Keeping the #3 pick.....AND Dame

[Phatguysrule]

If that’s the case then Cronin has decided to rebuild. It’s his way of getting Lillard to demand a trade

Disagree. It may mean we can get more impact by keeping the #3 than by trading it.

 

[STOMP]

The only way i see the Blazers keeping #3 is if ,Miller falls to them and ,he's Kevin Freaking Durant reincarnate. Great immediately . Bird, Magic, Jordan. If he's less than, and needs multiple years to develop, pass.

I'm going to go out on a real sturdy wide limb and state unequivocally that no matter how many years he has to develop Miller will never be a Durant, Bird, Magic or Jordan level talent let alone in a few months.

Thats a ridiculous standard to hold anyone to, which might be the point??? So let me guess, the logical only option is to trade the pick and multiple future 1sts to acquire vet talent to stack around Dame next season?

STOMP

 

[STOMP]

If Miller is available, I don’t see a problem with keeping the pick and Dame as long as other moves are made to add more vets. Trade Ant, #23 and a 2nd for OG.

What in the world has OG done to warrant such a return? Is it that he's always seemingly always injured? Or is it the career 13.2 PER? He's either not playing very well or injured. Depending on what else transpires this summer, the very most I'd part with for him is Ant & even then it's not something I'm prioritizing.

STOMP

 

[e_blazer]

What in the world has OG done to warrant such a return? Is it that he's always seemingly always injured? Or is it the career 13.2 PER? He's either not playing very well or injured. Depending on what else transpires this summer, the very most I'd part with for him is Ant & even then it's not something I'm prioritizing.

STOMP

It’s his defense and the fact that both Lillard and Cronin value what he offers. Obviously, your opinion is lesser. The price tag Toronto put on him at the deadline was higher than my suggested deal. If Cronin can get him for less, great.

Per Woj at the deadline:

"A 6-foot-7 player, a two-way player. I think there's a belief that Toronto could get as many as 3 first-round picks in a deal for Anunoby if they decided to move him. They've certainly talked with teams to see what the market is on him and I think virtually everybody on that Raptors team."

Anunoby is a very good 3-and-D player. He can play multiple positions at both ends of the floor and defends perimeter players quite well. He's also a solid offensive contributor. Anunoby is averaging 16.9 points per game on 36.6 percent shooting from 3-point range.

 

[Tince]

It’s his defense and the fact that both Lillard and Cronin value what he offers. Obviously, your opinion is lesser. The price tag Toronto put on him at the deadline was higher than my suggested deal. If Cronin can get him for less, great.

Per Woj at the deadline:

"A 6-foot-7 player, a two-way player. I think there's a belief that Toronto could get as many as 3 first-round picks in a deal for Anunoby if they decided to move him. They've certainly talked with teams to see what the market is on him and I think virtually everybody on that Raptors team."

Anunoby is a very good 3-and-D player. He can play multiple positions at both ends of the floor and defends perimeter players quite well. He's also a solid offensive contributor. Anunoby is averaging 16.9 points per game on 36.6 percent shooting from 3-point range.

OG, at no fault of his own, has become over-rated in my opinion.

Doesn't mean he isn't good and wouldn't be of value on Portland's roster.

 

[theprunetang]

OG, at no fault of his own, has become over-rated in my opinion.

Doesn't mean he isn't good and wouldn't be of value on Portland's roster.

OG would be a fantastic addition to this team. But, Toronto has overvalued him so much, that trading for him is unfeasible with any sense of fairness.

 

[e_blazer]

OG would be a fantastic addition to this team. But, Toronto has overvalued him so much, that trading for him is unfeasible with any sense of fairness.

I think that Toronto will come off of the asking price Woj mentioned. His contract expires after this season and no way is Toronto going to pay the money OG wants. They risk losing him for nothing if they don’t make a trade this summer.

The reasons I listed him in my scenario are that his salary doesn’t currently require any other players than Ant to make the deal work. Siakam would be better, but he’d drain the roster of seasoned players. OG would also be something of a placeholder until Miller is ready to assume a starting role. Just my thoughts. Your mileage may vary.

Correction: OG has 2 years remaining.

 

[STOMP]

It’s his defense and the fact that both Lillard and Cronin value what he offers.

