Imagine you are George Zimmerman

[Natebishop3]

"As mixed as the accounts of the Feb. 26 shooting are, so are bits and pieces of George Zimmerman’s background have trickled out, painting a picture of a well behaved kid turned into a man who has aspirations of being a cop with a thread of 911 calls to his name.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...s-defense-son-article-1.1049933#ixzz1q4UIgkL3"

There you go. A wannabe cop who was carrying when he shouldn't be. I know the type. I've been around the type. The guy should go to jail.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

him carrying his weapon was against the law?

....

 

[Masbee]

I am going to have to stick with the facts as I know them.

1) If the police thought they had a case aginst the guy, they would have charged him.

Yeah, maybe.

Information now out seems to point pretty clearly to a whitewash investigation.

Witnesses claim they had trouble getting the attention of the police department in order to give statements.

Witnesses who were interviewed by the police, claim that they were coached, or witnessed coaching by the police.

Witnesses claim that the police interviewers used leading questions, cut off testimony to "correct" answers and other investigation errors.

A witness who heard the cries for help, said the heard, but didn't see and thus couldn't be sure who of the two was screaming for help, but was pretty sure it was Trayvon. The police claimed he said it was Zimmerman.

The investigation was so obviously botched that the Chief of Police has stepped down.

This case should have been sent to the Grand Jury based on what we all know:

An unarmed person was shot dead.

At no time did the shooter have any reason to believe a crime was being committed by the victim.

The shooter followed and approached the victim.

Though the shooter claims self-defense, there are witnesses, physical evidence, phone records and recorded phone calls that all can be used to corroborate or discredit the shooters claims.

Thus, the police are required to perform an investigation, provide to the D.A., who should have sent to a Grand Jury for a possible indictment.

It is not for the police to decide. This scandal wouldn't be such a huge deal if a reasonable investigation had been performed, sent to a Grand Jury and they had decided not to indict.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Zimmerman purportedly had a broken nose. That is not "beat up".

Witnesses said cries of help, then "no, no", then gunshot.

How is that "reactionary"?

How is it that Zimmerman was able to pull out his gun and shoot an unarmed person, yet was unable run away from the situation?

If Zimmerman was able to pull out his gun, why did he shoot it, instead of using as a club and pistol-whipping the victim?

Having blood on your face and a broken nose isn't getting beat up?


because if treyvon took zimmermans gun if he used in that way, zimmerman could have been shot

....

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

and as far as the broken nose/grass stains/etc...those are easily obtained by tackling someone from behind at a full run, just sayin'

When I tackle someone, I just spontaneously combust.

....

 

[Natebishop3]

him carrying his weapon was against the law?

....

You are allowed to carry a weapon for self defense. In this case, it was not self defense. It's not his job to fight crime. He's not a cop and he was told to stay in his car. If you are the aggressor, you are not allowed to use a firearm. They dedicated an entire chapter to this in the Oregon DPSST armed security class. It's called escalation of force. The guy was not defending his home and the kid was not armed. Pretty clear case to me.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

When I tackle someone, I just spontaneously combust.

....

not sure i follow, are you saying its unreasonable to suggest a person could get injured tackling someone? or in the scuffle that would follow?

if some weirdo was following me, then running after me, then tackled me, id probably fight back a little

maybe someone would just take it like a submissive fetishist, and beg for more, whos to say, not likely though

 

[Natebishop3]

Having blood on your face and a broken nose isn't getting beat up?


because if treyvon took zimmermans gun if he used in that way, zimmerman could have been shot

....

So let's put you in the shoes of the 17 year old kid for a second. You are walking home, alone, and you notice a big hispanic looking guy following you. At this point we don't know what exactly happened, but do you think he jumps the guy? Attacks him? Especially if he has a gun? Let's say he confronts you? Would you defend yourself? Punch him in the nose? The guy isn't a cop. He's not wearing a uniform. For all he knows, this guy is trying to rob him or rape him. Seriously, think for a second. This isn't a case of the kid stalking him and Zimmerman defending himself.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

You are allowed to carry a weapon for self defense. In this case, it was not self defense. It's not his job to fight crime. He's not a cop and he was told to stay in his car. If you are the aggressor, you are not allowed to use a firearm. They dedicated an entire chapter to this in the Oregon DPSST armed security class. It's called escalation of force. The guy was not defending his home and the kid was not armed. Pretty clear case to me.

