Iannazzone: Another 'Melo Rumor

[kobimel]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Multiple league sources said the Nets and Nuggets have discussed a blockbuster deal that would bring Anthony and Marcus Camby to New Jersey. In return, Denver would get a package that includes Richard Jefferson, Marcus Williams, Keith Van Horn's contract and the Nets' lottery pick. There likely is more involved to make the salaries match up, but the sources said the trade could happen, making Tuesday even more important.</div>

http://www.northjersey.com/sports/nets/Net...old_Nugget.html

I would do this trade in a heart beat if the pick isn't top 3. Is there really anyone who wouldn't?

 

[Dark Defender]

I doubt this will happen, too good to be true. If the Nets happen to get a top two pick, its a deal breaker.

 

[Petey]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dark Defender @ May 19 2008, 09:20 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I doubt this will happen, too good to be true. If the Nets happen to get a top two pick, its a deal breaker.</div>

Agreed. This is a no-brainer on both sides.

Nets should love this trade, Nuggets should say... No, and pass.

-Petey

 

[soul driver]

I can't really see this happening, as excited as I was when I read this article this morning. Unless, behind the scenes Melo and/or Camby really aren't happy on Denver and want to get shipped. Or Denver's management really feels that it's time to change things up again.

 

[kobe23]

Why the hell would Denver trade for Marcus Williams (another guard) and give back their best DEFENSIVE player in Camby?

No way they'd do that... As for the Nets though, they should jump on the gun as soon as denver gives the green light

 

[rory]

Yeah, I'm having a tough time seeing this from Denver's POV. I guess they would have to believe that a) Camby is on the downside of his career, b) the drop-off from Anthony to RJ is offset by the upgrade from Anthony Carter to Marcus Williams, and c) they can get a really good player at 10, i.e. DeAndre Jordan (who Denver can actually take time to develop with Nene and Martin already in the front-court). And they get some cap relief, I guess, but nothing that huge. But all of those are very large leaps of faith - I assume Denver would need more - i.e. Sean Williams, #21 or future picks, get a 3rd team involved, etc.

 

[Petey]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rory @ May 19 2008, 09:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, I'm having a tough time seeing this from Denver's POV. I guess they would have to believe that a) Camby is on the downside of his career, b) the drop-off from Anthony to RJ is offset by the upgrade from Anthony Carter to Marcus Williams, and c) they can get a really good player at 10, i.e. DeAndre Jordan (who Denver can actually take time to develop with Nene and Martin already in the front-court). And they get some cap relief, I guess, but nothing that huge. But all of those are very large leaps of faith - I assume Denver would need more - i.e. Sean Williams, #21 or future picks, get a 3rd team involved, etc.</div>

... LOL

Come one bro. Why would they think that? Kid is just that, a kid. It's not like we are talking about Barkley attempting a comeback.

-Petey

 

[rory]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Petey @ May 19 2008, 11:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rory @ May 19 2008, 09:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, I'm having a tough time seeing this from Denver's POV. I guess they would have to believe that a) Camby is on the downside of his career, b) the drop-off from Anthony to RJ is offset by the upgrade from Anthony Carter to Marcus Williams, and c) they can get a really good player at 10, i.e. DeAndre Jordan (who Denver can actually take time to develop with Nene and Martin already in the front-court). And they get some cap relief, I guess, but nothing that huge. But all of those are very large leaps of faith - I assume Denver would need more - i.e. Sean Williams, #21 or future picks, get a 3rd team involved, etc.</div>

... LOL

Come one bro. Why would they think that? Kid is just that, a kid. It's not like we are talking about Barkley attempting a comeback.

-Petey
</div>

Oh yeah, he's not washed-up...but he's 34, so it isn't like he's getting better each year. But, whatever, this is all make-believe right now.

 

[Netted]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rory @ May 19 2008, 10:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, I'm having a tough time seeing this from Denver's POV. I guess they would have to believe that a) Camby is on the downside of his career, b) the drop-off from Anthony to RJ is offset by the upgrade from Anthony Carter to Marcus Williams, and c) they can get a really good player at 10, i.e. DeAndre Jordan (who Denver can actually take time to develop with Nene and Martin already in the front-court). And they get some cap relief, I guess, but nothing that huge. But all of those are very large leaps of faith - I assume Denver would need more - i.e. Sean Williams, #21 or future picks, get a 3rd team involved, etc.</div>
Oh the savings are huge. About $4 million instantly (with the KVH contract) and more long term because the deal would probably include Swift who goes away next season (or Hassell who goes away in a 2 years).

