Is Howard a better back-up than Outlaw?

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magnifier661

magnifier661

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Personally, his veteran leadership is needed on the court. I feel way more comfortable bringing in someone that has been playing for a while, than Outlaw, IMO. Who knows. I don't even know if Howard has that much gas in him to put up 10 minutes a game at PF.
 
Oops, this may be a overlap from another thread. Sorry for a double thread on basically the same topic. Wrote this before I read the entire Outlaw thread.
 
magnifier661 said:
Personally, his veteran leadership is needed on the court. I feel way more comfortable bringing in someone that has been playing for a while, than Outlaw, IMO. Who knows. I don't even know if Howard has that much gas in him to put up 10 minutes a game at PF.
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With Aldridge playing about 35-38 minutes a night.. we might not need a backup PF to put up more than 10 minutes a night. And Oden will be getting more minutes this year as well.
 
Yes. I think he is. He is a legit four. Travis has no business being there unless its small lineup versus small lineup.
 
Wheels said:
With Aldridge playing about 35-38 minutes a night.. we might not need a backup PF to put up more than 10 minutes a night. And Oden will be getting more minutes this year as well.
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I was a little curious of that "Twin Tower" line-up Nate used last season. I kinda liked it, especially if you have a nice lead and you want to shut a team's "points in the paint" down.
 
I really liked what I saw from Howard last night. Outlaw's big contribution at PF is shooting jump shots. If we have others to do that (Rudy, Martell), then yes I'd much rather have Howard backing up LaMarcus. I think he was a great pickup. Sure his athleticism is way down from his younger days, but he's very smart and very capable. He sees the floor, makes the right play, makes the right pass, and brings veteran savvy and leadership. I have a feeling he's going to help Greg a lot.
 
Yes. It's not even close. Better defender, better passer, doesn't stall the offense.
 
it depends...

if we wanna win... yes

if we wanna lose... no
 
going into this past summer... i wanted 3 players gone to improve this team

sergio...check.

frye...check.

outlaw...sadly still lost
 
Mediocre Man said:
Yes. It's not even close. Better defender, better passer, doesn't stall the offense.
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Yep what MM said. Plus Howard has a basketball IQ. You can see he is doing Oden a hell of a lot of good while he is out there. I have already seen plenty of times this pre season where he got Oden to repost and got him the ball deep for an easy bucket.
 
BBert said:
I really liked what I saw from Howard last night. Outlaw's big contribution at PF is shooting jump shots. If we have others to do that (Rudy, Martell), then yes I'd much rather have Howard backing up LaMarcus. I think he was a great pickup. Sure his athleticism is way down from his younger days, but he's very smart and very capable. He sees the floor, makes the right play, makes the right pass, and brings veteran savvy and leadership. I have a feeling he's going to help Greg a lot.
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I agree. I really liked what I saw from Juwan too. He is the perfect player that we needed. We really, really need to move Outlaw.
 
magnifier661 said:
Personally, his veteran leadership is needed on the court. I feel way more comfortable bringing in someone that has been playing for a while, than Outlaw, IMO. Who knows. I don't even know if Howard has that much gas in him to put up 10 minutes a game at PF.
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Travis isn't a veteran yet?

J/K, I agree that JH is a better backup PF than Travis. Travis gets thrown around like a rag doll when he tries to defend PF's on the low block.
 
oldguy said:
Travis isn't a veteran yet?

J/K, I agree that JH is a better backup PF than Travis. Travis gets thrown around like a rag doll when he tries to defend PF's on the low block.
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It took Travis 5 seasons to get to the below average level most players make in this league by their 2nd or 3rd year. By applying dog year math rules, that means he has to be in the league 11 years before he is a veteran. :tsktsk:
 
oldguy said:
Travis isn't a veteran yet?

J/K, I agree that JH is a better backup PF than Travis. Travis gets thrown around like a rag doll when he tries to defend PF's on the low block.
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Well I look at it this way. Regardless if Miller starts or comes off the bench, we still have capable scoring in Fernandez, Webster and Blake (If Miller is starting). Also, I doubt Nate doesn't have at least 1 Starter on the floor the entire game.