He was allowed to carry the weapon.

According to him, he was attacked and felt he had to defend himself with his firearm, which he did.

He wasn't carrying his gun for self-defense. It just happened to be how he used it. Getting out of his car is not an act of agression or assault. Not is it a use of force of any kind.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

not sure i follow, are you saying its unreasonable to suggest a person could get injured tackling someone? or in the scuffle that would follow?

if some weirdo was following me, then running after me, then tackled me, id probably fight back a little

maybe someone would just take it like a submissive fetishist, and beg for more, whos to say, not likely though

It depends on the nature of his injuries. The police came to the conclusion that he acted in self defense, meaning they had evidence he was under assault and used deadly force to stop this assault. And where do you get that Zimmerman tackled anyone?

 

[Masbee]

Having blood on your face and a broken nose isn't getting beat up?


because if treyvon took zimmermans gun if he used in that way, zimmerman could have been shot

....

A bloody nose is evidence of possibly being beat up. It is not in any way proof. Many people can get a bloody nose without getting "beat up". One relatively light shot to the right spot is all it takes.

Did Zimmerman have any broken bones? Deep bruises? Lacerations? Concussion? Significant swelling?

As far as taking the gun, Trayvon didn't bring the gun to the altercation. He is not responsible for it. Zimmerman is. Zimmerman "could have been shot" only because he brought the gun to the incident. If he didn't want to "get shot", and he didn't know how to handle himself in a scuffle or subdue a suspect:

the dumb fuck should have listened to the 911 operator and stayed away.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

So let's put you in the shoes of the 17 year old kid for a second. You are walking home, alone, and you notice a big hispanic looking guy following you. At this point we don't know what exactly happened, but do you think he jumps the guy? Attacks him? Especially if he has a gun? Let's say he confronts you? Would you defend yourself? Punch him in the nose? The guy isn't a cop. He's not wearing a uniform. For all he knows, this guy is trying to rob him or rape him. Seriously, think for a second. This isn't a case of the kid stalking him and Zimmerman defending himself.

We don't know who initiated the actual assault. Perhaps Zimmerman did not draw his weapon until he was already being assaulted, which is where the reported screams came from.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

A bloody nose is evidence of possibly being beat up. It is not in any way proof. Many people can get a bloody nose without getting "beat up". One relatively light shot to the right spot is all it takes.

Did Zimmerman have any broken bones? Deep bruises? Lacerations? Concussion? Significant swelling?

As far as taking the gun, Trayvon didn't bring the gun to the altercation. He is not responsible for it. Zimmerman is. Zimmerman "could have been shot" only because he brought the gun to the incident. If he didn't want to "get shot", and he didn't know how to handle himself in a scuffle or subdue a suspect:

the dumb fuck should have listened to the 911 operator and stayed away.

Well, Zimmerman provided them a statement, which seemed sufficient for the police to conclude he used it in self defense. Logic would state that he was attacked, otherwise he could not claim self defense.

 

[Masbee]

It depends on the nature of his injuries. The police came to the conclusion that he acted in self defense, meaning they had evidence he was under assault and used deadly force to stop this assault.

WRONG!

Police said they had no information to contradict what Zimmerman told them. (which was a lie by the police).

Far, far different from saying they concluded he acted in self-defense.

And I have already laid out that the investigation was a whitewash. So fucked up and indefensible the Chief is gone. You watch, that Police department will be turned inside-out. They fucked up big-time.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Well, except that there is a witness that said Martin attacked Zimmerman.

http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/dpp/news/state/witness-martin-attacked-zimmerman-03232012

 

[Masbee]

We don't know who initiated the actual assault. Perhaps Zimmerman did not draw his weapon until he was already being assaulted, which is where the reported screams came from.

Well, Trayvon's parents have heard the 911 tape and said it is their son screaming for help. Zimmerman said it is him.

Questions of fact and dispute are not to be settled by the police. Whitewash.

As far as initiation, we already have established that Zimmerman was angry and confrontational by the 911 tape:

Zimmerman: These assholes. They always get away.

