Is Will Barton actually decent?

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Schilly said:
Hmmm... better at instant offense? I think the best stat on that is the good ole per 36 stat maybe layerd with USG and ORTG

PLayer: Pts - USG - ORTG - PER
Barton: 16.7 - 21.5 - 110 - 16.4
Williams: 13.9 - 20.4 - 102 - 11.9
McCollum: 16.0 - 21.0 - 98 - 10.0

Will also has a better DRT than the other 2
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Those are SIGNIFICANT differences. 17% higher points on just 5% higher usage with a 9% higher ORTG and a MASSIVE 27% higher PER.

Granted, I think Will's #'s would decline with more playing time but it's tough to argue he hasn't done more than expected given such a limited role.

:matrix:
 
CJ and Willy's sample sizes are pretty low, but that's still interesting to see
 
I know the garbage end of last season ins't much to look at but look at the numbers will put up in the last 7 games when he actually got PT.

15.2ppg, 7rpg, 3.7apg, 1.4spg

Also look at his improved shooting and he is actually taking shots at a greater rate this year.
2012/2103: .382 fg% - .138 3pt%
2013/2014: .441 fg% - .294 3pt%
 
maxiep said:
We have other players that offer instant offense better than Barton. What we're missing is a disruptive wing defender off the bench. Robinson has shown he can bring that energy off the bench in the front court. We don't have it in the backcourt. Mo can bring offense. CJ can bring offense. Wright can bring offense. Who can bring the defense?
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Yeah I would never want Will to even contemplate that he is our instant offense player off the bench. That's where he will get into trouble. He just needs to continue playing his all around game and good things will happen for him and his teammates. But if he goes in with the mindset that he needs to be thee scorer off the bench, I think you will get the quick shots.
 
The thing I like about Will is his all round game, he just comes in grabs a board or a steal, makes an assist a dunk a jumper, he just seems to do everything. He's just fun to watch. remember this is a guy who put up 72 in an NBA charity game. I don't care if he is getting dunks on ally oops, that just means he's finding ways to get to the rim, something our other guys don't do.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Yeah I would never want Will to even contemplate that he is our instant offense player off the bench.
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Well, he was very aware of his instant offense role last night, and he scored, created and rebounded. I would very much like to see that nurtured, and not see the Nate McMillan approach of breaking ones spirit. The guy is a second year player with a total package of skills....Just needs coaching and development.
 
maxiep said:
He had a few dunks, but he made a lot of Js. He was impressive last night. Really impressive. He was a monster on the boards and also made some beautiful passes. In fact, his no look pass to Nico for the easy layin I think was the highlight of the night.
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I'm just worried that Will is gonna hurt his neck doing that look-away so hard, lol...
 
bemac said:
Well, he was very aware of his instant offense role last night, and he scored, created and rebounded. I would very much like to see that nurtured, and not see the Nate McMillan approach of breaking ones spirit. The guy is a second year player with a total package of skills....Just needs coaching and development.
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Was he? Or did he just play his game and the scoring came with it. I know we are splitting hairs here. Maybe you are right, but I still prefer that his mindset does not include instant offense.

I agree with everything else you said though.
 
What was Stott's quote after Will had a big game last season? Something about "he looked pretty in control, for Will..."
 
Love it. hWill is like a wild relief pitcher, you don't know if he's going to throw a strike or hit you in the head. He's shakes up the game.
 
Wizard Mentor said:
If he can master the fundamentals of the game (defense, spacing,...) he is a starter in this league. His 3-pt shooting seems to have improved from last year.

Somehow, if we could combine the best of Claver and Barton into a single player, that player would be an all-star.
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I think they'd be very similar to Nicolas Batum.
 
bemac said:
Will Barton is offense off the bench, and why would anyone want to limit that? There are very few players who can create the way he does, and yes he is raw, but he has all the tools. Scoring, passing, ball handling, rebounding.

When given the chance, he has performed. You can't overlook what he does for the players around him, when given the opportunity....They feed off his energy. Look what he did for Claver last night.

When given the opportunity....Work on the turnovers, and I'm more than happy with a sixth man putting up these numbers.

Apr 17 GS 48:00 7 19 36.8 1 7 4 3 15
Apr 16 LAC 39:55 8 14 57.1 6 5 6 17
Apr 14 Den 34:17 5 8 62.5 9 5 3 17
Apr 12 OKC 38:14 8 19 42.1 7 0 3 18
Apr 10 LAL 29:25 4 12 33.3 1 2 3 9
Apr 7 Dal 32:27 7 11 63.6 13 6 0 22
Apr 5 Hou 20:46 4 9 44.4 6 4 1 9
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While I agree that kind of production for a 6th man would be great, Barton actually started those last 5 games you listed from 4/10 - 4/17, 2013 and averaged 38 MPG in those 5 games. So, you're not going to see that kind of production out of him as a 6th man. You need to cut the numbers in half to get a more accurate assessment of his potential production as a 6th man, and even than it's a pretty small, skewed sample size. Those last 5 games last season (actually the last 13) were pretty much garbage time. We had pulled our starters and were in full tank mode. So, another reason those numbers aren't an accurate reflection of Barton's potential as a 6th man.

Don't get me wrong, I loved what Barton brought last night and would like to see more of it. I'm just pointing out that I wouldn't expect Barton to produce nearly as much playing 20 MPG off the bench as he did in 38 MPG last April as starter.

BNM
 
The instant offense term is tough....I don't think it's the right term for Will. I think it's more about being aggressive, in a way that fires up the other players on the floor. The bench has not had an energy guy, other than Robinson for the one game. I think Will can be that on a more consistent basis, and if he is, I think we see more of it from the rest of the second unit. I think it also forces Mo to create more, and be less of a dribbler, as we saw last night.
 
