contract

[PapaG]

The correct term to use is medical retirement, not career ending injury. Bender, MacCulloch, and Mobley all retired. Darius Miles did not.
The 10 game rule is not a loophole. It is how the process is supposed to work if a player disagrees with the medical decision, and decides not to retire. If a player truly has a condition that would require him to medically retire, it would debilitate him within 10 games. If not, then that injury wasn't enough to require a medical retirement, and thus no exception for medical retirement would be warranted.

Are you intentionally this loose with the facts, or do you just lie to help your case? Miles signed the appropriate NBA retirement paperwork. That's what activated this clause of the CBA after the doctors' made their diagnosis.

 

[PapaG]

That's not it. I gave you the full text to the portion of the CBA. It said transactions, not trades. Claiming a player off waivers is a transaction, so the CBA covers it.

Nope. It said trades specifically. I've already addressed it.

The CBA has a general prohibition on circumvention which states that the rules exist to preserve the benefit derived by the teams and players, and that nobody shall do anything to defeat or circumvent the intent of the agreement. The league can use this prohibition to disallow a trade that they feel circumvents the CBA, even though that trade is not specifically prohibited by the agreement.

Again, it says nothing about disallowing a player the right to a guaranteed contract, or a team the right to claim a player that no other team wants to claim.

 

[Денг Гордон]

Nope. It said trades specifically. I've already addressed it.



Again, it says nothing about disallowing a player the right to a guaranteed contract, or a team the right to claim a player that no other team wants to claim.

you quoted Coon's salary cap faq, not the CBA, thus why you don't see the word transactions.

 

[Ed O]

What are the odds that Memphis guarantees him for the rest of the season next Thursday?

A second 10-day contract means nothing.

A guaranteed contract means nothing.

If the Grizzlies ONLY wanted to screw the Blazers, they would not have signed him to another 10 days.

The Blazers had no case before, and now they have even less of a case... if that were possible.

Ed O.

 

[PapaG]

A guaranteed contract means nothing.

If the Grizzlies ONLY wanted to screw the Blazers, they would not have signed him to another 10 days.
The Blazers had no case before, and now they have even less of a case... if that were possible.

Ed O.

Your opinion is not fact. The NBA denied Miles a guaranteed contract. If he is cut by the Grizz and not picked up anywhere else, I hope Darius sues the NBA as well.

A guaranteed contract also means Memphis would end up a net-negative on the Miles scheme. Instead, a few 10-days and the rest is profit from Paul Allen. Not bad...

 

[DaRizzle]

There are some cynical ass fans in here...jesus

denial, denial, denial

 

[PapaG]

There are some cynical ass fans in here...jesus

denial, denial, denial

What is wrong with being cynical? Until Memphis signs Miles to a guaranteed deal, they still stand to profit handsomely from the luxury tax implications. Is that a false statement?

 

[DaRizzle]

What is wrong with being cynical?

Answer lies within the question

Until Memphis signs Miles to a guaranteed deal, they still stand to profit handsomely from the luxury tax implications. Is that a false statement?

Wait you have me confused on this...How is MEM gonna profit from this?

A guaranteed contract also means Memphis would end up a net-negative on the Miles scheme. Instead, a few 10-days and the rest is profit from Paul Allen. Not bad...

Sorry, Im not getting this...If you already explained it within this thread tell me what post number

edit:no you didnt, please explain if you care to

 

[PapaG]

Wait you have me confused on this...How is MEM gonna profit from this?

They stand to gain almost an extra $300k from the extra money Paul Allen has to pay toward the luxury tax because of Miles going back on the books. That money is typically redistributed to teams, and some of it goes to the league.

Signing Miles to a guaranteed contract will mean Memphis is on the hook for nearly half of the veteran's minimum for the rest of the year, which is a net-negative to the money they would receive by playing him garbage minutes and then letting him go after the next 10-day deal.

Wanna take bets on what they're going to do?

I don't understand why I am attacked for thinking about this in this forum. It seems like a shrewd (and borderline unethical) move by Memphis to me if they don't sign Miles.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

What is wrong with being cynical? Until Memphis signs Miles to a guaranteed deal, they still stand to profit handsomely from the luxury tax implications. Is that a false statement?

