I can feel them coming... the Lillard Wars

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Rastapopoulos said:
I want a video of him playing point guard and running a team against a top college team. That's the video I want to see.
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Which means of course that to be fair he would need a new set of teammates to play with as well. We mention that his stats in the few games he played against good competition were not very good but we have no clue how his Weber State teammates effected his play. How would have Lillard's stats changed if he started for Kentucky? Less points and more assists possibly? I bet his W/L record would have been better and his shooting percentage would be higher in those big games as the the main focus of the other team's defensive game plan could not have been all about stopping him.

He will be interesting to watch in the NBA if he plays for a team with a bunch of scorers.
 
Blaze01 said:
Is he? b\c he really doesn't play or pass like one....Waiters has some explosion to his game and can absorb contact and still finish....I don't see that with Lillard.....
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Lillard doesn't look explosive to you? He's a great athlete with a strong build. I grant you that he didnt have to absorb contact from NBA level big men/defenders, but he was exceptional at it against the people who he did play against, who werent exactly small bodied compared to him. I've seen good passes from him and he displays the kind of intelligence that aids with passing and making the right decisions. You have every right and reason to be doubtful of his PG abilities. In my opinion the same can be said about most PG prospects coming out of college in recent years. Lillard didn't try to be a pass first point guard and fail though, he was needed to be a scorer and he did so in an incredibly efficient manor.
 
3RA1N1AC said:
i think the small school with the questionable competition is a fairly valid drawback, but thats why theres scouts watching every minute of every game hes ever played in
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That's what i would need to do t make a good decision on Lillard; my first question is why a guy who shoots so well in workouts didn't have a higher shooting percent against the subpar defenders he went up against almost every night? Was he constantly double-teamed or what?
 
UKRAINEFAN said:
That's what i would need to do t make a good decision on Lillard; my first question is why a guy who shoots so well in workouts didn't have a higher shooting percent against the subpar defenders he went up against almost every night? Was he constantly double-teamed or what?
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Well he was the focus of the other team's defense that's for sure.
 
Lillard looks to have good enough handles to play PG. That's the key for him. My friend, Randy, thinks a PG doesn't necessarily have to have great court vision to be a good PG. His beliefs are that a scoring type PG simply needs to have the desire to give up the ball. Most guys that are so called shoot first PG's can succeed in the league and make their teams better by drawing and dishing. He seems quick enough to get by people, unlike Marshall, and assuming he will pass if the defense collapses on him, then he would be a great fit.
 
Mediocre Man said:
Lillard looks to have good enough handles to play PG. That's the key for him. My friend, Randy, thinks a PG doesn't necessarily have to have great court vision to be a good PG. His beliefs are that a scoring type PG simply needs to have the desire to give up the ball. Most guys that are so called shoot first PG's can succeed in the league and make their teams better by drawing and dishing. He seems quick enough to get by people, unlike Marshall, and assuming he will pass if the defense collapses on him, then he would be a great fit.
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I think this is an excellent point. The selfish-type shoot first point guards that none of us want, are not so bad because they don't have super court vision, but bad because they refuse to move the ball. Is it worth sacrificing outside shooting, defensive speed, and ability to get into the lane for super court vision? That is Lillard v. Marshall.
 
VanillaGorilla said:
Lillard doesn't look explosive to you? He's a great athlete with a strong build. I grant you that he didnt have to absorb contact from NBA level big men/defenders, but he was exceptional at it against the people who he did play against, who werent exactly small bodied compared to him. I've seen good passes from him and he displays the kind of intelligence that aids with passing and making the right decisions. You have every right and reason to be doubtful of his PG abilities. In my opinion the same can be said about most PG prospects coming out of college in recent years. Lillard didn't try to be a pass first point guard and fail though, he was needed to be a scorer and he did so in an incredibly efficient manor.
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Did you see Westbrook last night? THAT is explosive....Lillard is nowhere near that level of athleticism....

Anyone comparing Lillard to Westbrook or Rose (not saying it was you) is suffering from delusions of grandeur.....
 
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Blaze01 said:
Did you see Westbrook last night? THAT is explosive....Lillard is nowhere near that level of athleticism....

