Irving/Lillard comparison

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I went to the Cleveland/Portland game here last year... that was really fun to watch both of them go. Irving got the game winning bucket on Lillard, but it was still a great game (and anytime you can get ten rows from the court for $60 on stubhub... that's a win too).

I am really looking forward to tomorrow's matchup. Kyrie is one of my favorites to watch outside of the Blazers.
 
Floor General vs ISO guy.

Irving: 20.9 PPG 3.1 RPG 1.09 SPG 5.8 APG 3.1 TPG PER 18.2
Lillard: 20.1 PPG 3.5 RPG 0.76 SPG 5.7 APG 2.2 TPG PER 19.2


Irving: 18.7 FGA .411 FG% .325 3P% 4.9 FTA .80 FT%
Lillard: 15.5 FGA .394 FG% .405 3P% 5.6 FTA .92 FT%

I think they are both talented. I would take Lillard to lead my team though. It could be a team talent issue where Irving has to create more and shoot more, which I think he is perhaps more skilled than Dame at doing. But I would still prefer Dame over Irving to build a team around.
 
dame has the clutch x factor i wouldnt trade for any stat. he doesnt know how to lose.
 
Irving has having a subpar season compared to last year.
 
Both are having down years (as much as a 2nd year and a 3rd year player can) in shooting %'s (overall). But both are exciting PG's in this league and should have long productive years.

Both, so far, have been super consistent in their games too.

In a somewhat related note, I like how Lillards minutes are under 36 now.
 
Does anyone know how to figure out Damians PER if he was shooting at least a somewhat respectable 43% from the floor (if 3 point % didn't change)?
 
A year and a half for an athlete is a huge difference, considering a good to great players career is usually over in 13 years or so
 
FTA: He's hitting close in shots at a .222 level. That is utterly pathetic. That's Damon Stoudamire-pathetic.

If Damian ever figured out how to finish around the rim and in the paint at a Tony Parker level, he'd be the best PG in the league. If he were even just mediocre at it he'd be a notch below Chris Paul. As it is teams are learning to let him drive into the paint all he wants, but do anything they can to prevent the mid- or long-range jumper.
 
mook said:
FTA: He's hitting close in shots at a .222 level. That is utterly pathetic. That's Damon Stoudamire-pathetic.

If Damian ever figured out how to finish around the rim and in the paint at a Tony Parker level, he'd be the best PG in the league. If he were even just mediocre at it he'd be a notch below Chris Paul. As it is teams are learning to let him drive into the paint all he wants, but do anything they can to prevent the mid- or long-range jumper.
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Or at least until he starts getting the whistles
 
mook said:
FTA: He's hitting close in shots at a .222 level. That is utterly pathetic. That's Damon Stoudamire-pathetic.

If Damian ever figured out how to finish around the rim and in the paint at a Tony Parker level, he'd be the best PG in the league. If he were even just mediocre at it he'd be a notch below Chris Paul. As it is teams are learning to let him drive into the paint all he wants, but do anything they can to prevent the mid- or long-range jumper.
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We have all said it many times, one word - floater. I have ZERO doubt in mind that Lillard has the skill and will to prefect it and not just talk about it.
 
Mediocre Man said:
A year and a half for an athlete is a huge difference, considering a good to great players career is usually over in 13 years or so
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Another factor that takes a toll over a career are injuries. Irving has had 7 separate injuries in 2 years that have caused him to miss games. And that does not include his injury in college. Some say he is injury prone. I would not go that far, but it is worth watching.
 
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So, we have one of the best young point guards in the league, each won rookie of the year, but it's not entirely clear as to which one is better? As a fan, I think I can live with that.
 
mook said:
FTA: He's hitting close in shots at a .222 level. That is utterly pathetic. That's Damon Stoudamire-pathetic.

If Damian ever figured out how to finish around the rim and in the paint at a Tony Parker level, he'd be the best PG in the league. If he were even just mediocre at it he'd be a notch below Chris Paul. As it is teams are learning to let him drive into the paint all he wants, but do anything they can to prevent the mid- or long-range jumper.
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Where did you find that stat? I was looking at NBA.com: less than 5ft, restricted area, paint outside restricted area, driving lay up, layup shot... etc. I don't see anything at 20% except for in the paint non-restricted, which he is shooting 25.6%, and Westbrick is shooting 24% from the same area.

Dame is 40% in the restricted area. Granted, that is still pretty darn low, and he has to learn to get better at it. It's something he wants to get better at and I am going to take his word for it.