They have Iverson who could be a free agent this summer and JR Smith they want to re-sign. Can't have Martin, Nene, Camby, Anthony, Iverson and Smith all earning massive paychecks. They also wouldn't part with Kleiza in trades this season so they therefore think he fits into there plans long term.

Marcus and the #10 pick also come in handy as cheap talent needed to round out a roster with a lot of high priced players.

I know the owner of the Nuggets has a lot of money, but I doubt he is looking to consistantly pay a high payroll <u>and</u> luxury taxes and get bounced in the 1st round every year. They are due for a shake up.

 

[cpawfan]

This trade makes the Nuggets worse now and in the future

It is dumber than pairing Zach Randolph and Eddy Curry

 

[Petey]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ May 19 2008, 10:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rory @ May 19 2008, 10:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, I'm having a tough time seeing this from Denver's POV. I guess they would have to believe that a) Camby is on the downside of his career, b) the drop-off from Anthony to RJ is offset by the upgrade from Anthony Carter to Marcus Williams, and c) they can get a really good player at 10, i.e. DeAndre Jordan (who Denver can actually take time to develop with Nene and Martin already in the front-court). And they get some cap relief, I guess, but nothing that huge. But all of those are very large leaps of faith - I assume Denver would need more - i.e. Sean Williams, #21 or future picks, get a 3rd team involved, etc.</div>
Oh the savings are huge. About $4 million instantly (with the KVH contract) and more long term because the deal would probably include Swift who goes away next season (or Hassell who goes away in a 2 years).

They have Iverson who could be a free agent this summer and JR Smith they want to re-sign. Can't have Martin, Nene, Camby, Anthony, Iverson and Smith all earning massive paychecks. They also wouldn't part with Kleiza in trades this season so they therefore think he fits into there plans long term.

Marcus and the #10 pick also come in handy as cheap talent needed to round out a roster with a lot of high priced players.

I know the owner of the Nuggets has a lot of money, but I doubt he is looking to consistantly pay a high payroll <u>and</u> luxury taxes and get bounced in the 1st round every year. They are due for a shake up.
</div>

It's only luxury tax savings as long as AI, Nene, and KMart (as well as RJ in this case) are on the books, it's not like they can go after anyone. Thing is they could shop Camby around, offering him and their pick, or another for an expiring contract. Don't think some team like Dallas would jump at that? Or some team close to real contention?

-Petey

 

[kdub]

So I have to bring this up. If the Nets DO grab a top 2 pick... would you guys keep it and draft Rose/Beasley, or trade it for Carmelo (the Nuggets would likely be in favor of the trade then).

 

[Netted]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Petey @ May 19 2008, 11:16 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ May 19 2008, 10:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rory @ May 19 2008, 10:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, I'm having a tough time seeing this from Denver's POV. I guess they would have to believe that a) Camby is on the downside of his career, b) the drop-off from Anthony to RJ is offset by the upgrade from Anthony Carter to Marcus Williams, and c) they can get a really good player at 10, i.e. DeAndre Jordan (who Denver can actually take time to develop with Nene and Martin already in the front-court). And they get some cap relief, I guess, but nothing that huge. But all of those are very large leaps of faith - I assume Denver would need more - i.e. Sean Williams, #21 or future picks, get a 3rd team involved, etc.</div>
Oh the savings are huge. About $4 million instantly (with the KVH contract) and more long term because the deal would probably include Swift who goes away next season (or Hassell who goes away in a 2 years).

They have Iverson who could be a free agent this summer and JR Smith they want to re-sign. Can't have Martin, Nene, Camby, Anthony, Iverson and Smith all earning massive paychecks. They also wouldn't part with Kleiza in trades this season so they therefore think he fits into there plans long term.

Marcus and the #10 pick also come in handy as cheap talent needed to round out a roster with a lot of high priced players.