Anyone comparing Lillard to Westbrook or Rose (not saying it was you) is suffering fromdelusion of grandeur.....
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I am not arguing for or against, just offering up combine numbers of the two, and including Bayless as well because he is an athletic freak like Westbrook that hasn't seen as much success.

W/O shoes
RW 6' 2.25"
JB 6' 1.75"
DL 6' 1.75"

W shoes
6' 3.5"
6' 3"
6' 2.75"

Weight
192
204
189

Wingspan
6' 7.75"
6' 3.5"
6' 7.75"

Reach
8' 4"
8' 1"
7' 11.5"

Body fat
4.8
4.7
5.9

No step Vert
30.0
31.0
34.5

No step vert reach
10' 10"
10' 8"
10' 10"

Max vert
36.5
38.0
39.5

Max vert reach
11' 4.5"
11' 3"
11' 3"

BP reps
12
10
13

Agility
10.98
11.26
11.15

Sprint
3.08
3.07
3.34


Not sure what this tells us, if anything, but it seems, on paper anyway, that he is a very good athlete, no?
 
I'm not arguing for or against either, but it's also worth noting that some guys can't play at "full throttle" and stay in control using all of their athleticism.
 
Blaze01 said:
Did you see Westbrook last night? THAT is explosive....Lillard is nowhere near that level of athleticism....
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Yeah, but I also saw Westbrook chuck some really poorly selected shots. I guess I'm not ever for chucking a shot in the first five seconds of the shot clock when you brought the ball up (no passes) and you are settling for a shot two feet inside the 3pt line.

I think the point is that Lillard is not exactly a slug. The guy has dunked over a bunch of guys in games, more so than your average point guard (check the video). He also seems to know where his good shots are. Westbrook was a total posterizer in college, but also a loose canon. Lillard is posterizer lite, but shows much better shot selection and shooting ability.

I think Lillard could end up being a more athletic version of Porter. I can see him averaging 5-7 asst/game, but scoring efficiently too.
 
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dunking over guys in the Big sky? I didn't see him dunking over a lot of guys, in fact for all of his "athleticism" he barely gets the ball above the rim when he dunks it....I don't think he is going to be dunking over very many NBA players....

and combine comparisons don't mean much to me...you could fill a database with players who have combine numbers comparable to some of the top NBA players right now and a lot of those guys are not even in the league anymore....It is how you use it in the game that matters....

Westbrook does take some ill advised shots, but his explosion to the basket and high degree of difficulty on some of those shots was incredible...He made D-Wade look like an old man....

I think Lillard is going to be a "Mo Williams lite" kind of player (best case), he will rely on outside shooting for most of his points, if he can, b\c when he drives to the basket, I don't think he has the body\size\athleticicsm to finish with contact....
 
Im not a lillard fan, but the guy can shoot wayyy better than Russell. I think that's extremely important for a PG that plays with a star big man. Westbrook plays with a star wing so he doesnt have to be the greatest shooter.
 
Blaze, watch some more video. There are several clips of him driving through traffic and dunking with guys all around him. And, I don't think it is realistic to assume that a guy who lived at the FT line in college will all the sudden stop driving in the NBA, especially when he clearly has the leaping ability to do so. If that is the case then we should also assume the Barnes will not be able to hit the 3, and MKG will not be able to penetrate.
 
Sounds like Seth Sommerfeld (nbadraft.net) who is being interviewed right now on Blazer TV seems to love Lillard. Just agreed that Lillard suffered from having weak assist numbers due to the talent around him. Watched him alot at Webber State.

Talking Drummond right now and how his POTENTIAL is off the charts. Was rated #1 for much of the season in regards to the draft. Suffered from the Ucon instability this year.

He thinks either one is a good choice, but loves Lillard.
 
Blaze01 said:
Did you see Westbrook last night? THAT is explosive....Lillard is nowhere near that level of athleticism....

Anyone comparing Lillard to Westbrook or Rose (not saying it was you) is suffering from delusions of grandeur.....
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Westbrook was listed as max vert of 36.5". Lillard has a max vert 39.5". Lillard is near that level of athleticism.
 