On the other hand, he does other things much better than his peers, assist to turnover ratio being one of those. Neither Westbrook or Irving are over 1.9 whereas Dame is over 2.6. And Westbrick is shooting 10% worse from behind the arc. This isn't to say Dame doesn't need to find a way to finish at the rim, but just think how long we've been talking about Wes' inability to finish at the rim. He's kinda killing it this season. Dame will get better.

As far as learning to let him drive? That would require you let up on defense, which would only help his shooting percentage, if not allow him more space to find the open outlet. So, I can't say I'm worried about teams "letting him" drive.
 
mook said:
FTA: He's hitting close in shots at a .222 level. That is utterly pathetic. That's Damon Stoudamire-pathetic.

If Damian ever figured out how to finish around the rim and in the paint at a Tony Parker level, he'd be the best PG in the league. If he were even just mediocre at it he'd be a notch below Chris Paul. As it is teams are learning to let him drive into the paint all he wants, but do anything they can to prevent the mid- or long-range jumper.
Click to expand...

The funny part is that in ISO situations at the end of each half......his percentage in the paint is excellent.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
The funny part is that in ISO situations at the end of each half......his percentage in the paint is excellent.
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Practice makes perfect. I think people harping on him like this is his 5th year in the NBA and he hasn't figured it out is a good probably not a bad thing.
 
Blazer Fanatic said:
Where did you find that stat? I was looking at NBA.com: less than 5ft, restricted area, paint outside restricted area, driving lay up, layup shot... etc. I don't see anything at 20% except for in the paint non-restricted, which he is shooting 25.6%, and Westbrick is shooting 24% from the same area.
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See the column "Close Shots" here, which was referenced in the original article. When it was written Damian was at 20%. It's apparently fallen now to 11.1%. He only takes .2 of these shots per game, according to that site, so maybe it's not the end of the world. I think most of the time he takes those shots he draws contact and he misses but gets to the foul line so it may not count against him.

Some guys like Tony Parker and Zach Randolph have a gift for getting in crazy little angle shots under the hoop no matter how congested it seems to get. Lillard clearly does not have that gift.

This isn't really a floater issue for him, since the definition on the site of a "close shot" is a shot taken within 12 feet of the basket excluding drives. They are the tricky nifty little shots and the lobs that guys make when a teammate finds them near the rim. It's not the most critical thing in the world for a point guard to master, but it speaks to his lack of touch around the rim.
 
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mook said:
See the column "Close Shots" here, which was referenced in the original article. When it was written Damian was at 20%. It's apparently fallen now to 11.1%. He only takes .2 of these shots per game, according to that site, so maybe it's not the end of the world. I think most of the time he takes those shots he draws contact and he misses but gets to the foul line so it may not count against him.

Some guys like Tony Parker and Zach Randolph have a gift for getting in crazy little angle shots under the hoop no matter how congested it seems to get. Lillard clearly does not have that gift.

Hopefully he keeps working on that floater....it's really his best chance at improving in that area.
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If you look at that close shots per game, it doesn't include drives to the basket.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Another factor that takes a toll over a career are injuries. Irving has had 7 separate injuries in 2 years that have caused him to miss games. And that does not include his injury in college. Some say he is injury prone. I would not go that far, but it is worth watching.
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Ya, kid can't seem to stay healthy
 
Pinwheel1 said:
The funny part is that in ISO situations at the end of each half......his percentage in the paint is excellent.
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Yeah, I think it's because he's got the ball at the top of the key and is dribbling into the paint. He can survey the floor and the clock and the spacing and time things perfectly. He's not worried about his "roll" man on the pick and roll--he's just got to think through exactly how to get his own shot with less than a second or two left. That clarity of focus and the heightened tension of competition seems to play to his strengths.
 
RR7 said:
If you look at that close shots per game, it doesn't include drives to the basket.
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Yeah, I reworded my post after thinking through my point. It's a very valid point you're making.
 
True hoop TV talking Lillard. Front Page on ESPN, sophomore rankings for the month: Lillard #1.

Lillard gets flack for not being an MVP finisher at the rim, and not being the biggest, strongest, most athletic PG in the NBA, but Thorp had a nice take on his "mini-step-back 3."

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:10153025
 
Blazer Fanatic said:
True hoop TV talking Lillard. Front Page on ESPN, sophomore rankings for the month: Lillard #1.

Lillard gets flack for not being an MVP finisher at the rim, and not being the biggest, strongest, most athletic PG in the NBA, but Thorp had a nice take on his "mini-step-back 3."

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:10153025
Click to expand...

MVP finisher at the rim? C'mon man, the guy is dreadful at it right now
 
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