I Love Unions!

[maxiep]

You can't make this shit up.

http://deceiver.com/2010/08/13/union-member-fired-for-attempting-to-unionize/

 

[MickZagger]

Well I love Onions.

 

[44Thrilla]

hahaha

 

[boatsandstars]

hey hey, another thing Maxie hates! Thanks for sharing your thoughts, dude.

 

[Shooter]

hey hey, another thing Maxie hates! Thanks for sharing your thoughts, dude.

And thanks for another vapid, totally worthless post, which is all we ever get from you.

 

[MickZagger]

I'm actually a teamster and I love every minute of it.

 

[MickZagger]

Thanks to my worthless Union, I have been receiving 60% of my paycheck weekly since April. Also, I got my hospital bill in late-August. My 4 surgeries combined and the 28 days I spent in the hospital would have cost me $218,000, I ended up getting the bill and it came to a whopping total of $120 bucks out of pocket. Also, getting the exact same job back when I go back Dec. 1st.

Not to mention with my co-pay for all the medication that I have needed is costing me $10 and it has covered every medication that my Doc has prescribed.

It sure sucks having great health care due to my horrible union. The only people who hates Unions are those who don't belong to a Union.

 

[44Thrilla]

I belong to a Union and I hate it.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I am not in a Union and I'm jellus that I can't get more free shit.

 

[MickZagger]

I belong to a Union and I hate it.

What do you do? What do you hate about it? Sure, there's a few lazy asses, but the positives far outweigh the negatives.

 

[blazerboy30]

What do you do? What do you hate about it? Sure, there's a few lazy asses, but the positives far outweigh the negatives.

Not for people that actually like to get stuff done, and have some pride in their profession.

 

[BLAZER PROPHET]

I've belonged to two unions. Both were terrible. That said, I did try to unionize claims adjusters once about 6 years ago, but too many people thought the insurance companies would fire them.

As for this guy who got fired, I think it pretty much shows the real thinking of those at the top of unions. It's all about their bling first and workers second.

 

[barfo]

As for this guy who got fired, I think it pretty much shows the real thinking of those at the top of unions. It's all about their bling first and workers second.

Unlike at the top of other organizations, where the executives aren't like that at all.

barfo

 

[MickZagger]

Not for people that actually like to get stuff done, and have some pride in their profession.

I like to get things done and take pride in my profession.

Like any profession, people let a couple bad apples ruin the whole bunch. I take it you've never worked a Union job?

 

[MARIS61]

The unions made America the greatest producer in the world. It was taken for granted we made the best shit anywhere.

After Reagan de-nuded most of them, well, you can see we're no longer much of anything special.

Want to fix the economy? Bring back the unions in full force.

 

[tlongII]

Ask the folks in Detroit how unions are working out for them...

 

[MARIS61]

Ask the folks in Detroit how unions are working out for them...

Good example to demonstrate my POV.

Detroit is dying because nobody is buying cars.

Nobody is buying cars because they're working for peanuts, have had their bennies axed or reduced, taken pay cuts, and their healthcare costs doubled over the last 3 years.

If they had a union they'd have better pay, which would allow them to buy a new car and Detroit would be rockin' again.

The "economy" is really just all the workers.

Without workers, there would be no economy.

Healthy, happy, comfortable workers = Healthy, happy, comfortable economy.

The opposite is also true.

 

[maxiep]

Unions saved this country from communism in the first part of the 20th century. We can thank unions for the 40 hour work week, paid vacation and safe work places. However, like the buggy whip, they've outlived their usefulness. The government has taken the place of unions by ensuring that workers have rights.

And public unions are especially harmful and should be outlawed. Public unions and the politicians who owe them their seats work together to rob taxpayers.

Non-union worker manage to earn decent salaries, get good benefits and health care without having to pay unions a large portion of their wages. In contrast, blue collar union jobs have been decimated by employers moving their jobs to Right To Work states or abroad. Their greed killed the steel, textile and auto industries in this country and unions have no one to blame but themselves.

 

[blazerboy30]

I like to get things done and take pride in my profession.

Like any profession, people let a couple bad apples ruin the whole bunch. I take it you've never worked a Union job?

Yes, I have. It was an absolute joke trying to get real work done.

It was great if I wanted to take mandated breaks, get an extra 10 minutes paid lunch for a total of 40 whopping minutes, get to clock in and out, etc, etc.

