howard appreciation thread

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the ob

the ob

the original blake
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I do not know where we would be without this guy. He has done so many little things that have kept us in games and his attitude is amazing. I think this was the most important move of the off-season.
 
What an unexpected miracle he's been. From pine-rider to unofficial team co-captain in 33 games. He is truly Obi Juwan Howard.
 
I think his impact on guys like Cunningham and Penergraph is as valuable (or more?) than what he does on the court. Great veteran pickup.
 
Nikolokolus said:
I think his impact on guys like Cunningham and Penergraph is as valuable (or more?) than what he does on the court. Great veteran pickup.
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I agree with this. But he has played pretty damn well. Some announcer said "I feel bad for Juwan. I bet he was expecting to come to Portland and just collect a check. He is playing a LOT now!"

Something like that lol
 
That Juwan saw Tim Grover (trainer extraordinaire) over the summer tells me he wanted a little more than to collect a check. I'm glad he's rising to the occasion, because we needed a pleasant surprise after all this.
 
Juwan seems to be very emotionally involved. I think this season is very enjoyable to him - he seems to really get into the games. Not a sign of someone that just wanted to collect a check.
 
andalusian said:
Juwan seems to be very emotionally involved. I think this season is very enjoyable to him - he seems to really get into the games. Not a sign of someone that just wanted to collect a check.
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I agree with this. He seems to actually be having fun this year. Maybe he thinks this might be one of the last years he can play hard and actually be a meaningful part to a team again.

Whatever it is, I like it!
 
I bet when Howard looks back over his career, this year might be his favorite.
 
Coach Howard in 2010-2011? I bet that Mo Lucas is not back, and we could see a guy like Howard added.
 
Sug said:
I bet when Howard looks back over his career, this year might be his favorite.
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Don't laugh too hard, but I occasionally wonder if he'll be looking back on his career while he's riding in the back of a convertible in a parade this June.
 
BenDavis503 said:
I agree with this. But he has played pretty damn well. Some announcer said "I feel bad for Juwan. I bet he was expecting to come to Portland and just collect a check. He is playing a LOT now!"

Something like that lol
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He's played better than I expected, but let's not get too carried away.
 
Nikolokolus said:
He's played better than I expected, but let's not get too carried away.
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He's not better than Joel or anything, but he's not a stiff out there, either. He's hitting the open 10 footer and getting some good rebounds. From a stance relative to our initial expectations, that's pretty damn good.
 
BlazerCaravan said:
He's not better than Joel or anything, but he's not a stiff out there, either. He's hitting the open 10 footer and getting some good rebounds. From a stance relative to our initial expectations, that's pretty damn good.
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Defensivly he is not as good as Joel. But Joel isn't going to put down 10 points most games either, which Juwan seems to be doing.
 
Juan is probably better than either one of our centers at passing the ball. Has great court awareness. He is a little slow to adjust defensively when beat or on help defense. Feet are a little slow at 36. Great KP pick-up.
 
BlazerCaravan said:
He's not better than Joel or anything, but he's not a stiff out there, either. He's hitting the open 10 footer and getting some good rebounds. From a stance relative to our initial expectations, that's pretty damn good.
Click to expand...

What is being overlooked is that Juwan Howard IS NOT AND HAS NOT EVER BEEN A CENTER! He's a 36 year old 6'9" PF being asked to play the 5. He's averaging 32 minutes/game starting with the Dallas game Joel went down in. He's had to defend the likes of Dampier, Duncan, Nene, Dalembert, Kaman, & keep those guys off the boards. That would have been a challenge for him 10 years ago. In the last 5 games, the team is + 10 rebounding - the only game where they lost the rebounding battle was against Philly (and it was only -3) That is truly amazing. Of course it's not all Juwan, but if you watch him underneath he is doing a fantastic job of boxing out. And he's had a knack for grabbing offensive boards in big spots.

I'm not surprised Howard has played well - he was a good player, and at 36 he's not totally over the hill. I am surprised he's doing it while playing heavy minutes out of position. He's not the best post defender around - that's for sure. He doesn't block or alter shots. But he has been adequate if not spectacular, which not many of us thought was even possible when Joel went down. Even if you think too much is being made of Juwan's play recently, you have to (at least) tip your cap to the guy. :clap:
 
gatorpops said:
Juwan is probably better than either one of our centers at passing the ball. Has great court awareness. He is a little slow to adjust defensively when beat or on help defense. Feet are a little slow at 36. Great KP pick-up.
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If you just look at his AST/36 and AST% numbers you'll see that he's barely better than Greg and slightly worse than LaMarcus. However, that doesn't tell the whole story. Greg and LaMarcus get a lot of their assists on kick-outs to open guards and small forwards camped on the perimeter. Juwan does a much better job finding his fellow bigs and others cutting to the basket.

I think there are two reasons for this. First, he doesn't command double teams in the low post (like Greg). So, there is less of a chance for him to find an unguarded teammate on the perimeter. Second, he draws on his 16 years of experience to read the defense and know where the openings are going to be.