Hard to D up when a guy is injured yet again, but remind me of when has Cronin spoken to valuing what OG offers? Since you say it's a fact that he values him so greatly, I'm sure you'll be able to relay the quote(s) that I apparently missed... or is this all Woj rumorama?

btw, it's been said that Ant is worth 11dbillion 1st round picks as I just said it. The Blazers might be willing to come off that asking price somewhat...

STOMP

 

[e_blazer]

Hard to D up when a guy is injured yet again, but remind me of when has Cronin spoken to valuing what OG offers? Since you say it's a fact that he values him so greatly, I'm sure you'll be able to relay the quote(s) that I apparently missed... or is this all Woj rumorama?

btw, it's been said that Ant is worth 11dbillion 1st round picks as I just said it. The Blazers might be willing to come off that asking price somewhat...

STOMP

Not sure why you have an issue with what I said. It’s been common knowledge that the Blazers made a run at OG last summer, but couldn’t agree with Toronto on the price:

https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/teams/Portland-Trail-Blazers/24/news/wiretap/archive/2022/5

“The Blazers (27-29) were also linked in trade rumors to Toronto forward O.G. Anunoby. But the Raptors were reportedly seeking three first-round picks and a player.”

https://www.oregonlive.com/blazers/...ar-by-trade-deadline-fail.html?outputType=amp

If OG’s health is s concern I’m sure it will be discussed. I just mentioned a theoretical trade. If it gives you so much heartburn you’re free to ignore it.

 

[Bingo Bango]

The only way i see the Blazers keeping #3 is if ,Miller falls to them and ,he's Kevin Freaking Durant reincarnate. Great immediately . Bird, Magic, Jordan. If he's less than, and needs multiple years to develop, pass.

Huh? They won’t know if any of that is true about Miller until AFTER they’ve drafted him.

 

[wizenheimer]

I think that Toronto will come off of the asking price Woj mentioned. His contract expires after this season and no way is Toronto going to pay the money OG wants. They risk losing him for nothing if they don’t make a trade this summer.

The reasons I listed him in my scenario are that his salary doesn’t currently require any other players than Ant to make the deal work. Siakam would be better, but he’d drain the roster of seasoned players. OG would also be something of a placeholder until Miller is ready to assume a starting role. Just my thoughts. Your mileage may vary.

Correction: OG has 2 years remaining.

what did Woj say the asking price was, and when did he say it? Was this the '3 first round picks' rumor before the deadline?

 

[e_blazer]

what did Woj say the asking price was, and when did he say it? Was this the '3 first round picks' rumor before the deadline?

Yup.

 

[Ed O]

None of the options really align with what I think is best.

Trading Miller or Henderson at #3 is a no brainer IMO. Trading down would be a mistake.

We don't need to trade Dame to make me happy--as long as we're not mortgaging the future to keep HIM happy, having him on the team will result in better, more fun basketball being played.

 

[HoopsFanAZ]

Grant @ 5 years and $30 per is a Blazer.
No Dame? Grant unknown if he signs but can be traded.
Grant at $25 million per wears another uniform. In building around Dame, Grant is high

I think that Toronto will come off of the asking price Woj mentioned. His contract expires after this season and no way is Toronto going to pay the money OG wants. They risk losing him for nothing if they don’t make a trade this summer.

The reasons I listed him in my scenario are that his salary doesn’t currently require any other players than Ant to make the deal work. Siakam would be better, but he’d drain the roster of seasoned players. OG would also be something of a placeholder until Miller is ready to assume a starting role. Just my thoughts. Your mileage may vary.

Correction: OG has 2 years remaining.

OG does have 2 years remaining, but the 2nd is a player option (according to Spotrac). He will most certainly opt-out.
FVV wants new money this year on a player-option.
GTJr, same.
Poeltl is a UFA.
OG at $18.6 million, then opts out on $20 million in a year.
Siakam in a year goes from next year's $37.9 million to more as UFA.

Cost certainty for 3 years on Ant is looking pretty good at a position of need for Toronto. And a rookie contract for #3. Siakam seems the most likely gone.
[Scottie Barnes, 22 / GTJ, 25 / OG, 26 / Poeltl, 28 / FVV, 29 / Siakam, 29]

 

[STOMP]

Not sure why you have an issue with what I said. It’s been common knowledge that the Blazers made a run at OG last summer, but couldn’t agree with Toronto on the price:

https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/teams/Portland-Trail-Blazers/24/news/wiretap/archive/2022/5

“The Blazers (27-29) were also linked in trade rumors to Toronto forward O.G. Anunoby.

