Martell Webster

[Fez Hammersticks]

This experiment has to end.

He's extremely mentally fragile. That's not something you develop. You have it or you don't. He has it to the tenth power.

This is his ceiling. One game he'll give you 25 and the next 10 it's a roller coaster of horrible to mediocre basketball.

The summer can't come soon enough.

 

[THE HCP]

He has played his way off the court, no doubt. Can't argue with him not getting any run.

 

[Wheels]

This experiment has to end.

He's extremely mentally fragile. That's not something you develop. You have it or you don't. He has it to the tenth power.

This is his ceiling. One game he'll give you 25 and the next 10 it's a roller coaster of horrible to mediocre basketball.

The summer can't come soon enough.

Actually I would love for him to be giving us even 10 now.. assuming you meant ppg and not minutes.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

I meant the next ten games.

It seems he has about four good games a season. I've never seen someone so mentally fragile and streaky as Martell Webster.

 

[Wheels]

I meant the next ten games.

It seems he has about four good games a season. I've never seen someone so mentally fragile and streaky as Martell Webster.

oh lol got it now. sorry I just woke up.. went to bed early for some reason.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Uhh, he's not getting any minutes...so...why are you bitching about him not playing well.

He's not playing.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I'm a Martell Fan, but I feel he will need a change of scenery to succeed. Portland fans are too quick to start playing the blame game, its something that is not uncommon for the fanbase.

Unfortunate, but whatever.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

Dude, this is his fifth or sixth season. He's been like this his entire career. He was given the starting SF job and lost it because of himself, not Batum.

And there is a very good reason why he's suddenly not playing anymore.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Batum isn't playing that great either, Martell is just in a huge slump and therefore, is not playing. There is no "experiment", he played well when he was needed to fill in due to injuries earlier in the year. Now that more of the regular rotation players are in, he's getting pushed back. Trading him for nothing or a second round pick isn't going to do much really, I'd rather have an inconsistent Martell than stashing some schlub in Europe that will never see the court. He's fine as a backup SF (but again, right now he's not).

He's actually been playing much better than Rudy this year.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I meant the next ten games.

It seems he has about four good games a season. I've never seen someone so mentally fragile and streaky as Martell Webster.

He's had four good games this month. He's in a supreme funk right now, probably due to..i don't know, huge roster moves of getting Camby and Roy back.......he's actually been fairly consistent this season except for this recent stretch and an anomomly here and there.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

in either case, this season has been a wash for me, in determining rotation players for the future. I'm not convinced Martell will be part of it, but I'm not in favor of giving him away for far less talent at a position we do not need.

If we can package him and Rudy/Bayless for a good young PG, that will probably be optimum.

If anything, to me, this time has kind of made me think that Rudy, Bayless and Webster are not going to be part of the long-term plans of the Blazers in their championship aspirations....

The core will be Roy, Batum, LMA, Oden and Camby......and I think Cunningham will survive the fury...everyone else...maybe not.

 

[Blazer_Hippie]

For some fun preseason Webster hype...

http://sportstwo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=147240&referrerid=21490

 

[yenniedn]

Awesome triple post, Mr. President. Multi-quote much?

I'm waiting for Fez to suggest a Webster for Mayo . . . or Webster for Beasley . . . or Webster for Marc Gasol . . . or Webster for Tyreke Evans . . . or Webster for JaVale McGee . . . or Webster for Rubio trade because in FezWorld, all good young talent is available for Blazers scraps.

 

[axs88]

I'm a Martell Fan, but I feel he will need a change of scenery to succeed. Portland fans are too quick to start playing the blame game, its something that is not uncommon for the fanbase.

Unfortunate, but whatever.

I don't think he reads the board, so it doesn't really matter what we think of him. He is what he is.

 

[BLAZER PROPHET]

As a Martel fan, I agree that he's played very spotty, but he's also played pretty good defense and done other things that don't show up in the box score. I realize most of you "experts" are just stats hounds and think it's the only true measure of a player, but I wouldn't be so quick to stick a fork in him.

All that to say, he is a player that doesn't do well when sick or injured. Batum hasn't played much better either. It's just a feeling I get, but I think Cunningham will end up being a better player than either Webster or Batum.

 

[Nikolokolus]

I thought Michael Holton had a nice assessment of Martell's game on "The Fifth Quarter" post game show a couple of games back, he called Martell a bulk shooter, not a knock-down shooter, not a 3 pt specialist, but a bulk shooter; implying he needs lots of plays, lots of touches and a focal point in the offense to be truly effective over the long haul of a game.

Part of the problem for Martell is Nate McMillan's offense which mostly has the small forward relegated to the corners, but part of it is also Martell's lack of an in between game, generally poor ball handling skills, and a history of battling confidence issues.

I don't dislike Martell (much the same way I didn't dislike Channing the person), but I don't see him having a great long term career here in Portland ... and the only way he's going to be a productive player is if he ends up on a team that is in desperate need of the kind of bulk shooting that he can provide along with some decent (but not necessarily great) wing defense -- frankly I can't think of a team he would start for, but there might be somebody out there who really wants him.

 

[ABM]

Trade Martell

Sign Outlaw

Re-sign Camby

We'll be good.

 

[BlazerBeliever]

Where is MGB? He has to be the biggest Martell supporter. Maybe he finally got the picture.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Vindicated!