911: Are you following him?

Zimmerman: Yes.

911: We don't need you to do that.

 

[Masbee]

Well, Zimmerman provided them a statement, which seemed sufficient for the police to conclude he used it in self defense. Logic would state that he was attacked, otherwise he could not claim self defense.

No, logic would not state that.

He had some minor injuries (did not go to hospital or doctor).

These could have been self inflicted. These could have been the result of an attack by Trayvan. These could have been the result of a scuffle initiated by Zimmerman.

There is no fucking way the police could have known which one it was.

 

[Masbee]

Well, except that there is a witness that said Martin attacked Zimmerman.

http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/dpp/news/state/witness-martin-attacked-zimmerman-03232012

And another witness who claims the opposite:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/17/u...in-florida-teenagers-shooting-death.html?_r=1

That is what Grand Juries are for, to sort this stuff all out.

NOT what the police are supposed to do. Not their job.

 

[Masbee]

I am wondering why the Keystone Cops in Florida weren't curious as to why this big guy was so easily dropped by a skinny teenager, who had Zimmerman quaking in his boots, fearing for his life?

After reading these news stories, I call bullshit on Zimmerman.

I think he is one of those dipshit, wannabes, who dreams of shooting "bad guys", and thinks he is tough shit.

I think he aggressively approach Trayvan and scared him.

Then something happened - don't know what - Trayvan fought back - in the scuffle Zimmerman hit the ground and hit his head and Trayvan got a shot to the nose, then, Zimmerman being much heavier, regained his composure and physical control.

Trayvan cried for help, begged not to be shot when he saw the gun and Zimmerman shot and killed him out of anger.

Just a wild guess, but one that is just as plausible and supported by the evidence as the "I feared for my life" baloney that the police used to bury a proper and legal investigation.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Well, Trayvon's parents have heard the 911 tape and said it is their son screaming for help. Zimmerman said it is him.

Questions of fact and dispute are not to be settled by the police. Whitewash.

As far as initiation, we already have established that Zimmerman was angry and confrontational by the 911 tape:

Zimmerman: These assholes. They always get away.

911: Are you following him?

Zimmerman: Yes.

911: We don't need you to do that.

That is not initiation of the assault.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I am wondering why the Keystone Cops in Florida weren't curious as to why this big guy was so easily dropped by a skinny teenager, who had Zimmerman quaking in his boots?

He was 6'3". That's a pretty big guy, even if he was only 160lbs. Zimmerman doesn't exactly look like an athlete.

 

[Natebishop3]

Let me put it to you this way, he had no business being in the situation in the first place. The kid wasn't robbing a bank, he wasn't raping a woman, he wasn't breaking into a car.... he was walking home. Zimmerman had no reason whatsoever to follow him. He had no reason whatsoever to confront him. He had no reason whatsoever to put himself into that situation, therefor the shooting was unjustifiable as self defense. You can legally shoot someone if they break into your house because Oregon is a castle state, but you still have to show that you feared for your life. This guy wasn't in his home. He didn't have to follow the kid. The entire thing was his doing, therefor he deserved an ass whooping if that's in fact what was happening.

If you shove me, and I shove you back, that doesn't mean you can shoot me.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

If I follow you and you jump on me and start raping me, I can shoot you off. :MARIS61:

 

[3RA1N1AC]

when in doubt, blame the dead guy. he cant really tell his side of the story at this point

 

[Natebishop3]

If I follow you and you jump on me and start raping me, I can shoot you off. :MARIS61:

So I am to believe that a 17 year old kid, who is alone, is going to turn around a jump a 28 year old man that's following him? Sounds awfully fishy to me.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

just blame the dead guy people, duh

 

[Natebishop3]

just blame the dead black guy people, duh

FIFY

 

[3RA1N1AC]

ooh imagine how much nobody would care if they both were black, mindfuck

or what if the kid killed the hispanic weirdo, hed be in jail for sure

or maybe what if just maybe zimmerman shot his own cock off and slowly bled to death while he cried and shit himself, and the kid put a poisonous jellyfish on his grave every year, that would be soooo strange

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Black Panthers put a $10,000 bounty on Zimmerman.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

panthers have no concept of money silly, regardless of their fur color