Politics Is there cheating in elections?

[MickZagger]

Democrats cried wolf the entire four years of Trumps presidency with their debunked Russiagate shit, constantly calling the election “illegitimate”. Only to turn around and sing hymns and praises of the sanctity of our holy election process when Trump questioned 2020. The hypocrisy is staggering. Don’t act like it’s one sided.

It’s one thing to bitch. It’s another thing to storm the capitol.

 

[jonnyboy]

It’s one thing to bitch. It’s another thing to meander the capitol.

 

[THE HCP]

@SlyPokerDog I always hated that this forum allows people to change what people have posted when you quote them. Imagine what could be done with the ability to do this?

 

[SlyPokerDog]

@SlyPokerDog I have always had a serious man crush on you.

I love you too, fams.

 

[barfo]

@SlyPokerDogPlease change my username from The HCP to The STD

 

[SlyPokerDog]

California Landlord Fired After Bragging on Reddit About Stealing Tenants' Ballots, Using Them to Vote for Trump

 

[MickZagger]

California Landlord Fired After Bragging on Reddit About Stealing Tenants' Ballots, Using Them to Vote for Trump

He was going to turn California red.

 

[beast blazer]

Why is it always the Democrats who oppose voter ID? In California, they went even further and made it ILLEGAL. Then the democrats sue to keep illegal voters ON the rolls.

 

[jonnyboy]

@SlyPokerDog I always hated that this forum allows people to change what people have posted when you quote them. Imagine what could be done with the ability to do this or how many men i would kiss?

 

[Phatguysrule]

Why is it always the Democrats who oppose voter ID? In California, they went even further and made it ILLEGAL. Then the democrats sue to keep illegal voters ON the rolls.

We already have official state ID. We don't need a different ID for every function. That would be incredibly inefficient. I am also opposed to a special ID for use as a concealed carry. That should just be a code on your driver's license or state ID as well.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Imagine how many men i could kiss?

Do we have to?

 

[Phatguysrule]

I would eat a shit sandwich if it meant that a Democrat had to smell my breath

Good point

 

[jonnyboy]

We already have official state ID. We don't need a different ID for every function. That would be incredibly inefficient. I am also opposed to a special ID for use as a concealed carry. That should just be a code on your driver's license or state ID as well.

I don’t think he’s referring to a separate form of ID. Most people are simply suggesting that some form of ID be presented to vote.

 

[Phatguysrule]

I don’t think he’s referring to a separate form of ID. Most people are simply suggesting that some form of ID be presented to vote.

How are people without ID getting ballots?

*Edit* Also, as I understand it, a signature is a legal form of identification for documentation.

Ballots aren't counted if the signature doesn't match.

*Edit 2*
According to federal law, first-time voters must show identification when they vote on Election Day if:

• They did not register in person, and
• They did not show ID when they registered

The fact that the signature must match, and that valid ID must be shown at some point means that having to show your ID more would just be a waste of time and resources. If somebody votes too many times their extra votes will not count. If somebody doesn't have the same signature the vote will not count.

If they are not registered or eligible to vote in that election then their vote will not count and they may be prosecuted.

 

[BlazerWookee]

It’s one thing to bitch. It’s another thing to storm the capitol.

And another to raise money to bail out people who fence off several blocks of a major city, storm and burn federal buildings, loot every store in sight, threaten to kill police, assault and attempt to murder police and civilians, all in the name of "anti-fascism."

 

[BlazerWookee]

It’s funny that the one who cries wolf is the party most guilty of it.

It happens small scale on both sides for sure.

If it was up to the MAGA people the only ones who could vote would be white males of European ancestry.

So, racism is okay if it's against white males of European ancestry?

 

[MickZagger]

So, racism is okay if it's against white males of European ancestry?

Nice straw man.

Are you going to storm the capitol when your wannabe dictator loses again?

 

[Chris Craig]

So, racism is okay if it's against white males of European ancestry?

He never said racism was ok. He in fact is saying the opposite.

MAGA, prominently white men would have it go back to only white men voting if they had the power to do so. I have seen tweets about repealing the 19th amendment allowing women to vote. They are already trying to take away women's rights.

They are against anyone who looks foreign. There are videos all the time of far right people telling them to go back to their own country, even when they were born here.

A portion of MAGA is neo Nazis like it or not. They are against people of color and Jewish people.

We hear Trump espouse all of this all of the time in his speeches. We hear the people he invites to speak at his events say these things.

And, Mick and I are both saying this as white men, because that is some fucked up shit and we will be damned if we stay quiet about it.