Ever since seeing him work the ball into Greg in the preseason, I have been very impressed with Juwan's passing. Too bad Greg isn't able to play with him more. Hopefully, he can learn a little watching from behind the bench.

BNM
 
Kaydow said:
What is being overlooked is that Juwan Howard IS NOT AND HAS NOT EVER BEEN A CENTER! He's a 36 year old 6'9" PF being asked to play the 5.
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Actually, he did play quite a bit of center early in his career in Washington. His first few years, he split time with Muresan at center. They usually started Muresan at the 5, Howard at the 4 and Webber at the 3, but Muresan usually only played about 20 - 25 minutes. Juwan picked up most of the remaining minutes at center with Webber sliding to the 4. After Muresan retired for health reasons, Howard became their starting center for a couple years.

Of course, he was also the starting center on the Fab5 Michigan team.

He's definitely undersized for the position, but it's not like he doesn't have experience playing center.

BNM
 
I assumed going into this season he was insurance and a mentor. But he has definitely proven he is the ageless one. And dishes out better than a waitress at hooters!
 
I'm seriously shocked he's still a solid player at his age. Bigs at his age are usually liabilities on both ends of the floor.
 
Boob-No-More said:
Actually, he did play quite a bit of center early in his career in Washington. His first few years, he split time with Muresan at center. They usually started Muresan at the 5, Howard at the 4 and Webber at the 3, but Muresan usually only played about 20 - 25 minutes. Juwan picked up most of the remaining minutes at center with Webber sliding to the 4. After Muresan retired for health reasons, Howard became their starting center for a couple years.

Of course, he was also the starting center on the Fab5 Michigan team.

He's definitely undersized for the position, but it's not like he doesn't have experience playing center.

BNM
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You're splitting hairs. Besides, Webber was more Center than Howard IMO. He blocked more shots, grabbed more rebounds, and scored more points in the paint - but neither was truly a Center. The point is, Juwan (even is prime) was never asked to shoulder this much of a load - he's never had to bang with the other teams biggest guy for 32 minutes/game like he is now. He's never been thrown out there and told to be "the guy" who keeps guys like Dampier, Duncan, Kaman, Dalembert, & Nene off the glass. There is no Muresan/Webber, Otis Thorpe/Ben Wallace, Jahidi White, Nene, Yao, Dampier, etc. to do the clog the middle. If Juwan gets manhandled in the paint, our plan B is Jeff Pendegraph who's played 5 games. I'm just saying the guy deserves credit - even if his 8/8 average in the last 5 games doesn't jump out at you, he's going out there and chesting up with guys who are 2" + taller, 30+ pounds heavier, much younger, and he's answered the call so far. He's a big reason the team is 4-1 w/o Joel and a +10 on the boards over that span, and a lot of what he's doing doesn't show in the box score.
 
Kaydow said:
You're splitting hairs. Besides, Webber was more Center than Howard IMO. He blocked more shots, grabbed more rebounds, and scored more points in the paint - but neither was truly a Center.
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No, I'm not. I'm telling the truth. Juwan Howard played a lot of center early in his career when he was in Washington. That's a fact, not a hair to be split.

Webber actually started at the 3 on those Washington teams due to the fact that he was a better passer and a better outside shooter. He moved to the 4 when Muresan went out and Howard moved to the 5.

When Muresan retired, Howard became the starting center and Webber the starting 4. A year later, Webber was gone. Howard was still the starting center with Otis Thorpe as the starting power forward.

I'm very impressed with the way Juwan is playing at his age and being undersized, but that doesn't change the fact that he has past experience playing center in the NBA. Hell, other than Joel, he's played more minutes at center in the NBA than anyone else on the Blazers roster. That's an indisputable fact.

BNM
 
Boob-No-More said:
No, I'm not. I'm telling the truth. Juwan Howard played a lot of center early in his career when he was in Washington. That's a fact, not a hair to be split.

Webber actually started at the 3 on those Washington teams due to the fact that he was a better passer and a better outside shooter. He moved to the 4 when Muresan went out and Howard moved to the 5.

When Muresan retired, Howard became the starting center and Webber the starting 4. A year later, Webber was gone. Howard was still the starting center with Otis Thorpe as the starting power forward.

I'm very impressed with the way Juwan is playing at his age and being undersized, but that doesn't change the fact that he has past experience playing center in the NBA. Hell, other than Joel, he's played more minutes at center in the NBA than anyone else on the Blazers roster. That's an indisputable fact.

BNM
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You know Juwan Howard was never a true Center. Whether you call him, or Webber, Or Thorpe, or whoever the "Starting Center" it's just semantics - Juwan had guys around him to help do the dirty work down low. The years after Muresan he had guys like Ben Wallace & Jahidi White - he wasn't the "Starting Center" on a team with a front court as thin as what ours is now. I'm not saying he's never played Center - I'm saying he's never been asked to be a "Traditional Center" for 32 minutes/game.
 
