Lillard's tier

[Mediocre Man]

Tier 2

Curry
Westbrook
Paul

Then in alphabetical order
Irving
Lillard
Lowry
Wall

 

[BonesJones]

Tier 2

Curry
Westbrook
Paul

Then in alphabetical order
Irving
Lillard
Lowry
Wall

Lillard and Irving are definitely a tier (if not 3) above Lowry.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Lillard and Irving are definitely a tier (if not 3) above Lowry.

Their numbers are similar. Other than scoring, which Lowry isn't asked to do like Dame, Lowry has better total shooting %, assists, rebounds and DBPM numbers

 

[theprunetang]

Their numbers are similar. Other than scoring, which Lowry isn't asked to do like Dame, Lowry has better total shooting %, assists, rebounds and DBPM numbers

Until the playoffs start.

 

[SIeepwalker]

@Boob-No-More Do you also, like everyone else in this thread it seems like, think that Westbrook is a tier above Lillard ?

 

[Mediocre Man]

Until the playoffs start.

Their numbers are still similar

 

[H.C.]

Tier 2

Curry
Westbrook
Paul

Then in alphabetical order
Irving
Lillard
Lowry
Wall

For all CP3's greatness. Even the national media has stopped putting him in the #1 tier.
It's not a lifetime achievement list.

 

[Boob-No-More]

@Boob-No-More Do you also, like everyone else in this thread it seems like, think that Westbrook is a tier above Lillard ?

Nope, not this year. Westbrook is a better athlete, but Dame is a better basketball player. Just ask yourself who you'd rather have with the ball in their hands with the game on the line, Westbrook or Lillard?

Lillard is a better leader, a better teammate and much, much better with the game on the line.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

Their numbers are similar. Other than scoring, which Lowry isn't asked to do like Dame, Lowry has better total shooting %, assists, rebounds and DBPM numbers

Lowry isn't asked to score like Dame because he can't. Even when he was the alpha dog, he's never scored more than 22.4 ppg. Dame has been at 25.0, 27.0 and 26.8 for the last three years.

And no, Lowry doesn't have a higher TS% than Lillard. He's at .588 and Dame is at .600. So, not only does Lillard score 10.2 more points per game, he does so more efficiently.

Lowry is almost 32 years old and is in decline. Dame is over 4 years younger, much better today, and still improving. Lowry isn't even close to being in the same tier as Lillard.

BNM

 

[Mediocre Man]

I should know better

Tiers

1. Dame

















2. Everyone else

 

[Binx]

I don't like Westbrook and wouldn't want him on my team but I think it is fair to say he may be the better overall player.

Gee, do you think so?
Westbrook has 97 triple doubles in his career.
Lillard has 0.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Gee, do you think so?
Westbrook has 97 triple doubles in his career.
Lillard has 0.

So? POR has still beaten OKC five times in a row.

Westbrook is a ball hogging, stat padding loser.

BNM

 

[Orion Bailey]

Gee, do you think so?
Westbrook has 97 triple doubles in his career.
Lillard has 0.

How many wins does his team have in his career vs Dame? I bet not many more. And if not many more, than those triple doubles didn't really do much right?
He set the record last year for them. How far did that get him?

 

[Boob-No-More]

How many wins does his team have in his career vs Dame? I bet not many more. And if not many more, than those triple doubles didn't really do much right?
He set the record last year for them. How far did that get him?

Triple Doubles are insanely over rated.

Oscar Robertson averaged a triple double in 1961-62. His team lost 4-1 in the first round of the playoffs.

Russell Westbrook averaged a triple double in 2016017. His team lost 4-1 in the first round of the playoffs.

Westbrook shoots .282 from 3-point range and has a TS% of .518 on 21.4 FGA/G. Someone who shoots that poorly shouldn't be shooting that much, especially when he has a much more efficient teammate like Paul George (or Kevin Durant).

By comparison, Damian Lillard shoots .378 from 3-point range and has a TS% of .600 on 19.2 FGA/G. Dame is clearly the best player on his team, but he takes fewer shots than the poor shooting Westbrook.