So rumors not facts. Whats a fact is that GMs talk about players and scenarios all the time that fans don't hear about and only sometimes agents leak stuff to Woj. OG's agent seems to be quite the leaker as his name has been in lots of rumors... maybe he wants out of Toronto? Regardless, fans don't have any real way to gauge the level of interest Cronin might have only that players have been discussed, which again is expected. Blazer interest in OG might be real, or it might be passing like Joe has with checking in on most any decent player. Maybe the rumors passed along about Toronto wanting back multiple firsts for OG are true too as Ujiri doesn't want to move him right now unless its for an inordinate amount back. Fine, thats what I assume is the asking price for most players most of the time. A good negotiator always starts by asking for the moon. It certainly doesn't mean the Blazers need to go towards a ridiculous asking price like the Ant + a 1st & a 2nd hypothetical you proposed. If the speculations that FVV walks this summer turn out to be true, I suspect the Raptor's desire to land a PG will increase and their asks will be more conducive to getting something done.

btw, in the reasonable offseason trade thread, I mentioned Ant for OG a month back or so. Maybe we should start an unreasonable offseason trade thread?

STOMP

 

[SharpeScooterShooter]

I believe this is the best outcome. We keep Lillard for obvious reasons, plus to mentor the young uns. And we build for the future. If they improve enough in the next two to three years, Dame makes a run ala CP3. And maybe we get to the finals and have a crack at getting him a ring.

 

[e_blazer]

So rumors not facts. Whats a fact is that GMs talk about players and scenarios all the time that fans don't hear about and only sometimes agents leak stuff to Woj. OG's agent seems to be quite the leaker as his name has been in lots of rumors... maybe he wants out of Toronto? Regardless, fans don't have any real way to gauge the level of interest Cronin might have only that players have been discussed, which again is expected. Blazer interest in OG might be real, or it might be passing like Joe has with checking in on most any decent player. Maybe the rumors passed along about Toronto wanting back multiple firsts for OG are true too as Ujiri doesn't want to move him right now unless its for an inordinate amount back. Fine, thats what I assume is the asking price for most players most of the time. A good negotiator always starts by asking for the moon. It certainly doesn't mean the Blazers need to go towards a ridiculous asking price like the Ant + a 1st & a 2nd hypothetical you proposed. If the speculations that FVV walks this summer turn out to be true, I suspect the Raptor's desire to land a PG will increase and their asks will be more conducive to getting something done.

btw, in the reasonable offseason trade thread, I mentioned Ant for OG a month back or so. Maybe we should start an unreasonable offseason trade thread?

STOMP

The point of this thread was is there a way to keep Dame and the 3rd pick. I tossed out an idea of getting OG and using the pick on Miller. That’s all it was; a half-formed idea without any inside knowledge of current thinking by Cronin and his staff. Yes, I relied on rumors of past interest by the Blazers in OG. That’s the norm around here since, as far as I know, none of us have inside info. For some reason, this seems to have pissed you off. I can’t for the life of me figure out why. Nor do I care.

 

[Freshtown]

I believe this is the best outcome. We keep Lillard for obvious reasons, plus to mentor the young uns. And we build for the future. If they improve enough in the next two to three years, Dame makes a run ala CP3. And maybe we get to the finals and have a crack at getting him a ring.

yes, I look at it like:

Dame will probably be at the current level he is at for 2 more seasons, then begin a gradual decline.

meanwhile, sharpe and miller grow from non-contributors to (ideally) all star players in 2-3 years.

So if we have a situation where Dame declines in 3 years from all-nba to merely being an all star, that decline is more than overcome by the pieces around him going from 0 to all star level.

this is our best chance at contention imo. And if it doesn’t work we still have a young core to build around.

 

[STOMP]

The point of this thread was is there a way to keep Dame and the 3rd pick. I tossed out an idea of getting OG and using the pick on Miller. That’s all it was; a half-formed idea without any inside knowledge of current thinking by Cronin and his staff. Yes, I relied on rumors of past interest by the Blazers in OG. That’s the norm around here since, as far as I know, none of us have inside info. For some reason, this seems to have pissed you off. I can’t for the life of me figure out why. Nor do I care.