Jayps15 said:
Like everyone was saying when Robinson has had a few huge games based off hustle, bringing energy like that off the bench can be infectious. They both seem capable of giving you either a huge boost in momentum, or completely sucking the air out the room with boneheaded plays.

Barton's a bit like Crawford, let him go wild and do whatever he wants, and you'll be pulling your hair out. But put him in a structure, with players and a coach he has to follow/respect and he can make the occasional big play while not comletely killing you the rest of the time. He's a heat check guy, I'd throw him in for Wes or Nic for maybe a 4min stretch. If he's on keep him out there and give those guys the rest, if not have him sit and play the regular rotations.



Highlight to me was Will blocking Plumlee's dunk/layup off the alley-oop with about 2:20 left then driving fullcourt to draw FTs, he was just playing his ass off, barely got up there but got all ball on a very athletic big. Came right after Claver hit the 3, but they didn't credit him with the block.
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The only block Barton the scorers gave him was on Blatche.
 
bemac said:
The instant offense term is tough....I don't think it's the right term for Will. I think it's more about being aggressive, in a way that fires up the other players on the floor. The bench has not had an energy guy, other than Robinson for the one game. I think Will can be that on a more consistent basis, and if he is, I think we see more of it from the rest of the second unit. I think it also forces Mo to create more, and be less of a dribbler, as we saw last night.
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Agree, instant offense isn't correct. Instant chaos is more accurate. What he does best is change the tempo by forcing things at both ends of the court. Last night, New Jersey wanted to really force us to play a slow tempo, half-court style game. They succeeded in the 1st quarter. But in the second quarter, Will's frenetic play forced the tempo to pick up greatly, much to Portland's advantage. By changing the pace of the game from a plodding, low scoring half-court snoozefest onto a track meet let the Blazers run the much older, much bigger, much slower Nets out of the gym.

That's what Will Baton brings, the ability to increase the pace of the game by bringing energy at both ends. That's also why I think he fits well with Mo. Notice how productive Mo as last night. Mo likes to push the tempo, but he needs a running mate. Mo forcing a 1-3 or 1-4 fast break is a recipe for disaster. With Barton out there with him, against the old, slow Nets, we had a lot of 2-1, 2-0 and 3-1 fast breaks. His energy is contagious and a nice compliment to Mo's style Barton had a great game and Mo had a much more efficient game with fewer TOVs. He's a much better fit next to Mo than C.J. is.

BNM
 
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He reminds me of Corey Brewer a bit. I like Barton. He's a long, athletic, slashing guard. He plays the passing lanes and he attacks the rim. We don't have a lot of players like that..... in fact...... he might be the only one.

I don't think he's a starter, but I think he's a solid backup.
 
i thought the thrill actually made mo look better. mo claver and will seem to have good chemistry. claver and will move without the ball and give mo a target rather than standing there watching him dribble.
 
rasheedfan2005 said:
i thought the thrill actually made mo look better. mo claver and will seem to have good chemistry. claver and will move without the ball and give mo a target rather than standing there watching him dribble.
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Makes sense to me. We do tend to stand around the perimeter. Will on the other hand prefers to be under the basket.
 
Small sample size, but he seems to be improving. I cringe less with Barton on the court than I do with CJ and Wright.
 
Charcoal Filtered said:
Small sample size, but he seems to be improving. I cringe less with Barton on the court than I do with CJ and Wright.
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Even Wright isn't making me cry as much as he used to. CJ is rough but will get better. Will is thrilling in the sense that you must surrender control to unleash him, but he's been a force for good lately.

He's like the tasmanian devil out there... or Godzilla. Sometimes he destroys, sometimes he protects.
 
I think it's telling that Claver and Barton are looking better now that Leonard and Robinson are out. In fact, Rice said something to that effect: spacing is so much better without those two boneheads.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
I think it's telling that Claver and Barton are looking better now that Leonard and Robinson are out. In fact, Rice said something to that effect: spacing is so much better without those two boneheads.
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Leonard hardly ever played. I don't think we can blame him for anything.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
I think it's telling that Claver and Barton are looking better now that Leonard and Robinson are out. In fact, Rice said something to that effect: spacing is so much better without those two boneheads.
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Wasn't he talking about Wright spacing the floor as a PF? Allowing Lillard more room to attack the basket?

Either way the spacing is better with Claver and Wright standing out at the 3 point line. But don't we want TRob under the basket when he is out there? There has to be a compromise. We don't want him to shoot out there yet we want him standing out there? That makes offensive rebounds tougher to get.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Wasn't he talking about Wright spacing the floor as a PF? Allowing Lillard more room to attack the basket?

Either way the spacing is better with Claver and Wright standing out at the 3 point line. But don't we want TRob under the basket when he is out there? There has to be a compromise. We don't want him to shoot out there yet we want him standing out there? That makes offensive rebounds tougher to get.
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I don't buy that argument though. LA plays on the perimeter too.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I don't buy that argument though. LA plays on the perimeter too.
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Yeah I questioned it myself for that very reason. I guess with all the pick and roll plays that LA and Damian do together the spacing is not quite as wide. If it really does help Lillard, maybe they can mix it up more and let LA drift out further. Just not too often.....
 
Floor spacing can come with off the ball movement, maybe just having energy guys with fresh legs running around is helping over 4 tired guys watching mo dribble
 
I like Will. I was bummed when we kept him over Elliott. But that is why Neil is Neil and I'm the dude trying to portray him on teams internet forum.
BTW, Love Wills interviews. He cracks me up.
 
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