MickZagger said:
Westbrook was listed as max vert of 36.5". Lillard has a max vert 39.5". Lillard is near that level of athleticism.
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It's a matter of how much you use it in games. Westbrook uses it all the time. Brandon had it too, but only uncorked it when he wanted to make a statement. I think Lillard is in between. I can see him using at times, but not looking to posterize every time he gets the ball like Westbrook used to.
 
This is where your disconnect comes from...they don't PLAY nearly the same...not even close. Westbrook is FAR FAR more athletic and EXPLOSIVE than Lillard and it is not even close....

Lillard may show some of those athletic combine measureable but his game on the court does not reflect it at all....

I seriously don't know how ANYONE can even remotely compare Lillard to Westbrook or Rose that is just ludicrous IMO......

I think any team taking Lillard in the top 10 is a sucker...just hope it isn't POR....

He won't even work out against some of the other top recruits....what a joke....running 3 on 3 drills at the combine isn't "competing" against other top guys..lol...especially when a lot of those other top guys didn't even participate...
 
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This guy isn't athletic and won't take contact. Food for thought:
lillard.jpeg

Lillard.jpeg

dame.jpg

story-11-wildcats-110819.jpg
 
Blaze01 said:
This is where your disconnect comes from...they don't PLAY nearly the same...not even close. Westbrook is FAR FAR more athletic and EXPLOSIVE than Lillard and it is not even close....

Lillard may show some of those athletic combine measureable but his game on the court does not reflect it at all....

I seriously don't know how ANYONE can even remotely compare Lillard to Westbrook or Rose that is just ludicrous IMO......

I think any team taking Lillard in the top 10 is a sucker...just hope it isn't POR....

He won't even work out against some of the other top recruits....what a joke....running 3 on 3 drills at the combine isn't "competing" against other top guys..lol...especially when a lot of those other top guys didn't even participate...
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Can you give me a link about him not working out against other top recruits?
 
That is true. He manned up and went to the combine, played well there, but is not only doing individual workouts. There was a report out of N.O. that they wanted him in a group and he would only do solo.
 
I haven't read that. I'd like to read it.

Lillard actually is working out with teams, unlike the Waiters who Blaze loves, who cancelled all workouts.
 
Has he?

Show me that he has outside of running 3 on 3 drills @ the combine....

Nice picture of him....I guess...looks like he is about an 1" from rim checking himself...
 
MickZagger said:
Can you give me a link about him not working out against other top recruits?
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It was actually in a tweet or something after his workout in Portland. He said he worked out against guys at the combine, but he and his agent wanted the individual team workouts to be all about him. I will try and find the link with that statement
 
Blaze01 said:
Has he?

Show me that he has outside of running 3 on 3 drills @ the combine....

Nice picture of him....I guess...looks like he is about an 1" from rim checking himself...
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rim checking like Westbrook did last night?

You're getting desperate.
 
I agree he isn't Westbrook, but he is very athletic and takes it inside a lot. Seriously, watch some video. He packs it down in a crowd on several occasions. But, he also comes with shot discipline and a very consistent outside shot. Maybe one of the most consistent shots in this draft class.
 
MickZagger said:
rim checking like Westbrook did last night?

You're getting desperate.
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lol...ok...Yeah ignore the rest of the drives and the 43 he hung on the Heat....WOW.....

I would say comparing Lillard to Westbrook and\or Rose is more desperate...

Lillard is fools gold....and some of you guys are buying right into it...
 
Blaze01 said:
lol...ok...Yeah ignore the rest of the drives and the 43 he hung on the Heat....WOW.....

I would say comparing Lillard to Westbrook and\or Rose is more desperate...

Lillard is fools gold....and some of you guys are buying right into it...
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Comparing them as athletes isn't desperate. You brought up the comparisons. People brought measurements in as facts, when you brought conjecture to the table.
 
Blaze01 said:
Has he?

Show me that he has outside of running 3 on 3 drills @ the combine....

Nice picture of him....I guess...looks like he is about an 1" from rim checking himself...
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Why does it not matter to you that Waiters won't workout or interview with ANYONE?
 
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