While apparently you don't care, I was more confused then pissed. It was completely your use of the word fact that the Blazer brass was interested that confused me, when it was actually rumor based. If it was a fact that Cronin was truly interested in OG, not just another rumor, then that would be news to me... something I'd care about. If they were actually interested, that might justify going towards Toronto's asking price instead of my scoffing at it.

We're just debating players and possibilities. While none of this matters to what actually happens, it helps the reader understand if things are acurately identified.

STOMP

 

[SharpeScooterShooter]

While apparently you don't care, I was more confused then pissed. It was completely your use of the word fact that the Blazer brass was interested that confused me, when it was actually rumor based. If it was a fact that Cronin was truly interested in OG, not just another rumor, then that would be news to me... something I'd care about. If they were actually interested, that might justify going towards Toronto's asking price instead of my scoffing at it.

We're just debating players and possibilities. While none of this matters to what actually happens, it helps the reader understand if things are acurately identified.

STOMP

No one makes a call to another team without being interested in who they are calling about.
Pretty much fact.

So if Portland called Toronto, id personally consider it a fact we were interested in both OG and Siakim. Since those were the reported players coveted.

 

[Phatguysrule]

No one makes a call to another team without being interested in who they are calling about.
Pretty much fact.

So if Portland called Toronto, id personally consider it a fact we were interested in both OG and Siakim. Since those were the reported players coveted.

I actually have a transcript of this exact conversation... But I obviously can't out my sources...

Joe: Hi Masai, this is Joe Cronin from the Blazers. How are you doing?

Masai: Hi Joe, I'm doing well. Thanks for calling. What can I do for you?

Joe: Well, I just wanted to chat with you about something. Nothing serious, just a friendly conversation.

Masai: Oh, I see. Well, I'm always happy to talk to you, Joe. You're one of the best GMs in the league.

Joe: Thank you, Masai. That means a lot coming from you. You've done a great job with the Raptors.

Masai: Thank you, Joe. I appreciate that. So, what did you want to chat about?

Joe: Well, I was wondering how you feel about your team right now. You know, before the draft and free agency and all that.

Masai: Oh, I feel good about our team. We have a lot of young talent and some solid veterans. We're looking forward to improving our roster with the draft and free agency.

Joe: That's good to hear. You have a very balanced roster. I especially like your wings. OG Anunoby and Pascal Siakam are two of my favorite players in the league.

Masai: Really? That's interesting. Why do you say that?

Joe: Well, they're both very skilled and versatile wings. They can score, rebound, defend, and play with high energy. They're also great leaders and teammates.

Masai: Hmm, I see. Are you trying to tell me something, Joe?

Joe: No, no, not at all. I'm just giving you my honest opinion. Why do you ask?

Masai: Well, it sounds like you're interested in one of them. Or maybe both of them.

Joe: No, no, Masai. Don't get me wrong. I'm not calling you to make a trade offer or anything like that.

Masai: Then why are you calling me, Joe? What do you want from me?

Joe: Masai, calm down. I'm just calling you as a friend. A colleague. A fellow GM.

Masai: A friend? A colleague? A fellow GM? Or a potential trade partner?

Joe: Masai, please. Stop being paranoid. I'm not trying to trade with you.

Masai: Then what are you trying to do?

Joe: I'm trying to have a nice conversation with you.

Masai: About what?

Joe: About anything. Anything but basketball.

Masai: Anything but basketball? Why not basketball?

Joe: Because I don't want to talk about basketball.

Masai: You don't want to talk about basketball? Why not?

Joe: Because I'm tired of basketball.

Masai: You're tired of basketball? How can you be tired of basketball? You're a basketball GM.

Joe: I know...
Well, it's been nice chatting with you! Bye bye!

 

[STOMP]

No one makes a call to another team without being interested in who they are calling about.
Pretty much fact.

So if Portland called Toronto, id personally consider it a fact we were interested in both OG and Siakim. Since those were the reported players coveted.

Believe what you will but I've heard enough GMs interviewed to know that especially around the prime trade times (like now) GMs are on the phones with other GMs all the time constantly talking about a variety of each other's players and possibilities. It's likely every single eligible guy on the Blazers has been mentioned in multiple talks with multiple GMs in the last month. Thats them doing their job, not necessarily a sign of real interest or anyting eminant. If fans are hearing about something, it's usually the player's agent leaking it out for their own reasons.