 

[Minstrel]

I thought Michael Holton had a nice assessment of Martell's game on "The Fifth Quarter" post game show a couple of games back, he called Martell a bulk shooter, not a knock-down shooter, not a 3 pt specialist, but a bulk shooter; implying he needs lots of plays, lots of touches and a focal point in the offense to be truly effective over the long haul of a game.

Yeah, that may be true. The problem is, he's nowhere near good enough to help a team by getting that many touches and shots. So it's a catch-22 for Webster...he's reserve-quality, but can only function as a focal point player. Therefore, correctly, no coach will ever give him the role he needs to be successful.

 

[1 Eye Jack]

You guys are idiots! Mixum was right Martel is obviously the starter and we should trade away Batum.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Yeah, that may be true. The problem is, he's nowhere near good enough to help a team by getting that many touches and shots. So it's a catch-22 for Webster...he's reserve-quality, but can only function as a focal point player. Therefore, correctly, no coach will ever give him the role he needs to be successful.

I completely agree. I was just trying to illustrate that catch-22 based on the kind of player he is and the role he is being asked to play here in Portland -- and frankly the role he'd be asked to play in probably 90% of the teams in the league.

Martell strikes me as the kind of guy who would be a star in the ACB or Euroleagues with his pretty decent athleticism, his decent defense and the fact that he'd be guarded by less physical wings and would be allowed to shoot about a foot or two closer to the rim which would probably raise his percentages

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I completely agree. I was just trying to illustrate that catch-22 based on the kind of player he is and the role he is being asked to play here in Portland -- and frankly the role he'd be asked to play in probably 90% of the teams in the league.

Martell strikes me as the kind of guy who would be a star in the ACB or Euroleagues with his pretty decent athleticism, his decent defense and the fact that he'd be guarded by less physical wings and would be allowed to shoot about a foot or two closer to the rim which would probably raise his percentages

Don't they play more distributed team ball in Europe though?

 

[Shooter]

Webster is the classic example of a guy who should have gone to college. He needed to develop an all-around game and some fundamental skills, but he chose the "easy" route and I'm afraid he's never going to amount to much of an NBA player.

Back to D League.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Webster is the classic example of a guy who should have gone to college. He needed to develop an all-around game and some fundamental skills, but he chose the "easy" route and I'm afraid he's never going to amount to much of an NBA player.

Back to D League.

Should Rudy go back to the D-league too? he's not doing much better than 'Tell. Same with Bayless.

 

[Luther]

Rudy has been bad since he came back from his injury and hasn't made nearly the impact that Martell was making when Roy was out. Martell is obviously in a funk but for most people to bitch and call for his head is just dumb. In January he was very very productive for us. What about Rudy?!

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Rudy has been bad since he came back from his injury and hasn't made nearly the impact that Martell was making when Roy was out. Martell is obviously in a funk but for most people to bitch and call for his head is just dumb. In January he was very very productive for us. What about Rudy?!

Indeed. He is in a slump and he's still going up and down, but he has improved somewhat. His actual numbers this month are not that far off from the "vastly superior Batum"...batum disappears too, did that last year but people don't call him out because of the man-crush they have on him.

A dump of him just to dump is pretty fucking stupid...what...addition by subtraction? Yeah, that really doesn't work.

This year is wishy washy anyways.

 

[Minstrel]

I'm not convinced Webster has psychological problems. That theory works from the default assumption that he's actually wonderfully talented but his emotional state holds him back. I think the simplest default is that Webster is not, actually, that talented (by NBA standards). Yes, he can sometimes play extremely well. Almost every player who reaches the NBA can sometimes play very well. Every player has variance. The really talented ones have a mean performance level where the less talented ones are playing at their ceiling.

I think Webster is simply a mediocre talent, with high variance. Sometimes he looks great, sometimes he looks awful and his average is that of an unexceptional reserve. Why resort to psychological explanations? You may like the way he "looks" shooting the ball and like his athleticism, but that doesn't mean he's a good basketball player (again, by NBA standards).

 

[Rodolfo]

I can't understand how the guy's handles haven't improved over the years.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I'm not convinced Webster has psychological problems. That theory works from the default assumption that he's actually wonderfully talented but his emotional state holds him back. I think the simplest default is that Webster is not, actually, that talented (by NBA standards). Yes, he can sometimes play extremely well. Almost every player who reaches the NBA can sometimes play very well. Every player has variance. The really talented ones have a mean performance level where the less talented ones are playing at their ceiling.

I think Webster is simply a mediocre talent, with high variance. Sometimes he looks great, sometimes he looks awful and his average is that of an unexceptional reserve. Why resort to psychological explanations? You may like the way he "looks" shooting the ball and like his athleticism, but that doesn't mean he's a good basketball player (again, by NBA standards).

this.

the psychological problem excuse is a common blazer fan fallacy.

If we can get spurts of good defense and 3 point shooting from him in a reserve role, that should be sufficient for us if Batum can really be what everyone expects him to be (which may also be a bit unrealistic). But if Batum is as wonderful as everyone says, Webster developing into a multi-dimensional player really isn't that important....

"but what if Batum gets injured and Webster has to step up?".

Well, Batum did get injured and Webster did step up nicely.

The fact is NONE of the Blazers are playing well right now. Martell is just playing crappier the last 4-5 games.