 

[barfo]

Unions saved this country from communism in the first part of the 20th century. We can thank unions for the 40 hour work week, paid vacation and safe work places. However, like the buggy whip, they've outlived their usefulness. The government has taken the place of unions by ensuring that workers have rights.

So you are in favor of having the government ensure workplace rights? I agree, if the government is a strong enough regulator, the need for unions is greatly diminished. But I thought you'd be against that.

Non-union worker manage to earn decent salaries, get good benefits and health care without having to pay unions a large portion of their wages.

It's been many a year since I was a Teamster, but I don't remember the union taking anything approaching a large portion of my wages.
Google says Teamster dues are currently 2.5 hours of wage per month. That's about 1.5%. Doesn't seem excessive, if the union is doing a good job of negotiating wages/benefits/etc. I'm quite sure that when I was a Teamster, I made more than 1.5% more in wages because I had someone negotiating my contract for me.

In contrast, blue collar union jobs have been decimated by employers moving their jobs to Right To Work states or abroad. Their greed killed the steel, textile and auto industries in this country and unions have no one to blame but themselves.

Well, they could also blame the company management which signed off on overly generous deals. It does take two to tango. They could also blame the financial industry which rewarded companies for moving jobs away. And they could blame the transportation and telecommunications industries for the advances that made it feasible to move those jobs overseas. Or maybe they could be glad they got their piece of the pie before the jobs were inevitably shipped out anyway.

barfo

 

[maxiep]

So you are in favor of having the government ensure workplace rights? I agree, if the government is a strong enough regulator, the need for unions is greatly diminished. But I thought you'd be against that.

I'm for limited government, not anarchy. You have me mistaken for someone else.

It's been many a year since I was a Teamster, but I don't remember the union taking anything approaching a large portion of my wages.
Google says Teamster dues are currently 2.5 hours of wage per month. That's about 1.5%. Doesn't seem excessive, if the union is doing a good job of negotiating wages/benefits/etc. I'm quite sure that when I was a Teamster, I made more than 1.5% more in wages because I had someone negotiating my contract for me.

That's only part of the picture. You're not calculating what damage is done to the company. Unionized companies can't be as efficient, so they can't be as competitive. Who knows how many jobs were lost because companies wanted to minimize the number of jobs subject to unions. Not to mention the wages lost due to strikes.

Well, they could also blame the company management which signed off on overly generous deals. It does take two to tango.

I can't imagine it would be much fun to dance with a gun to your head.

They could also blame the financial industry which rewarded companies for moving jobs away.

Actually, it is investors that reward companies for running efficient operations and consumers who reward companies for offering good value.

And they could blame the transportation and telecommunications industries for the advances that made it feasible to move those jobs overseas.

You can't stop progress. You have to adapt. Disintermediation of the value chain has been the defining issue of our time for corporations. Many have adapted. Others have died.

Or maybe they could be glad they got their piece of the pie before the jobs were inevitably shipped out anyway.

barfo

Ask WalMart or Nucor or Honda or Toyota about their competitive stature in the face of unionization by their competitors. They have thrived in the US while their competitors have withered.

 

[MickZagger]

Unions saved this country from communism in the first part of the 20th century. We can thank unions for the 40 hour work week, paid vacation and safe work places. However, like the buggy whip, they've outlived their usefulness. The government has taken the place of unions by ensuring that workers have rights.

And public unions are especially harmful and should be outlawed. Public unions and the politicians who owe them their seats work together to rob taxpayers.

Non-union worker manage to earn decent salaries, get good benefits and health care without having to pay unions a large portion of their wages. In contrast, blue collar union jobs have been decimated by employers moving their jobs to Right To Work states or abroad. Their greed killed the steel, textile and auto industries in this country and unions have no one to blame but themselves.

My union dues are so small that its hardly even noticeable.

 

[MickZagger]

Yes, I have. It was an absolute joke trying to get real work done.

It was great if I wanted to take mandated breaks, get an extra 10 minutes paid lunch for a total of 40 whopping minutes, get to clock in and out, etc, etc.

So you don't like Unions because they force you to clock in and out and take breaks? I thought those were state mandated things.

 

[maxiep]

My union dues are so small that its hardly even noticeable.

Like I said in a later post, there are other indirect costs.

 

[barfo]

I'm for limited government, not anarchy. You have me mistaken for someone else.

It's possible.