Memphis has nothing to gain financially when signing Miles to another 10 day contract . . . Miles has already played 10 games.

Bet, bet, did someone say bet . . . I'm in . . . I don't know what we are betting, but I need a adrenaline fix.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

They stand to gain almost an extra $300k from the extra money Paul Allen has to pay toward the luxury tax because of Miles going back on the books. That money is typically redistributed to teams, and some of it goes to the league.

Signing Miles to a guaranteed contract will mean Memphis is on the hook for nearly half of the veteran's minimum for the rest of the year, which is a net-negative to the money they would receive by playing him garbage minutes and then letting him go after the next 10-day deal.

Wanna take bets on what they're going to do?

I don't understand why I am attacked for thinking about this in this forum. It seems like a shrewd (and borderline unethical) move by Memphis to me if they don't sign Miles.

I'm not attacking you, I just disagree with you about Memphis doing something wrong. Players get signed to 10 day contracts all the time without being signed for the remainder of the season.

The real issue is can Miles play . . . and unfortunately the answer appears to be yes.

 

[PapaG]

Memphis has nothing to gain financially when signing Miles to another 10 day contract . . . Miles has already played 10 games.
Bet, bet, did someone say bet . . . I'm in . . . I don't know what we are betting, but I need a adrenaline fix.

I see it as cover to try and protect themselves. I imagine things aren't as black/white as the media tries to make it regarding this situation. Anyhow, at this point I just want to see how many consecutive games Miles can play without being credited for an assist, so I hope he is signed.

 

[PapaG]

I'm not attacking you, I just disagree with you about Memphis doing something wrong. Players get signed to 10 day contracts all the time without being signed for the remainder of the season.

The real issue is can Miles play . . . and unfortunately the answer appears to be yes.

In how many of those instances has it literally meant a difference whether or not a team profits from the luxury tax?

My guess is zero, but I don't know for sure. Also, if Darius is such an asset who needs to be evaluated, why doesn't Memphis start him? He's playing garbage minutes on a terrible team.

 

[rocketeer]

Thus far, the only things that have happened to Darius are that he's played some garbage minutes with inconsistent production on a losing team, all the while on the worst contract available to him at the time.

this isn't actually the case(unless your argument is that no minutes with the grizzlies are meaningful). in at least two of the games he has started the 2nd quarter and i think in all but the first one he played in, he's been playing minutes where the outcome of the game was still very much in doubt.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

I see it as cover to try and protect themselves. I imagine things aren't as black/white as the media tries to make it regarding this situation. Anyhow, at this point I just want to see how many consecutive games Miles can play without being credited for an assist, so I hope he is signed.

True. I don't think Memphis gives a rat's ass about the email. But if they did, I agree this would help their case.

 

[PapaG]

this isn't actually the case(unless your argument is that no minutes with the grizzlies are meaningful). in at least two of the games he has started the 2nd quarter and i think in all but the first one he played in, he's been playing minutes where the outcome of the game was still very much in doubt.

All the more odd then that he isn't getting more PT or being kept all year. He regressed last game though. I imagine dude has a pretty sore knee at this point.

 

[rocketeer]

All the more odd then that he isn't getting more PT or being kept all year. He regressed last game though. I imagine dude has a pretty sore knee at this point.

i would assume that it's cheaper for the grizzlies to bring him in for the limit of 10 day contracts(which i believe is 2), and then sign him for the rest of the year.

so it may be that they are just doing that because it's the best for them financially and there is a 20 day period where if miles gets hurt, they won't have to guarantee him a contract for the rest of the year.

 

[Ed O]

i would assume that it's cheaper for the grizzlies to bring him in for the limit of 10 day contracts(which i believe is 2), and then sign him for the rest of the year.

so it may be that they are just doing that because it's the best for them financially and there is a 20 day period where if miles gets hurt, they won't have to guarantee him a contract for the rest of the year.

Absolutely. There's simply no reason for Memphis to have signed him to a guaranteed deal yet... they are able to get him in a more flexible way with a series of 10 day contracts.

Ed O.

 

[Ed O]

Your opinion is not fact. The NBA denied Miles a guaranteed contract. If he is cut by the Grizz and not picked up anywhere else, I hope Darius sues the NBA as well.