I know the owner of the Nuggets has a lot of money, but I doubt he is looking to consistantly pay a high payroll <u>and</u> luxury taxes and get bounced in the 1st round every year. They are due for a shake up.
</div>

It's only luxury tax savings as long as AI, Nene, and KMart (as well as RJ in this case) are on the books, it's not like they can go after anyone. Thing is they could shop Camby around, offering him and their pick, or another for an expiring contract. Don't think some team like Dallas would jump at that? Or some team close to real contention?

-Petey
</div>
I was refering to luxury tax savings. Savings needed to re-sign JR, AI and a possible extention down the road for Kleiza. I don't think Dallas has any expiring the can offer Denver for Camby. Nothing like the KVH contract.

I would think the teams that stand a good chance of landing Melo are Miami, Chicago, Knicks, Miami and NJ. If Denver is dumb enough to move him. There are plenty of other moves they can make, but the definitely need to make some move.

 

[Netted]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kdub @ May 19 2008, 11:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>So I have to bring this up. If the Nets DO grab a top 2 pick... would you guys keep it and draft Rose/Beasley, or trade it for Carmelo (the Nuggets would likely be in favor of the trade then).</div>
Tough choice, but I think I keep it. If it was #3 I would trade it.

 

[GMJ]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kdub @ May 19 2008, 11:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>So I have to bring this up. If the Nets DO grab a top 2 pick... would you guys keep it and draft Rose/Beasley, or trade it for Carmelo (the Nuggets would likely be in favor of the trade then).</div>

That's the way I'm looking at this speculation. I'd rather have Beasley than Carmelo, but I'd want Carmelo over Mayo. Would I want Rose or Carmelo? That's a tougher decision but I think I'd have to side with including the pick to get Anthony. Why? Well I think we can afford to pass on Rose with Devin Harris on the roster. Now I'm not saying that Harris does everything that Rose can, but I think he would do a lot of what Rose does in our system, and Devin's own upside is a bit of an unknown.

So if Beasley is there, I don't trade; otherwise, bye bye RJ.

 

[infinet]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kdub @ May 19 2008, 07:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>So I have to bring this up. If the Nets DO grab a top 2 pick... would you guys keep it and draft Rose/Beasley, or trade it for Carmelo (the Nuggets would likely be in favor of the trade then).</div>

No way. Never. I wouldn't even think about it. If we had a chance at Rose, there is no one I would even think about trading him for. IF (a big IF) we got the #2 pick, I sure would wish the Grizzlies would get the #1 pick because they are about the only team in the lower half of the lottery that would take Beasley over Rose. I've said it before; I would trade Devin Harris for Derrick Rose if I could.

Oh and this Melo trade sounds like the normal stuff around this time.... beat writers for axed teams getting bored and gearing up for the off season. This trade sounds like BS.

 

[kdub]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ May 19 2008, 10:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kdub @ May 19 2008, 11:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>So I have to bring this up. If the Nets DO grab a top 2 pick... would you guys keep it and draft Rose/Beasley, or trade it for Carmelo (the Nuggets would likely be in favor of the trade then).</div>

That's the way I'm looking at this speculation. I'd rather have Beasley than Carmelo, but I'd want Carmelo over Mayo. Would I want Rose or Carmelo? That's a tougher decision but I think I'd have to side with including the pick to get Anthony. Why? Well I think we can afford to pass on Rose with Devin Harris on the roster. Now I'm not saying that Harris does everything that Rose can, but I think he would do a lot of what Rose does in our system, and Devin's own upside is a bit of an unknown.

So is Beasley is there, I don't trade; otherwise, bye bye RJ.
</div>

Based on my limited knowledge of college players like Rose, that's what I would do too. What does Rose do better than Harris? I've heard that he's fast, but he can't be faster than Harris right? I'm guessing he's a better passer than Harris? I can't imagine his defensive potential to more than Harris'. I've also heard that Rose isn't that great a shooter, but neither is Harris. Leadership... this is where Rose shines I think, but Harris hasn't been given the opportunity to be a leader under Avery... We'll see what he can be under Frank.

I'm wondering though, if it's possible, to draft Rose and then trade him to a team like LAC for Brand (seems like the Clippers are desperate for a PG as well).

