Honest question for Stotts supporters

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e_blazer said:
Sure, but given the state of the roster right now, worrying about the coach seems to me kind of like asking for a new captain after the Titanic has hit the iceberg.
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100% agree with you. There are a bunch of people in this thread who think the coach is a way bigger issue than the roster.
 
e_blazer said:
Sure, but given the state of the roster right now, worrying about the coach seems to me kind of like asking for a new captain after the Titanic has hit the iceberg.
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So when there are injuries Stotts can just take a vacation the rest of the year and not worry about anything because it doesn't matter? I don't get the line of thinking that he should be given a pass. With the injuries it's even more important that the coaching is top notch.
 
Strenuus said:
God do i hope olshey is thinking this!!! If hes saying this we may get a late christmas present in the form of a new coach! We sorely need it
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I think it's going to happen. Just hold your breath a little longer...
 
Tince said:
Respect your opinion, but saying "identify momentum" or "weird subs" along with players making the same mistakes over and over (nearly all player do this) are things nearly every fan base says about their coach.

The momentum argument is a great example of this. People use the term momentum to explain why series of events have happened after the fact. I would challenge you or anyone who is a strong believer of momentum to post immediately after you thing a play that will trigger momentum has occured, then see/track the results of the next handful of possessions. Over a large sample, you might be surprised at the outcome.

Same goes with "weird subs". Does that mean you don't understand his subs? Is there any data that backs up Portland does worse after he subs vs other teams when they sub? If I said Stotts made "amazing subs" (which I don't think either), I'm guessing me telling you to "dig deeper" would not be enough to convince you.

Using data to back up your points or creating criteria before things happen would actually be digging deeper. Just because I don't buy into a story based narrative doesn't mean I'm not digging deeper.
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No no no. I identify momentum shifts as it happens and so do other people in game threads. Not only is it obvious when our players are disengaged\making transparent plays\tired etc while the other team looks focused. It's also quantified by numbers, you literally see the other team goes 4-0-->6-0-->12-2-->16-2 while our guys are taking turns on offense before Terry takes a time out.

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Playing Lillard (or LMA back then) for the entirety of the 1st quarter EVERY NIGHT is stupid, insisting on Tolliver and Mario is silly, pulling out players when they're hot is weird.

I don't need to "dig deeper" and look for numbers, i just don't like his stubbornness on things that don't work and look bad.
 
It really boils down to our team having shit ball movement and an iso-centric offense that is either feast or famine. That's on the coach. We have consistently been one of the worst passing teams in the league for several years.

So either:

1. Dame and CJ don't give a fuck what Stotts says and ignore the offense.

2. Stotts is a pushover and lets Dame and CJ do whatever they want and that's the offense.

3. Our offense is iso-centric and has a major flaw.
 
hoopsjock said:
So when there are injuries Stotts can just take a vacation the rest of the year and not worry about anything because it doesn't matter? I don't get the line of thinking that he should be given a pass. With the injuries it's even more important that the coaching is top notch.
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The way I see it, in almost any NBA game, except the occasional blowout, there’s about a maximum of a ten percent difference between winning and losing. There are lots of variables that impact which way that ten percent difference in score swings, but I would say by far the biggest factor is the talent of the players available to play. Sure, coaching makes a difference, but at this level they all know their Xs and Os. Top coaches consistently get more out of their players, but they are capped by the maximum level of the talent that they have available. Pop hasn’t forgotten how to coach this year; his talent level is worse and the competition is better. The Blazers have a second unit that struggles to score 20 points. That’s a far more significant factor than who’s calling the plays and managing practices. There’s also the certainty that top coaches only choose to sign up to coach teams where they think they can win. Right now, that ain’t Portland. Even assuming that Stotts isn’t the right guy for a championship run, this isn’t the time to change horses.
 
Blazers Roy said:
No no no. I identify momentum shifts as it happens and so do other people in game threads. Not only is it obvious when our players are disengaged\making transparent plays\tired etc while the other team looks focused. It's also quantified by numbers, you literally see the other team goes 4-0-->6-0-->12-2-->16-2 while our guys are taking turns on offense before Terry takes a time out.

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Playing Lillard (or LMA back then) for the entirety of the 1st quarter EVERY NIGHT is stupid, insisting on Tolliver and Mario is silly, pulling out players when they're hot is weird.

I don't need to "dig deeper" and look for numbers, i just don't like his stubbornness on things that don't work and look bad.
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I scanned last nights thread and didn't see any posts where you pointed out a momentum shift until after a had happened. Can you show me where those posts are? If not this game, any game would work. If you have a nice data set of the predictions and outcomes, I will gladly give you praise, then I'll pay you way to Vegas to help me take some of their money!
 
Natebishop3 said:
It really boils down to our team having shit ball movement and an iso-centric offense that is either feast or famine. That's on the coach. We have consistently been one of the worst passing teams in the league for several years.

So either:

1. Dame and CJ don't give a fuck what Stotts says and ignore the offense.

2. Stotts is a pushover and lets Dame and CJ do whatever they want and that's the offense.

3. Our offense is iso-centric and has a major flaw.
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11th in the league in offense rating with three starters missing is bad? Not sure why people continue to think there is any correlation between passing/assists and offensive efficiency when the data says other wise.
 
Natebishop3 said:
It really boils down to our team having shit ball movement and an iso-centric offense that is either feast or famine. That's on the coach. We have consistently been one of the worst passing teams in the league for several years.