Westbrook's 4th quarter "hero" ball style, freezing out teammates, jacking up ill advised shots and committing countless unforced TOVs kills his team's chances of winning close games. OKC during the Westbrook era has constantly been one of the worst teams in the league at losing games they led in the 4th quarter.

Dame is just the opposite. He constantly leads his team 4th quarter comeback victories.

Westbrook wants to be a hero. Lillard is a hero.

BNM

 

[Orion Bailey]

Triple Doubles are insanely over rated.

Oscar Robertson averaged a triple double in 1961-62. His team lost 4-1 in the first round of the playoffs.

Russell Westbrook averaged a triple double in 2016017. His team lost 4-1 in the first round of the playoffs.

Westbrook shoots .282 from 3-point range and has a TS% of .518 on 21.4 FGA/G. Someone who shoots that poorly shouldn't be shooting that much, especially when he has a much more efficient teammate like Paul George (or Kevin Durant).

By comparison, Damian Lillard shoots .378 from 3-point range and has a TS% of .600 on 19.2 FGA/G. Dame is clearly the best player on his team, but he takes fewer shots than the poor shooting Westbrook.

Westbrook's 4th quarter "hero" ball style, freezing out teammates, jacking up ill advised shots and committing countless unforced TOVs kills his team's chances of winning close games. OKC during the Westbrook era has constantly been one of the worst teams in the league at losing games they led in the 4th quarter.

Dame is just the opposite. He constantly leads his team 4th quarter comeback victories.

Westbrook wants to be a hero. Lillard is a hero.

BNM

And so are you. Thank you for the numbers.

 

[BonesJones]

Their numbers are similar. Other than scoring, which Lowry isn't asked to do like Dame, Lowry has better total shooting %, assists, rebounds and DBPM numbers

Low ry doesn't have better TS%, and gets 0.2 APG more than Dame. Youre stretching.

 

[BonesJones]

Gee, do you think so?
Westbrook has 97 triple doubles in his career.
Lillard has 0.

Since reaching whole numbers based on pur whole number system equals wins, maybe we need to have Dame iso more in order to get more assists, and have him chase more rebounds instead of being upfloor for the outlet pass. Ya know, since that triple double is so important!

 

[BonesJones]

Their numbers are still similar

Currys and Lillards numbers are just as similar.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Since reaching whole numbers based on pur whole number system equals wins, maybe we need to have Dame iso more in order to get more assists, and have him chase more rebounds instead of being upfloor for the outlet pass. Ya know, since that triple double is so important!

Don't forget, he also needs to leave his man unguarded at the 3-point line so he can chase rebounds.

BNM

 

[BonesJones]

Don't forget, he also needs to leave his man unguarded at the 3-point line so he can chase rebounds.

BNM

Of course, that's what MVPs do.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Of course, that's what MVPs do.

I remembered that one from an article last year that mentioned Russell Westbrook, the PG who is supposed to be guarding other PGs, had contested fewer 3-point shots than DeAndre Jordan, the 7-foot center/rim protector. Why wasn't Westbrook contesting 3-point shots? Because he was dropping off his man to chase rebounds.

Here you go:

"Westbrook has contested a grand total of 160 FG’s on the ENTIRE SEASON.

That number is staggeringly low and to be frank, flat out embarrassing. …

Westbrook ranks dead last in the NBA in contested shots among players averaging 30 or more MPG by a considerable margin. Hilariously, the only two players who have contested less 3P FGA’s are Rudy Gobert and Whiteside, who have contested 53 and 64 respectively. Russell Westbrook is at 69 while having playing [sic] close to the same amount of minutes…Yes, DeAndre Jordan has contested more 3P FGA’s this season than Russell Westbrook."

BNM

 

[BonesJones]

I remembered that one from an article last year that mentioned Russell Westbrook, the PG who is supposed to be guarding other PGs, had contested fewer 3-point shots than DeAndre Jordan, the 7-foot center/rim protector. Why wasn't Westbrook contesting 3-point shots? Because he was dropping off his man to chase rebounds.

Here you go:

"Westbrook has contested a grand total of 160 FG’s on the ENTIRE SEASON.