STOMP

 

[e_blazer]

While apparently you don't care, I was more confused then pissed. It was completely your use of the word fact that the Blazer brass was interested that confused me, when it was actually rumor based. If it was a fact that Cronin was truly interested in OG, not just another rumor, then that would be news to me... something I'd care about. If they were actually interested, that might justify going towards Toronto's asking price instead of my scoffing at it.

We're just debating players and possibilities. While none of this matters to what actually happens, it helps the reader understand if things are acurately identified.

STOMP

It feels like you’re hitting my post with a higher degree of scrutiny than is normal around here. What exactly is a “fact” when it comes to one of these reports of talks about trade negotiations? Given league rules on tampering, Cronin can’t just come out and say “hey, we’re gonna make a run at OG.” I didn’t just make up the idea that the Blazers have had interest in OG and I didn’t just get that notion off some fan site. Guys like Woj and Chris Haynes have reported the interest. Here’s a tweet from Haynes from last spring about using the 7th pick in a deal for him:

There have been similar reports from Woj. I guess I should have used the phrase, “there have been reputable reports of the Blazers’ interest in OG” instead of saying it was a “fact”. I’ll try to remember to be more precise from now on.

 

[LayneStaley]

I will puke if the 3rd pick is used to get OG.

 

[Natebishop3]

I will puke if the 3rd pick is used to get OG.

I will teepee Joe Cronins house.

 

[Ed O]

I will puke if the 3rd pick is used to get OG.

You don't think we should give up a high lottery pick for a no-time all-star that has a career 13.2 PER, is age 26 in July and has missed 82 games in the last three seasons?

That's crazy.

I wouldn't have traded #7 last year for him, and I definitely wouldn't trade Sharpe for him now. The #3 pick should be worth more than the #7 was last year, and OG is a year older without accomplishing much of anything on a lottery team while being a year closer to free agency.

 

[STOMP]

It feels like you’re hitting my post with a higher degree of scrutiny than is normal around here.

I'm sorry that you feel that way, I just generally respond to posts that strike me. I do read who the poster is before I read the post, but thats only to selectively skip some here. You're in the much larger group who I'm happy are here helping to feed my Basketball Jones. I meant no offense and honestly only hold positive opinions about your contributions here

What exactly is a “fact” when it comes to one of these reports of talks about trade negotiations? Given league rules on tampering, Cronin can’t just come out and say “hey, we’re gonna make a run at OG.”

exactly, which is why I thought it was odd to claim it as an established fact

I didn’t just make up the idea that the Blazers have had interest in OG and I didn’t just get that notion off some fan site. Guys like Woj and Chris Haynes have reported the interest.
There have been similar reports from Woj. I guess I should have used the phrase, “there have been reputable reports of the Blazers’ interest in OG” instead of saying it was a “fact”. I’ll try to remember to be more precise from now on.

Thanks and again sorry. I know that rumors have been reported. There have always been lots of rumors. Maybe it's become a raw nerve of mine, but I'm pretty past them being thought of as reality as Portland always seems well on the side of completely hosed in most of the deals the various media sites relay. Generally this time of year they're just pandering to the largest fanbases and thats never PDX. For the entire 90s yearly there were published "rumors" at the deadline akin to Portland to send Lillard to the Knicks for two 2nds and a lollypop. I'd always laugh with my Knick friend about those. It's been really rare for "reported" trade stuff that strikes me as ridiculous to happen. Regardless of whats being reported in today or tomorrow's rumorama, I don't think the Raptors will get anything close to the deal you proposed for OG as he's an oft injured solid starter but no All Star. If Joe really wants a long athletic defensive wing, I don't know why he wouldn't take one of the Thompsons and keep Ant too. With as few effective players as Portland has, the last thing they should do is consolidate

STOMP

 

[Samuel]

I actually have a transcript of this exact conversation... But I obviously can't out my sources...

This is hilarious, thank you for that.

 

[Phatguysrule]

Anybody see this? Probably not true, but worth discussing... I think it looks great. Like, maybe a contending team if you can fill out the bench well...

 

[wizenheimer]

Anybody see this? Probably not true, but worth discussing... I think it looks great. Like, maybe a contending team if you can fill out the bench well...

I'm having a hard time believing that

but for sure, if the Blazers could get both players for Simons + Little + 23 they'd be fools not to do it

I think that's especially true considering that there just seems to be way too many questions about the top players in the draft