I don't see how we can rebuild around Dame

[Rastapopoulos]

Neil Olshey actually built a team around CP3 with the Clippers....didn't translate to championships...just like us. I said at 38 he's still ring chasing....not that the Suns are building around him

Not really - once again, he added CP3 TO a team with Blake Griffin (back when he had knees). No, didn't translate to championships but made the Clippers not just relevant but contenders. THE CLIPPERS. I think people forget exactly what laughing stock the Clippers were for decades in the pre-Ballmer times. And that's being in LA, where all free agents want to go.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

I'd be good with that run. Those were good years and Indy had a legit shot. Sign me up!

All that has to happen is that Joe Cronin has to be a top 3 GM in the league, with a lot of luck.

 

[twobullz]

We have Dame. You think we're making the playoffs this year?

Dame has missed 5 games, CJ who knows how many games he will miss and we are one game out of the play in spot, so yeah I think when all is said and done we are in at least the play in game if not higher up.

 

[blazerkor]

We have Dame. You think we're making the playoffs this year?

We have an injured Dame. You know that people who speak in absolutes sound clueless right? If you said it is unlikely that we win a championship with Dame your words wouldn't ring so hollow. Also I notice that you like to tout Olshey's moves around the margin as us building around Dame when Dame has been paired with CJ since his third season and since that point they've been the worst defensive back court in the league. So I don't know how you're so sure that a team in Portland built around Dame... without CJ and with solid defenders all around Dame can't contend. We haven't seen that tried yet. So until we try to change the core around Dame and see what those results are your certainty is baseless blow hard opinion.

 

[Phatguysrule]

All that has to happen is that Joe Cronin has to be a top 3 GM in the league, with a lot of luck.

Yep! But we have a player as good as Dame. So that's already the hardest part. We've never had that before, and we've had some incredible runs.

 

[Orion Bailey]

We are not Boston in this analogy. We are Minnesota. KG was loyal to Minny for years, they tried to build around him... they failed. Then they traded him to a contender and he won a title. Do Dame the same service.

(Also: Boston already had Paul Pierce and I believe they had already acquired Ray Allen. If you think we're Boston, then presumably Dame is Paul Pierce. So who're we trading to get KG?)

you have made some great points but this is where you lost me. If we are minni and Dame is our Garnett and we trade him,
We end up like Minnesota??? Nooooooo Thanks!

 

[Ripcity4life77]

I am TIRED of hearing we should trade Dame but do not get me wrong I do understand why some might think that but to be blunt -- that is a F"ed up idea at least at this time and this is WHY and it's a simple reason so here it is ......

Dame is an " A Plus " talent that does not come around often and when you have one of these talents you TRY and hold unto it for as long as you can before getting rid / trading said talent IF for some reason you do not get this point then you need too ... BUT I will say that after you make some changes ala trade CJ , Nurk etc and in another season ( 2 tops ) IF it's still a shit show then maybe that idea has some merit but again -- Do not trade Dame until every other option has been done but until then you ride with Dame as the lead dog and just hope whatever new players the new GM brings in can turn this ship around.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

you have made some great points but this is where you lost me. If we are minni and Dame is our Garnett and we trade him,
We end up like Minnesota??? Nooooooo Thanks!

Don't be selfish. Don't you want Dame to get a title?

 

[Orion Bailey]

Don't be selfish. Don't you want Dame to get a title?

Is it being selfish if the man himself says he doesn't want to be traded? Wouldn't it then be more selfish to trade a player who has made it clear he doesn't want that?

 

[julius]

Don't be selfish. Don't you want Dame to get a title?

I want Portland to win a title. I honestly don't care if Damian wins one (if it's not while playing for Portland).

 

[riverman]

I want Portland to win a title. I honestly don't care if Damian wins one (if it's not while playing for Portland).

then your wish has been fulfilled because Portland has a title already

 

[blazerkor]

then your wish has been fulfilled because Portland has a title already

Not in my lifetime... so I'm trying to see that as soon as I can for myself. Call me crazy but I never think it's wrong to want your team to win another title.