That's only part of the picture. You're not calculating what damage is done to the company. Unionized companies can't be as efficient, so they can't be as competitive. Who knows how many jobs were lost because companies wanted to minimize the number of jobs subject to unions. Not to mention the wages lost due to strikes.

You are changing the subject here. I was responding to your comment that the union workers pay large amounts of dues. Of course dues aren't the only aspect of unionism. But they were the only aspect that you mentioned in the comment I was responding to.

I can't imagine it would be much fun to dance with a gun to your head.

You can't imagine it would be much fun to be out-negotiated, you mean? The companies were not without power, they just were too willing to believe in their own rosy predictions of growth and take the easy path. They screwed up.

If you were selling me a commercial building worth $100 million, and you asked me for $300 million, and I agreed to that, whose fault would it be that I overpaid? Yours?

Actually, it is investors that reward companies for running efficient operations and consumers who reward companies for offering good value.

Exactly. Americans caused the jobs to move overseas. If we are willing to buy products made in China for $1/hour, does it really matter what union wages in the US are?

You can't stop progress. You have to adapt. Disintermediation of the value chain has been the defining issue of our time for corporations. Many have adapted. Others have died.

Correct. I thought you were complaining about the ones that had died. You said that union greed had killed the auto, steel, textile industries. But in truth, those industries didn't/couldn't adapt to low-wage foreign competition [except autos, which couldn't adapt to high-wage foreign competition]. It wasn't the unions primarily. The unions didn't help, but the train was leaving the station no matter what the unions did.

Ask WalMart or Nucor or Honda or Toyota about their competitive stature in the face of unionization by their competitors. They have thrived in the US while their competitors have withered.

Walmart is retail, you can't very well move retail jobs offshore. Honda and Toyota built better products for many years. Had nothing really to do with being unionized or not (hell, Japanese workers, while maybe not being literally union members, might as well be for all the protections they have). Nucor - pause here while I google Nucor - I don't know enough about Nucor to comment, and their website is too slow/cheesy to deal with.

barfo

 

[MickZagger]

Like I said in a later post, there are other indirect costs.

Which don't effect me as an employee.

 

[maxiep]

Which don't effect me as an employee.

It does if you have to go on strike, your job gets moved or downsized to avoid the high costs of paying union employee costs or another non-union competitor takes your company's market share.

 

[MickZagger]

It does if you have to go on strike, your job gets moved or downsized to avoid the high costs of paying union employee costs or another non-union competitor takes your company's market share.

My company's management is afraid of strike. Last time we striked (prior to me working there) the management and non-union supervisors were forced to do the work, which took long hours. Strike didn't last long and the workers got what they wanted. They also lost tons of contracts they had with major companies.

Its weird how it went from how we have to pay a "large portion" of our wages to union dues to talking about what we have to sacrifice if a strike is to happen.

Strikes happen so rarely its a non-issue. When strikes do happen its a majority thing and for a good cause.

 

[MickZagger]

Thanks to my worthless Union, I have been receiving 60% of my paycheck weekly since April. Also, I got my hospital bill in late-August. My 4 surgeries combined and the 28 days I spent in the hospital would have cost me $218,000, I ended up getting the bill and it came to a whopping total of $120 bucks out of pocket. Also, getting the exact same job back when I go back Dec. 1st.

Not to mention with my co-pay for all the medication that I have needed is costing me $10 and it has covered every medication that my Doc has prescribed.

It sure sucks having great health care due to my horrible union. The only people who hates Unions are those who don't belong to a Union.

So how many of you non-union workers would be able to miss up to 8 months of work, get paid 60% of your wages, have that good of health care coverage and can walk right back to your job and pick up where you left off like you never missed a day?

I would guess very few.

 

[maxiep]

My company's management is afraid of strike. Last time we striked (prior to me working there) the management and non-union supervisors were forced to do the work, which took long hours. Strike didn't last long and the workers got what they wanted. They also lost tons of contracts they had with major companies.

Its weird how it went from how we have to pay a "large portion" of our wages to union dues to talking about what we have to sacrifice if a strike is to happen.

Strikes happen so rarely its a non-issue. When strikes do happen its a majority thing and for a good cause.

Like the air traffic controllers? I have no beef with the rank and file, I just think unions are more about their own survival than benefiting their members. They create perverse incentives for corporations that lower their productivity. Bottom line, they're an externality that hurts the company's competitive position.