I just think having Outlaw in ruins our offensive flow and defensive ability. I don't see how Outlaw would accept not being on the floor in the 4th Quarter as well. It was kinda his "staple" the previous 2 seasons.
 
Why doesn't anyone ask whether Howard (or any cheap former starter) is almost as effective as the overpaid Aldridge? Pritchard's bake philosophy has filled the team with perpetual infants whose only coach on their resumes is McMillan. Having been coached by several NBA coaches makes a player so much more versatile.
 
I would rather use Howard at the 4, then Travis. I think Travis could be used to consolidate some positions for us.

I like Travis, but I just think we have too many players like him w/more upside.
 
Since KP hates power forwards, I doubt that Howard is really a power-forward at all, otherwise KP would not sign him. He is probably just a really tall point-guard, as shown by his ability to feed the beast (I mean, the post). As we know - KP "inherited" Outlaw - so his qualifications as a PF are clearly superior.

There, asked, answered, and tied a pretty ribbon around it.
 
To answer your question...YES. Much, MUCH better.
 
hasoos said:
Yep what MM said. Plus Howard has a basketball IQ. You can see he is doing Oden a hell of a lot of good while he is out there. I have already seen plenty of times this pre season where he got Oden to repost and got him the ball deep for an easy bucket.
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I will third this thought.
 
jlprk said:
Why doesn't anyone ask whether Howard (or any cheap former starter) is almost as effective as the overpaid Aldridge?
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Because people will point and laugh at me?
 
Is this a trick question? HOWARD I had always liked Travis, but he's no Juan Howard. I think it is time for him to go. Good kid, but.................................:deadhorse:
He may fit in better elsewhere.
 
nope

Outlaw is 25 this year and is coming off a season with a 15.1 PER... by my recollection he has pretty much always sucked in the preseason

Howard is 36 this year coming off a season with a 10.9 PER. It was 6 seasons ago when he last had a PER over 15

I wouldn't hang my hat on the results/play of meaningless games

STOMP
 
yes, trade Outlaw to a team that needs a pure shooter. Play Howard on the big nights and Dante/Pendergraph on the low nights.
 
STOMP said:
nope

Outlaw is 25 this year and is coming off a season with a 15.1 PER... by my recollection he has pretty much always sucked in the preseason

Howard is 36 this year coming off a season with a 10.9 PER. It was 6 seasons ago when he last had a PER over 15

I wouldn't hang my hat on the results/play of meaningless games

STOMP
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Totally. I am not the world's biggest Outlaw admirer--and I don't think he's a very effective PF, but c'mon.

Howard is old and hasn't been any good in several years. I have zero confidence that he will be able to contribute meaningfully this year and I certainly don't want him to play more than, say, Frye did last year.

Ed O.
 
Howard hardly played any games for the last 2 seasons. You think that's because he's a bad player? It's because he was injured. Now he's not injured and HE'S BACK. Look out Aldridge!! Your ass is grass!!
 
STOMP said:
nope

Outlaw is 25 this year and is coming off a season with a 15.1 PER... by my recollection he has pretty much always sucked in the preseason

Howard is 36 this year coming off a season with a 10.9 PER. It was 6 seasons ago when he last had a PER over 15

I wouldn't hang my hat on the results/play of meaningless games

STOMP
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Bingo.

Howard's primary value is in what he can teach his younger team-mates. He has smarts and experience - but his play the last couple of seasons indicates there is no tread left on the tires.

The one time I would want him on the floor, is if LMA is out and the team is trying to protect a lead. Since Nate seems to prefer playing from behind - how often will that happen? :devilwink:
 
Better player? Outlaw is certainly a bigger headache for an opposing coach to gameplan for. A more savvy basketball player? Yeah, Howard's probably got the leg up on Travis in being able to do the little things and to recognize how to make other players on his own team better.

All in all I think Outlaw is the better talent, but for 10 minutes a night I think I'd be cautiously optimistic that Howard could do more without having to be in rhythm to be productive on the basketball court.

At this point I'd swap either as a regular rotation 4 for a guy like Milsap, Turiaf, Bass, Maxiell, etc.
 
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