Of course you hope it. You've built up this big conspiracy in your head and in order to continue to argue for its existence in spite of the absence of evidence supporting it, you've had to create issues that aren't even issues.

An example: Miles being upset at the lack of a guaranteed contract.

He wants to PLAY. He wants money, of course, but he wants to demonstrate to teams around the NBA that he can play and he deserves a deal.

In Portland he would have sat on the bench or even the inactive roster for the rest of the year. Guaranteed money in that case is all but worthless to him, considering how hard he's worked to come back from where he was physically.

Ed O.

 

[PapaG]

i would assume that it's cheaper for the grizzlies to bring him in for the limit of 10 day contracts(which i believe is 2), and then sign him for the rest of the year.

so it may be that they are just doing that because it's the best for them financially and there is a 20 day period where if miles gets hurt, they won't have to guarantee him a contract for the rest of the year.

I'm not sure if that is the case. What are the terms of a 10-day contract? I've seen varied responses all over the internet. Some say it's prorated based on the a veteran's minimum (hence no savings to Memphis), others say it is $15k-$20k/game (more expensive than the prorated minimum at this point for Memphis, and others say it is a flat $50k.

Does anybody know the terms of a 10-day contract for a 6-year vet?

 

[alex42083]

I'm so tired of the Darius stuff. The e-mail was dumb, Memphis is dumb and Chris Wallace is still an idiot. They're 1-6 since they've signed Miles, including losing their past six. They're a loser of a franchise, looking to make the cheap buck off us and doing the rest of the teams' dirty work and moving on.

And I can't wait to see Rudy Gay and OJ Mayo leave when they can. They're second to last in the NBA in attendance, they couldn't even fill up the Coliseum at this point. And I wouldn't mind seeing the NBA disband the franchise eventually.

 

[PapaG]

Of course you hope it. You've built up this big conspiracy in your head and in order to continue to argue for its existence in spite of the absence of evidence supporting it, you've had to create issues that aren't even issues.
An example: Miles being upset at the lack of a guaranteed contract.

He wants to PLAY. He wants money, of course, but he wants to demonstrate to teams around the NBA that he can play and he deserves a deal.

In Portland he would have sat on the bench or even the inactive roster for the rest of the year. Guaranteed money in that case is all but worthless to him, considering how hard he's worked to come back from where he was physically.

Ed O.

What are you talking about? What conspiracy? I am posting about what may or may not be reality, and none of it has been refuted, so I'll keep posting about it. As for sitting on the bench in Portland, again, where in the CBA does it say that a team has to play a claimed player, or that one team doesn't have a right to claim a waived player, or that the NBA can deny a member of the union a contract? Did the NBA and Miles' agent collude? That's not out of the realm of possibility at this point.

Darius Miles, his hopes, and his dreams are irrelevant in this matter, and if the NBA made Darius's needs an issue in deciding whether Portland could claim him or not, then that needs to be addressed by the Blazers via whatever legal channel is available to them before this summer.

 

[PapaG]

I'm so tired of the Darius stuff. The e-mail was dumb, Memphis is dumb and Chris Wallace is still an idiot. They're 1-6 since they've signed Miles, including losing their past six. They're a loser of a franchise, looking to make the cheap buck off us and doing the rest of the teams' dirty work and moving on.

And I can't wait to see Rudy Gay and OJ Mayo leave when they can. They're second to last in the NBA in attendance, they couldn't even fill up the Coliseum at this point. And I wouldn't mind seeing the NBA disband the franchise eventually.

Well said. I won't post further on this until Miles is let go next week.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I think the second 10-day contract is a CYA (cover your ass) move my Memphis to insure that Miles salary will count against the cap, and they will get their share of the luxury tax payments from Paul Allen.

Miles has actually only played in 5 regular season games - and six preseason games with the Celtics.

If he plays less than 10 regular season games, I think the Blazers will file an appeal wit the league at the end of the season to get the preseason games thrown out. And, I think they'd have a pretty good case. Preseason games don't count for anything else. They don't count in the standings, the individual stats don't count toward the players' career averages, and they didn't count against the 10 game suspension Miles had to serve. So, if they don't count for anything else, why do they count against the 10-game requirement to put Miles' salary back on the Blazers cap? If this went to arbitration, the precident is that preseason games do NOT count.