Kaydow said:
You know Juwan Howard was never a true Center. Whether you call him, or Webber, Or Thorpe, or whoever the "Starting Center" it's just semantics - Juwan had guys around him to help do the dirty work down low. The years after Muresan he had guys like Ben Wallace & Jahidi White - he wasn't the "Starting Center" on a team with a front court as thin as what ours is now. I'm not saying he's never played Center - I'm saying he's never been asked to be a "Traditional Center" for 32 minutes/game.
Click to expand...

I'm not disputing any of that. All I'm saying is Juwan has significant experience playing the center position in the NBA - on both offense and defense. That experience, and what he learned, is obviously paying dividends now.

But, let's not go overboard here. While what he's doing is very impressive for a 6'9" 36-year old, we're still a much better team with Greg and/or Joel playing center. Juwan is doing a great job boxing out his taller opponents, but he simply isn't big enough to keep those same taller opponents from scoring on him.

We got absolutely killed in the paint by the 76ers. Dalembert went 7-9 and had 14 points - over twice his seasonal average and one of his best games of the season. Brand was simply overpowering. 11-16 and 25 points - his highest point total all season. Speights was 7-8 and scored 14 points in 17 minutes. No way do those three guys combine for 49 points on 76% shooting (25-33) if we have Greg or Joel defending the paint.

And thank god for Baron "2-15" Davis, or we would have lost last night, too. If Davis had simply kept pounding the ball into Kaman (12-19, 25 points), rather than insisting on taking (and missing) every shot down the stretch, we would not have been able to stop them from scoring. Luckily, Baron stopped the Clippers from scoring all by himself.

Without a shot blocker in the middle, it also opens it up for other, smaller players to penetrate and score.

I'm not bashing Juwan. I had high hopes for him as a veteran mentor and thought he still had enough left to provide a few quality minutes a game at the back-up 4. He has exceeded my wildest expectations. But, long term, other teams will figure out, like Philadelphia did, all they have to do is pound the ball inside and they can beat us. The 76ers had great success doing so, and they aren't exactly a good team loaded with quality bigs. I'm glad Denver didn't do it more, and even more glad the Clippers stopped doing it when it mattered. As soon as other teams watch some game film - especially that 76ers game, I'm afraid we're going to be in "big" trouble (pun intended).

BNM
 
Boob-No-More said:
I'm not disputing any of that. All I'm saying is Juwan has significant experience playing the center position in the NBA - on both offense and defense. That experience, and what he learned, is obviously paying dividends now.

But, let's not go overboard here. While what he's doing is very impressive for a 6'9" 36-year old, we're still a much better team with Greg and/or Joel playing center. Juwan is doing a great job boxing out his taller opponents, but he simply isn't big enough to keep those same taller opponents from scoring on him.

We got absolutely killed in the paint by the 76ers. Dalembert went 7-9 and had 14 points - over twice his seasonal average and one of his best games of the season. Brand was simply overpowering. 11-16 and 25 points - his highest point total all season. Speights was 7-8 and scored 14 points in 17 minutes. No way do those three guys combine for 49 points on 76% shooting (25-33) if we have Greg or Joel defending the paint.

And thank god for Baron "2-15" Davis, or we would have lost last night, too. If Davis had simply kept pounding the ball into Kaman (12-19, 25 points), rather than insisting on taking (and missing) every shot down the stretch, we would not have been able to stop them from scoring. Luckily, Baron stopped the Clippers from scoring all by himself.

Without a shot blocker in the middle, it also opens it up for other, smaller players to penetrate and score.

I'm not bashing Juwan. I had high hopes for him as a veteran mentor and thought he still had enough left to provide a few quality minutes a game at the back-up 4. He has exceeded my wildest expectations. But, long term, other teams will figure out, like Philadelphia did, all they have to do is pound the ball inside and they can beat us. The 76ers had great success doing so, and they aren't exactly a good team loaded with quality bigs. I'm glad Denver didn't do it more, and even more glad the Clippers stopped doing it when it mattered. As soon as other teams watch some game film - especially that 76ers game, I'm afraid we're going to be in "big" trouble (pun intended).

BNM
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I agree with most of this & am not suggesting Juwan is the answer. I just can't believe he's even been serviceable playing this many minutes at the 5. Did you think we would beat Dallas, Denver, SA, & the Clippers (with Kaman/Camby) w/o Joel? Not only beat them, but outrebound them? I would have predicted a total collapse in the front court, losses piling up, and getting outrebounded by double digits a night. Who didn't know that Kaman was going to have a big game last night? Nobody expects Juwan to shut a guy like that down (the way Greg or Joel might) You just hope he doesn't get abused for 30/15. Would I rather have Greg or Joel in there? Hell Yes!!! It's hard to imagine Juwan hanging in there for 40 something more games like this. If I'm going "overboard" it's because it's completely unexpected. No way could I have imagined that with Juwan Howard & Jeff Pendegraph as our Centers we would be 4-1 with a +10 rebounding advantage against some of the better rebounding teams in the league.
 
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