 

[illmatic99]

Do you have a point? (It would be a first.)

coming from you.

lol rich.

 

[Strenuus]

Don't be selfish. Don't you want Dame to get a title?

Dame has said if he doesn't win a title he's fine. He wants to win it here.

As he said, stop trying to think of what he wants or what other people thinks he wants. That in it of itself is selfish. So here we are.

 

[MickZagger]

Years ago the Spurs were a legit contender and David Robinson had a season ending injury. They tanked and landed Tim Duncan and won multiple championships. If Lillard needs to sit out for the year and we need to lose a lot, it might not be the worst thing

 

[MickZagger]

How is it silly?
How did trading Drexler work out for us?

The idea that you think we're going to get anything close to Dame's value in return is silly. We're not. We can easily get just as much after next season if we try and fail. Especially if we get him healthy and he gets back to form, as I expect he will.

That’s why you trade aging stars for high picks. Top 5. Shit, we trade an aging star (Gerald Wallace) for the 6th pick and drafted Lillard

 

[Phatguysrule]

That’s why you trade aging stars for high picks. Top 5. Shit, we trade an aging star (Gerald Wallace) for the 6th pick and drafted Lillard

Which we could easily do after next season

 

[MickZagger]

Which we could easily do after next season

sell high in my opinion. Unless we can get another legit star next to Lillard which I doubt we will be able to do, things won’t get any better:

 

[Phatguysrule]

sell high in my opinion. Unless we can get another legit star next to Lillard which I doubt we will be able to do, things won’t get any better:

Get him some rest and get him back in good form and his value will be higher next season.

 

[blazerkor]

We get what we can for CJ, RoCo, Nurk and Ant this season... players that would actually complement Dame's game and work in Chauncey's system and then you use whatever you get for them, Dame, Norm, Nas and Larry and that's where you start to build a cohesive unit.

 

[KSF-ERIC]

He means that the Lakers traded Kwame Brown and Marc Gasol to get Pau Gasol (and Marc Gasol was the important piece to make that work). So does Portland have a Marc Gasol to trade for a top-end player?

Marc Gasol was an unknown quantity. Basically Greg Brown compares now.

 

[Phatguysrule]

He means that the Lakers traded Kwame Brown and Marc Gasol to get Pau Gasol (and Marc Gasol was the important piece to make that work). So does Portland have a Marc Gasol to trade for a top-end player?

Gotcha. Yeah, Portland has a lot of guys as valuable as Marc Gasol was at that time.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Marc Gasol was an unknown quantity. Basically Greg Brown compares now.

Uh huh. Well, here's hoping our GM could convince another GM of that.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Dame has said if he doesn't win a title he's fine. He wants to win it here.

As he said, stop trying to think of what he wants or what other people thinks he wants. That in it of itself is selfish. So here we are.

So let me get this straight:
"Give money to the poor!"
"How do you know they want it? Stop trying to think of what other people want! That's selfish!"

How about we keep words for what they actually mean. Dame, being human, wants a lot of things, not all of them consistent. I'm sure top of his list is winning a championship with the Blazers. Great. Sadly, that's not going to happen (barring every other team losing all its good players to Covid). Also, if we hold on to Dame too long it will set back any rebuild for several years, and it'll just be sad watching him jack up shots for lottery teams as we get mad at him. I think, because of they way he died young, people have forgotten how shitty Kobe's last couple of years were with the Lakers. And that's a team that can rely on signing any big free agent out there. We're a team whose greatest FA acquisition ever was Brian Grant.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Lol… thats an interesting comparison. Because getting free money has all the baggage of uprooting a family, starting over, etc…

come on Rasta, you told me to stop being selfish but its clearly evident your motives are not based on what Dame has said, taking him for his word. But rather a selfish motive based on what you THINK he wants, vs what he has said he wants.

Ill go what what he has said over what you think. Sorry.

 

[Minstrel]

Marc Gasol was an unknown quantity. Basically Greg Brown compares now.