 

[Haakzilla]

Democrats cried wolf the entire four years of Trumps presidency with their debunked Russiagate shit, constantly calling the election “illegitimate”. Only to turn around and sing hymns and praises of the sanctity of our holy election process when Trump questioned 2020. The hypocrisy is staggering. Don’t act like it’s one sided.

Hypocrisy you say? There is mountains of evidence regarding Russia's influence in 2016, 2020, and now in 2024. Start here >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_2016_United_States_elections

You hang your hat on this "debunked" aspect of Russiagate being that they didn't indict for collusion -- but that does not absolve Russia from the hacking, never-ending conspiracy influence and nonstop efforts to spew propaganda thru the West. Some would even argue that nearly all of the talking points & "facts" you love to wax poetic about are actually directly propagated by the Kremlin -- none of which are based in reality it seems. And all of which are harmful to America(ns)...is this what they call the Faux Patriot nowadays?

Trump did a lot more than simply question the results of the election -- at every single turn it was proven over and over that all claims were and still are baseless. Both of you have refused to accept this. Instead, we have delusions of grandeur and illegitimate concerns about free and fair elections. All of this is detrimental to democracy. You know, like coming up with and executing fake elector schemes to maintain power?

There is only one side here -- the right side of history!!

 

[Chris Craig]

Hypocrisy you say? There is mountains of evidence regarding Russia's influence in 2016, 2020, and now in 2024. Start here >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_2016_United_States_elections

You hang your hat on this "debunked" aspect of Russiagate being that they didn't indict for collusion -- but that does not absolve Russia from the hacking, never-ending conspiracy influence and nonstop efforts to spew propaganda thru the West. Some would even argue that nearly all of the talking points & "facts" you love to wax poetic about are actually directly propagated by the Kremlin -- none of which are based in reality it seems. And all of which are harmful to America(ns)...is this what they call the Faux Patriot nowadays?

Trump did a lot more than simply question the results of the election -- at every single turn it was proven over and over that all claim were and still are baseless. Both of you have refused to accept this. Instead, we have delusions of grandeur and illegitimate concerns about free and fair elections. All of this is detrimental to democracy. You know, like coming up with and executing fake elector schemes to maintain power?

There is only one side here -- the right side of history!!

And Putin and his cronies were laughing their asses off that enough people fell for Trump's con and actually elected him.

Putin probably can't believe Trump is hanging around and is a nominee yet again. His greatest enemy, the USA is continuously shitting on itself.

And, yes he helped that along by having his people hijack social media. His meddling had enough influence to get Trump elected. Trump couldn't even believe it at first. He was never expecting to win.

 

[BlazerWookee]

He never said racism was ok. He in fact is saying the opposite.

MAGA, prominently white men would have it go back to only white men voting if they had the power to do so. I have seen tweets about repealing the 19th amendment allowing women to vote. They are already trying to take away women's rights.

They are against anyone who looks foreign. There are videos all the time of far right people telling them to go back to their own country, even when they were born here.

A portion of MAGA is neo Nazis like it or not. They are against people of color and Jewish people.

We hear Trump espouse all of this all of the time in his speeches. We hear the people he invites to speak at his events say these things.

And, Mick and I are both saying this as white men, because that is some fucked up shit and we will be damned if we stay quiet about it.

What he said was racist.

What you said is racist. And mostly false. What little grains of truth are there, are drastically hyperbolized.

 

[barfo]

Why is it always the Democrats who oppose voter ID?

Because it's unnecessary. Voter fraud is largely a made-up problem, especially the variety of someone going to the polls and pretending to be someone else in order to vote.
And it requiring ID will make it harder for non-fraudulent voters to cast their ballots. Which is of course the actual goal of Republicans.

barfo

 

[barfo]

What he said was racist.

What you said is racist. And mostly false. What little grains of truth are there, are drastically hyperbolized.

Are you saying MAGA is a race? I don't think it is recognized as such. Rather than racist, maybe his remark was 'cultist'?

barfo

 

[Chris Craig]

What he said was racist.

What you said is racist. And mostly false. What little grains of truth are there, are drastically hyperbolized.

Not racist at all

And not false.

 

[crandc]

And another to raise money to bail out people who fence off several blocks of a major city, storm and burn federal buildings, loot every store in sight, threaten to kill police, assault and attempt to murder police and civilians, all in the name of "anti-fascism."

Sounds like January 6.

 

[CJ_is_Gone]

Because it's unnecessary. Voter fraud is largely a made-up problem, especially the variety of someone going to the polls and pretending to be someone else in order to vote.