 

[jirohkanzaki]

i would rather deal with the pacers...let them dump JO to us but we get danny granger...pacers get the lower 1st pick and anyone they want except devin harris and josh boone...granger can fill that sf/pf spot at a cheaper price even after his rookie contract with better defense...JO's monster contract ends in 2010...

 

[bbwSwish]

This is so ridiculous it belongs in the Lakers forum.

 

[tremaine]

By the numbers, we can see how low the Denver franchise has sunk by trying to trade C Anthony as a result of their inability to stop worshipping Mr. Karl, and as a result of Mr. Karl's inability to stop worshipping Allen Iverson. I am one of Iverson's biggest backers, but no player should ever be worshipped. And obviously no coach should ever be worshipped by a front office / ownership.

Denver is disfunctional and hurting, so it would not be shocking if they make this trade. Here is a franchise that traded for Allen Iverson and then did absolutely nothing to prevent the same exact situation that existed in Philadelphia for years and years to continue on in a new city. That is beyond dumb. Them trading Melo would be at their level of dumbness so to speak, so it could in fact happen.

NEW JERSEY NETS 2007-08 REGULAR SEASON REAL PLAYER RATINGS
(Raw ESPN player ratings / minutes)
1 Vince Carter, NJ SG 0.923
2 Devin Harris, NJ PG 0.848
3 Richard Jefferson, NJ SF 0.823
4 Sean Williams, NJ C 0.726
5 Stromile Swift, NJ C 0.707
6 Josh Boone, NJ PF 0.704
7 Bostjan Nachbar, NJ SF 0.685
8 Marcus Williams, NJ PG 0.679
9 Nenad Krstic, NJ PF 0.644
10 DeSagana Diop, NJ C 0.564
11 Darrell Armstrong, NJ PG 0.518
12 Maurice Ager, NJ SG 0.500
13 Trenton Hassell, NJ SF 0.325

DENVER NUGGETS 2007-08 REGULAR SEASON REAL PLAYER RATINGS
(Raw ESPN player ratings / minutes)
1 Carmelo Anthony, Den SF 1.091
2 Allen Iverson, Den SG 0.978
3 J.R. Smith, Den SG 0.938
4 Marcus Camby, Den C 0.914
5 Kenyon Martin, Den PF 0.777
6 Linas Kleiza, Den SF 0.762
7 Nene Hilario, Den PF 0.723
8 Anthony Carter, Den PG 0.704
9 Eduardo Najera, Den PF 0.636
10 Taurean Green, Den PG 0.636
11 Bobby Jones, Den SG 0.607
12 Steven Hunter, Den C 0.587
13 Chucky Atkins, Den PG 0.575
14 Yakhouba Diawara, Den SG 0.495

Forumula for Real Player Rating:
Points + Rebounds + 1.4*Assists + Steals + 1.4*Blocks - .7*Turnovers + # of Field Goals Made +1/2*# of 3-pointers Made - .8*# of Missed Field Goals - .8*# of Missed Free Throws + .25 *# of Free Throws Made

Anyone want to rank the 13 Nets players in made them miss defending? Rank them according to how good they are in preventing shooters from scoring if you know how they rank. Then I could show Nets and Nuggets ARPR.

DENVER NUGGETS 2007-08 REAL PLAYER RATINGS ADJUSTED FOR DEFENDING
(raw espn rating +/- made them miss defending)/minutes
1 Carmelo Anthony, Den SF 1.011
2 Marcus Camby, Den C 1.004
3 Kenyon Martin, Den PF 0.907
4 Allen Iverson, Den SG 0.898
5 J.R. Smith, Den SG 0.888
6 Nene Hilario, Den PF 0.833
7 Linas Kleiza, Den SF 0.752
8 Eduardo Najera, Den PF 0.686
9 Anthony Carter, Den PG 0.674
10 Bobby Jones, Den SG 0.657
11 Steven Hunter, Den C 0.597
12 Yakhouba Diawara, Den SG 0.545
13 Taurean Green, Den PG 0.526
14 Chucky Atkins, Den PG 0.445

 

[dino33]

Melo is a good individual defender and scorer, but I dont think he is that good of a team offensive+defensive player

 

[tremaine]

Q: Why would Denver even consider as they threaten to bust up their team hogging two of the very best shooting guards in the League, Iverson and JR Smith, but then settle for Marcus Williams at PG?
A: Because they are dumb and they are not really serious about winning in the playoffs. Not being a 24-58 team anymore is enough to keep them happy. Maybe they're just a bunch of dumb mountain hicks who don't know that if you have a poor passing but good scoring team you need an outstanding PG to win playoff games.