Gotcha. Yeah, Portland has a lot of guys as valuable as Marc Gasol was at that time.

Marc Gasol wasn't an unknown like Greg Brown. Gasol was considered an excellent prospect who had already played well in Europe.

I respectfully disagree that Portland has "lots of guys" as valuable as Marc Gasol back then. I don't think even Little is as valuable as prospect Marc Gasol and Little is by far the most valuable young player Portland has. Marc Gasol was the reason that Memphis was willing to part with Pau Gasol--Portland doesn't have a young player who could command a top-level player in return.

 

[illmatic99]

Marc Gasol wasn't an unknown like Greg Brown. Gasol was considered an excellent prospect who had already played well in Europe.

I respectfully disagree that Portland has "lots of guys" as valuable as Marc Gasol back then. I don't think even Little is as valuable as prospect Marc Gasol and Little is by far the most valuable young player Portland has. Marc Gasol was the reason that Memphis was willing to part with Pau Gasol--Portland doesn't have a young player who could command a top-level player in return.

This is a bit of revisionist history. Marc Gasol was the 48th pick in the draft a yr before the trade, and his name was hardly mentioned by the pundits who analyzed the deal after. He was so obviously a throw-in. Even Gregg Popovich (given SA's history of scouting in Europe) was vocal in how one-sided that deal was in LA's favor. He was hardly a known entity. And he had put up OK numbers one season on an above average team in Europe. Come on, man.

Greg Brown has arguably more pedigree at age 20 than Gasol did at the same age. As do Nas/Ant.

"What they did in Memphis is beyond comprehension," said Popovich. "There should be a trade committee that can scratch all trades that make no sense. I just wish I had been on a trade committee that oversees NBA trades. I'd like to elect myself to that committee. I would have voted no to the L.A. trade."

When told that Wallace had challenged executives to criticize the deal publicly, Popovich replied, "Well, there you go. I'm on the record."

 

[Minstrel]

This is a bit of revisionist history. Marc Gasol was the 48th pick in the draft a yr before the trade, and his name was hardly mentioned by the pundits who analyzed the deal after. He was so obviously a throw-in. Even Gregg Popovich (who given SA's history of scouting in Europe) was vocal in how one-sided that deal was in LA's favor. He was hardly a known entity. And he had put up OK numbers one season on a shit team in Europe. Come on, man.

Greg Brown has arguably more pedigree at age 20 than Gasol did at the same age.

"What they did in Memphis is beyond comprehension," said Popovich. "There should be a trade committee that can scratch all trades that make no sense. I just wish I had been on a trade committee that oversees NBA trades. I'd like to elect myself to that committee. I would have voted no to the L.A. trade."

When told that Wallace had challenged executives to criticize the deal publicly, Popovich replied, "Well, there you go. I'm on the record."

I remember conversations at the time about the trade in this community (though I guess it was back when it was on BasketballBoards.net, before the big exodus here), where people pointed out that Gasol was an excellent prospect based on his play in Europe. I think one thing you're overlooking in how the trade was viewed at the time is that back then people had a lot less respect for the importance of excellent play in Europe. So for many teams, sure, Gasol may not have rated highly--but Memphis was obviously not one of those teams, considering they had just had one of their best eras built around a star Spaniard.

As for Popovich, he's always been about gamesmanship. Marc Gasol on the Lakers didn't imminently threaten his Spurs teams--a fully-developed Pau Gasol did. Him saying the trade shouldn't be allowed doesn't mean much, IMO.

 

[illmatic99]

I think one thing you're overlooking in how the trade was viewed at the time is that back then people had a lot less respect for the importance of excellent play in Europe. IMO.

You're typing that like Andrea Bargnani wasn't the number 1 pick in the draft before Gasol's. And again with this excellent play. This isn't exactly setting the world on fire.

 

[Minstrel]

You're tying that like Andrea Bargnani wasn't the number 1 pick in the draft before Gasol's.

No, I'm not saying European prospects were ignored. I'm not sure how you could get that out of my post.