That number is staggeringly low and to be frank, flat out embarrassing. …

Westbrook ranks dead last in the NBA in contested shots among players averaging 30 or more MPG by a considerable margin. Hilariously, the only two players who have contested less 3P FGA’s are Rudy Gobert and Whiteside, who have contested 53 and 64 respectively. Russell Westbrook is at 69 while having playing [sic] close to the same amount of minutes…Yes, DeAndre Jordan has contested more 3P FGA’s this season than Russell Westbrook."

BNM

People wonder why that team isn't that good.

Basically, the talent around doesn't matter. He'll get you a 6-10 seed no matter what.

 

[Boob-No-More]

More on Westbrook's "defense":

"Westbrook is contesting approximately 3.4 of his PG matchup’s 13.1 FGA while on the floor. The player he’s supposed to be defending is attempting 74% of their shots without a contest from Westbrook.

Ignoring the fact that he [is] leaving his man with regularity to chase rebounds, even when Westbrook contests shots he’s the worst guard in the league in expected FG% against.

His opp. +6.9% over expected FG% is dead last in the NBA among guards. The only other players over 4.5% are Sean Kilpatrick, Kyle Korver, and Emmanuel Mudiay."

And to think people here used to bitch about Dame's defense. At least he was trying (and is MUCH better this year). Can you imagine how this place would explode if Dame wasn't even trying to guard his man 74% of the time and his opponents were shooting almost 7% higher from the field against him than they were against the rest of the league?

But, but, but... TRIPLE DOUBLES!!!!

BNM

 

[THE HCP]

Gee, do you think so?
Westbrook has 97 triple doubles in his career.
Lillard has 0.

Oh shit, be careful. This forum does NOT like triple doubles or those who do.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Oh shit, be careful. This forum does NOT like triple doubles or those who do.

We prefer wins.

BNM

 

[BonesJones]

Oh shit, be careful. This forum does NOT like triple doubles or those who do.

Yeah, we'll fucking snatch ya if you're not careful.

 

[BonesJones]

We prefer wins.

BNM

Fucking perfect.

 

[THE HCP]

We prefer wins.

BNM

OK, so if you DON’T think the league MVP is not the best PG in the league, where does he rank? What PGs do you have ahead of him. Now remember, when you got all excited and posted how he and one of the greatest players to ever play the game,Oscar Robinson didn’t win the championship, you hinted it was BECAUSE they averaged triple doubles...... so I am interested in what PGs are better than him.

 

[Boob-No-More]

OK, so if you DON’T think the league MVP is not the best PG in the league, where does he rank? What PGs do you have ahead of him. Now remember, when you got all excited and posted how he and one of the greatest players to ever play the game,Oscar Robinson didn’t win the championship, you hinted it was BECAUSE they averaged triple doubles...... so I am interested in what PGs are better than him.

Last year's MVP. He won't win it this year. Not even close.

Oscar did win an NBA championship, near the end of his career when he was second fiddle to Kareem in MIL.

And no, I didn't hint that they failed in the playoffs BECAUSE they averaged triple doubles. My point was that triple doubles are over rated, because no matter how many triple doubles someone has during the regular season, it doesn't guarantee team success in the playoffs.

Think about that for a minute. Basketball is still a team sport. A team that relies too much on one player doesn't usually fair well in the playoffs. It's much easier to game plan for one player than an entire team.

My current rank:

Tier 1:
Curry
Lillard
Irving
Westbrook

I consider Lillard and Irving a virtual tie. Their individual stats are about as close at they can be. Some will give Irving the nod based on team record, but he also has better teammates than Lillard. So, I call that one a tie.

Tier 2:
Chris Paul
John Wall
Kyle Lowry
Kemba Walker

That's based on their current level of play. Right now, today, I think Steph Curry is the only PG in the world that is better than Damian Lillard. Kyrie Irving is on the same level, but given Dame's leadership and his loyalty to the team and the city of Portland, I'd take him over Irving 100 out of 100 times.

BNM

 

[BrianFromWA]

Please permit me to associate myself almost fully with BNM's post above. And...scene.