 

[J-HoAgZ]

I could see Denver doing this b/c Melo would become the scapegoat and its always been obvious that Iverson wants his own show. RJ has always been a #2 or #3 guy and could be a perfect fit with A.I. with him running the floor and being an explosive player who can get to the rim. Marcus is a good young PG with a future and Denver doesn't really have a quality PG of the future.

PG: Marcus
SG: AI
SF: RJ
PF: Martin
C: ? Maybe Krstic if he's included..
with JR comin off the bench isn't bad at all.
I think the Nets would still get the better of the trade depending on who else is thrown in there but I don't think it's as horrible of a trade for Denver as you guys think it is. Iverson can't play forever and the window is closing for him to get a ring.

 

[tremaine]

The other reason to take rumors of C Anthony being traded seriously is that he might finally have figured out how screwed up the Nuggets are and how it isn't going to change until there are changes in team management. But the Nuggets are too dumb or cowardly right now to make the needed changes. Remember that he called the Nuggets a quitting team during and after game 3 of the playoffs blowout by the Lakers.

So Anthony may have more or less demanded a trade, but decided to do it out of the public eye.

 

[danxcr]

we shall see... id do it in a heart beat but if our pick is top 2... id still take beasley or rose over this trade... for financial reason as well

 

[Netted]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J-HoAgZ @ May 19 2008, 01:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I could see Denver doing this b/c Melo would become the scapegoat and its always been obvious that Iverson wants his own show. RJ has always been a #2 or #3 guy and could be a perfect fit with A.I. with him running the floor and being an explosive player who can get to the rim. Marcus is a good young PG with a future and Denver doesn't really have a quality PG of the future.

PG: Marcus
SG: AI
SF: RJ
PF: Martin
C: ? Maybe Krstic if he's included..
with JR comin off the bench isn't bad at all.
I think the Nets would still get the better of the trade depending on who else is thrown in there but I don't think it's as horrible of a trade for Denver as you guys think it is. Iverson can't play forever and the window is closing for him to get a ring.</div>
More like:

PG: AI
SG: Smith
SF: RJ
PF: Martin
C: Nene

Bench: Kleiza, Marcus, #10 pick (DeAndre?), re-signed Nejera, use MLE on a player like Pietrus?

 

[tremaine]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ May 19 2008, 12:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J-HoAgZ @ May 19 2008, 01:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'></div>
More like:

PG: AI
SG: Smith
SF: RJ
PF: Martin
C: Nene

Bench: Kleiza, Marcus, #10 pick (DeAndre?), re-signed Nejera, use MLE on a player like Pietrus?
</div>

Your Denver backcourt lineup is not going to happen anytime soon. AI will never be the designated PG in Denver while Karl is there worshipping him in his historical 2-guard role. And even if Karl were to be fired, which is just a pipe dream, the next coach might refuse to do it as well, regardless of how much that kills the playoff prospects of the team.

 

[Dumpy]

what if the extra parts include sean williams and/or boone? wold that change anyone's view of the deal?

 

[Dark Defender]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dumpy @ May 19 2008, 01:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>what if the extra parts include sean williams and/or boone? wold that change anyone's view of the deal?</div>

No.

It's Carmelo were talking about, a true piece you can build around.

 

[ly_yng]

First of all, this is WAY less than I thought we'd have to give up to get Melo. So if it happens, DAMN. That's not bad.

With that said, if Thorn makes this deal, sits back and calls it an offseason, I'm going to be pissed. I like Harris, Carter and Melo, but we'll have the same problems we've had the past few seasons - a team with no identity with too many players who need the ball in their hands to be effective.

L. Frank requires one thing from the players on his roster - a cerebral mind that can handle his complex offensive and defensive schemes. Anyone think Melo is excited for that?

Does the trade make the team better? Yes. But I still think we'd be pretty mediocre after it - it would just be an upgrade of our assets, a stepping stone to whatever the NEXT move is.