So, Memphis has 5 games in the next 10 days. If they play Miles a couple minutes in each, it removes any hope of a successful appeal by the Blazers. They they can cut Miles loose and sit back and collect the luxury tax money from Paul Allen.

Miles has never fit into the Memphis long term plans. There were younger, cheap forwards availalble that would fit better with their young core, and might even stick with the team long term. Picking up Miles was a transparent move to collect luxury tax payments from another owner and hurt another team's free agent chances. If they really think he's a good fit with their team, they will keep him beyond the second 10-day contract and sign him for the rest of the season. If it was just a move to harm a competitor financially and limit their chances to improve through free agency, he will play in the nxt five games and then be let go ending his illustrious career in Memphis. I suspect it will be the latter.

BNM

 

[Ed O]

What are you talking about? What conspiracy?

The conspiracy that you allege where Memphis has signed Miles only to screw over the Blazers.

I am posting about what may or may not be reality, and none of it has been refuted, so I'll keep posting about it.

My head expands and contracts at a million miles an hour every 200 seconds. It expands to the distance of 10 feet before contracting again. It moves so quickly and the atoms move so perfectly that my normal bodily functions are not disturbed and no one has ever been able to detect that it happens.

I've claimed this for years, and no one has refuted it once. Should I take it as fact, then?

As for sitting on the bench in Portland, again, where in the CBA does it say that a team has to play a claimed player, or that one team doesn't have a right to claim a waived player, or that the NBA can deny a member of the union a contract? Did the NBA and Miles' agent collude? That's not out of the realm of possibility at this point.

How does any of that lead to Miles suing the NBA, as you hope that he does?

Darius Miles, his hopes, and his dreams are irrelevant in this matter, and if the NBA made Darius's needs an issue in deciding whether Portland could claim him or not, then that needs to be addressed by the Blazers via whatever legal channel is available to them before this summer.

So you hope that Miles sues irrespective of his desires and dreams?

You do understand how, at the most basic level, the legal system works, right?

Ed O.

 

[Ed O]

If he plays less than 10 regular season games, I think the Blazers will file an appeal wit the league at the end of the season to get the preseason games thrown out. And, I think they'd have a pretty good case. Preseason games don't count for anything else. They don't count in the standings, the individual stats don't count toward the players' career averages, and they didn't count against the 10 game suspension Miles had to serve. So, if they don't count for anything else, why do they count against the 10-game requirement to put Miles' salary back on the Blazers cap? If this went to arbitration, the precident is that preseason games do NOT count.

The language of the CBA is different regarding games played that affect medical retirement than for the other cases you cite.

I seriously doubt an arbitrator would rule against the NBA and in favor of the Blazers.

Ed O.

 

[Boob-No-More]

The language of the CBA is different regarding games played that affect medical retirement than for the other cases you cite.

Link?

BNM

 

[e_blazer]

My head expands and contracts at a million miles an hour every 200 seconds. It expands to the distance of 10 feet before contracting again. It moves so quickly and the atoms move so perfectly that my normal bodily functions are not disturbed and no one has ever been able to detect that it happens.


Ed O.

Interesting. I suggest an experiment whereby we put your head into a steel helmet for a period of 201 seconds and see what happens. If indeed your head tries to expand as per your assertion, the excess volume has to go somewhere, which may well impact your bodily functions.

 

[Ed O]

Link?

Definition of "Season": http://www.nbpa.com/cba_articles/article-I.php#iii . "“Season” or “NBA Season” means the period beginning on the first day of training camp and ending immediately after the last game of the NBA Finals."

This is distinct from (uuu) in the definitions, which is "“Regular Season” means, with respect to any Season, the period beginning on the first day and ending on the last day of regularly scheduled (as opposed to exhibition or playoff) competition between NBA Teams."

Unless the language of the medical retirement rule states "regular season games" rather than "games during a season", preseason games (as opposed to summer league and exhibitions, which are defined in the CBA here) should count.

Ed O.

 

[Ed O]

Interesting. I suggest an experiment whereby we put your head into a steel helmet for a period of 201 seconds and see what happens. If indeed your head tries to expand as per your assertion, the excess volume has to go somewhere, which may well impact your bodily functions.

The atoms in my expanding head move in such a way that they avoid (by simply going through) any substance, leaving no residue...

Ed O.