So either:

1. Dame and CJ don't give a fuck what Stotts says and ignore the offense.

2. Stotts is a pushover and lets Dame and CJ do whatever they want and that's the offense.

3. Our offense is iso-centric and has a major flaw.
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Mike Richman said in a pod some weeks ago that Terry has told him he likes to play his players strengt's , and thats why they play so much iso. So yeah it is Stotts because he allows the players to do whatever they want to do
 
Tince said:
I scanned last nights thread and didn't see any posts where you pointed out a momentum shift until after a had happened. Can you show me where those posts are? If not this game, any game would work. If you have a nice data set of the predictions and outcomes, I will gladly give you praise, then I'll pay you way to Vegas to help me take some of their money!
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Unfortunately for the two of us, i'm on the other side of the world so i can't watch and participate in game threads live, i only watch game replays :emotions:
 
Labinot41 said:
Mike Richman said in a pod some weeks ago that Terry has told him he likes to play his players strengt's , and thats why they play so much iso. So yeah it is Stotts because he allows the players to do whatever they want to do
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Well i have heard Stotts and his coaching staff emphasizing ball movement so either you are mischaracterizing what Richman said or Richman is mischacterizing what Stotts said. Did Richman say Stotts said what you posted about iso ball?
 
Tince said:
11th in the league in offense rating with three starters missing is bad? Not sure why people continue to think there is any correlation between passing/assists and offensive efficiency when the data says other wise.
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Go look at our record against winning teams this year. It's absolutely abysmal.
 
Natebishop3 said:
Go look at our record against winning teams this year. It's absolutely abysmal.
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It is horrible, I agree.

So is the cause of that horrible record that has never happened the past 7 year due to the constants (Dame, CJ, Stotts) or the changes (Injuries, additions, subtractions)? `

It would be like having a dish that is pretty good six times, made by the same chef, the same prime cut of meat, and the same secondary ingredient. Then the 7th time you make it, the chef and the two main ingredients stay the same, but you remove some other ingredients, replace others with a different quality, and change out all the spices. If the 7th meal tasted like crap, would you first thought be that the chef forgot how to cook and you don't like that prime cut of meat, or that all the other changes made the meal worse?
 
Tince said:
It is horrible, I agree.

So is the cause of that horrible record that has never happened the past 7 year due to the constants (Dame, CJ, Stotts) or the changes (Injuries, additions, subtractions)? `

It would be like having a dish that is pretty good six times, made by the same chef, the same prime cut of meat, and the same secondary ingredient. Then the 7th time you make it, the chef and the two main ingredients stay the same, but you remove some other ingredients, replace others with a different quality, and change out all the spices. If the 7th meal tasted like crap, would you first thought be that the chef forgot how to cook and you don't like that prime cut of meat, or that all the other changes made the meal worse?
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But for myself (and some others), we've had issues with the "meal" on previous visits so it's not just a one time bad experience.

The flaws are magnified by the injuries.
 
hoopsjock said:
But for myself (and some others), we've had issues with the "meal" on previous visits so it's not just a one time bad experience.

The flaws are magnified by the injuries.
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That's totally fair. If you were disgruntled about the experience on the way to the WCF, then I totally understand why this year you've had enough. This year has been painful, we all agree on that!
 
Tince said:
That's totally fair. If you were disgruntled about the experience on the way to the WCF, then I totally understand why this year you've had enough. This year has been painful, we all agree on that!
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I just want to note that it is indeed possible to be happy and enjoy the Blazers winning and making the WCF while also believing that the coaching was subpar.
 
hoopsjock said:
I just want to note that it is indeed possible to be happy and enjoy the Blazers winning and making the WCF while also believing that the coaching was subpar.
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Sorry, I phrased that wrong... I was assuming that even during the WCF run, you felt this team could've done even better and therefore were unhappy about that aspect. I have zero doubt you enjoy the wins!
 
hoopsjock said:
I just want to note that it is indeed possible to be happy and enjoy the Blazers winning and making the WCF while also believing that the coaching was subpar.
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So you think they had bad coaching and made the WCF, because they had just more talent than everybody else?
 
calvin natt said:
So you think they had bad coaching and made the WCF, because they had just more talent than everybody else?
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I'm sure @hoopsjock will respond, but I can tell you I've asked this question to multiple people. The common response I get is that they feel the team could have done even better.

Like this year, when Vegas and many national experts picked them around 12th in the NBA (this is before the Collins/Hood injuries), a lot of people here thought this was a top 5 NBA team. And because this team over-achieved based off their talent under Stotts multiple times (13-14, 18-19), some reset their expectations to an unrealistic point. Even this year, we're 8th in the West despite missing 3 starters and a handful of awful transactions by the front office.
 
calvin natt said:
So you think they had bad coaching and made the WCF, because they had just more talent than everybody else?
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Round 1: Billy Donovan is one of the few coaches that is actually a worse playoff coach than Stotts is. They barely trapped Dame at all and Dame made them pay.

Round 2: Pretty evenly matched teams talent wise. Portland was the more experienced team. I felt it was pretty obvious Hood and Collins should be starting early on in that series. Stotts only put Hood in the 4OT game when Harkless got cramps and had to come out even though he was abusing Murray.

So that's getting to the WCF where Stotts basically shit himself by having the worst game plan of all-time in the history of sports in game one (not an exaggeration) by allowing a great shooter to get open looks. After multiple series of Dame being trapped there is still no answer for it and in fact the plays and sets being run are ones that direct Dame right into the traps.
 
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