Sorry - not a good enough reason.... As the saying goes -> 'Perception is reality'...

Inherent in your response is an admission that there is SOME voter fraud occurring. Everyone can argue how 'significant' of a problem it is, but who gets to decide when it becomes a problem? If there is 0.5% voter fraud, is that an issue? How about if there is 5%? Right now there is no way to even track/verify how widespread the issue is.

The amount of voter fraud that is occurring is a secondary issue (albeit still very important). Being able to trust in the process is paramount.

Just think of how much time / money / energy was wasted with Clinton claiming fraud in 2016 and Trump in 2020.....

And it requiring ID will make it harder for non-fraudulent voters to cast their ballots.

To use your same argument, one could say "this is largely a made-up problem.'

Admittedly this is a concern, but it is much easier to remedy. Ultimately I think that is a responsibility of the individual to figure out if they want to participate in society. You have to prove who you are to drive, board a plane, open a bank account, and a host of other activities. Many states DO require ID to register to vote, and it doesn't seem to be a problem....

This appears to be a red herring argument. However, these fringe cases are not worth creating doubt in the integrity of elections overall.

Which is of course the actual goal of Republicans.

I absolutely HATE this type of ideological garbage - in ascribing nefarious motive behind people's comments.... I get that it's part of human nature and part of tribalism. Both democrats and republicans do this frequently. I would love for us humans to advance beyond this type of garbage.

 

[beast blazer]

Because it's unnecessary. Voter fraud is largely a made-up problem, especially the variety of someone going to the polls and pretending to be someone else in order to vote.
And it requiring ID will make it harder for non-fraudulent voters to cast their ballots. Which is of course the actual goal of Republicans.

barfo

Can you figure out that 1+1 = 2? Only Democrats want no voter ID because they BENEFIT from no voter ID. Why would that be? They would tell you that minorities are too stupid to get an ID. But I think we all know the real reason.

 

[MickZagger]

What he said was racist.

What you said is racist. And mostly false. What little grains of truth are there, are drastically hyperbolized.

Do you classify yourself as MAGA or someone that votes for Trump?

My comment wasn’t pointed at Republicans who will vote for Charles Manson if he happened to be the candidate.

My comments were specific to the MAGA cult freaks that worship the toilet that Trump shits on and eats up every little words he says.

There’s a slight difference that needs to be addressed.

 

[MickZagger]

Are you saying MAGA is a race? I don't think it is recognized as such. Rather than racist, maybe his remark was 'cultist'?

barfo

Bingo!

 

[barfo]

Sorry - not a good enough reason.... As the saying goes -> 'Perception is reality'...

So if you lie about something enough, it has to be taken as fact?
The only reason this is a topic of discussion is that Republicans have been lying about it.
There's no evidence of widespread voter fraud.

Inherent in your response is an admission that there is SOME voter fraud occurring. Everyone can argue how 'significant' of a problem it is, but who gets to decide when it becomes a problem? If there is 0.5% voter fraud, is that an issue?

Yes, that much would be an issue. The actual percentage is VASTLY less than that.

How about if there is 5%? Right now there is no way to even track/verify how widespread the issue is.

Sure there is. If I go to the voting booth and pose as you, there's at least some chance that you'll show up, try to vote, and my fraud will be uncovered.
What is that chance? It's roughly the fraction of registered voters who actually vote. If, say 2 people are caught doing that, then we can extrapolate that there were maybe 4 or 5 total cases.

The amount of voter fraud that is occurring is a secondary issue (albeit still very important). Being able to trust in the process is paramount.

If you want people to trust the system, stop lying about voter fraud. It's that simple.

To use your same argument, one could say "this is largely a made-up problem.'

Not truthfully, one couldn't. It's pretty obvious that if you require 170M people to bring ID to vote, thousands of them will either forget, or will have lost their ID, or whatever.
That number will be MUCH larger than the number of people who are voting pretending to be someone else.

Admittedly this is a concern, but it is much easier to remedy. Ultimately I think that is a responsibility of the individual to figure out if they want to participate in society. You have to prove who you are to drive, board a plane, open a bank account, and a host of other activities. Many states DO require ID to register to vote, and it doesn't seem to be a problem....

Well, if you are talking about registering, rather than voting, that's a whole different - and less controversial - issue.

I absolutely HATE this type of ideological garbage - in ascribing nefarious motive behind people's comments.... I get that it's part of human nature and part of tribalism. Both democrats and republicans do this frequently. I would love for us humans to advance beyond this type of garbage.

Then stop falling for it. You don't have to believe the lies.

barfo