Merged: Who would you give up for Paul George? (1 Viewer)

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Well, we can't have him without offering CJ though. Even if it's a one-year rental, Indiana would probably rather have him for that year than trade him for bad contracts (which is everybody on our team bar Lillard, CJ, Nurkic, Vonleh and maybe Harkless) or mid and late first round picks.
 
chzbrgr said:
shoot give them all three this year and our 2019 and take back any horrible contract they want.

AC hark Bazz vonleh +4 firsts? still probably taking 80 cents on the dollar from indiana's stand point
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Anyone that takes George in a trade probably will have to take Jefferson or Ellis back as well.
 
George has pretty much made it clear he doesn't want to be there long term and him and his agent have made it clear his preference is LA. Doesn't mean we can't trade for him, I think we have the assets to do it since he wants out.
 
chzbrgr said:
shoot give them all three this year and our 2019 and take back any horrible contract they want.

AC hark Bazz vonleh +4 firsts? still probably taking 80 cents on the dollar from indiana's stand point
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Neither team should want to do that, I would say us even more so. Four first round picks is a lot to give for a player who will likely only spend a year with you (and even with him you are still not likely to win championship). And who is playing rotation for us? That move leaves us with Aminu, Turner and Davis and zero picks this year. That's very thin.
 
A lot of time it's coaching plus roster that can interest a guy who's stuck on a middle level team. I can see PG loving it in Portland...Stotts is a players coach and he'll get George a lot of shots
 
Sarni said:
Neither team should want to do that, I would say us even more so. Four first round picks is a lot to give for a player who will likely only spend a year with you (and even with him you are still not likely to win championship). And who is playing rotation for us? That move leaves us with Aminu, Turner and Davis and zero picks this year. That's very thin.
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Im just trying to make a package that's realistic even if it leaves you with a bunch of patty c minutes you have to do it from the blazers stand point. if adding paul george for spare parts and picks doesnt make us a top 3 team in the west then nothing will. Then if that's the case dame or cj has to go for like jimmy butler cause youre essentially saying there is no way with those two on the roster. You have to make the bet that winning will make PG stay. Waiting three more years on some first rounders just isnt realistic given our time frame.

dame/FA
cj/patty
george/turner
aminu/davis
nurk

I'd give that team a 40% chance to beat the warriors in a 7 game series which is about the odds id give SA or CLE
 
chzbrgr said:
Im just trying to make a package that's realistic even if it leaves you with a bunch of patty c minutes you have to do it from the blazers stand point. if adding paul george for spare parts and picks doesnt make us a top 3 team in the west then nothing will. Then if that's the case dame or cj has to go for like jimmy butler cause youre essentially saying there is no way with those two on the roster. You have to make the bet that winning will make PG stay. Waiting three more years on some first rounders just isnt realistic given our time frame.

dame/FA
cj/patty
george/turner
aminu/davis
nurk

I'd give that team a 40% chance to beat the warriors in a 7 game series which is about the odds id give SA or CLE
Click to expand...

I feel second unit would get destroyed. Actually our time frame is more convenient for waiting 2-3 more years. I don't see how Warriors will keep this team together in 3 years, CJ and Lillard will still be before 30 , Nurkic and Vonleh will be in their prime or just get significantly better. This roster is not built to win now and one trade, even for George or Butler, will not change that because of how tough it is to beat current top teams.
 
Sarni said:
I feel second unit would get destroyed. Actually our time frame is more convenient for waiting 2-3 more years. I don't see how Warriors will keep this team together in 3 years, CJ and Lillard will still be before 30 , Nurkic and Vonleh will be in their prime or just get significantly better. This roster is not built to win now and one trade, even for George or Butler, will not change that because of how tough it is to beat current top teams.
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I agree with what you said, but with the main complaint being about our role players if you haven't won with the within 2-3 years then you look at swapping them out anyways. Therefor I feel like if you can get George for a package of picks and players like aminu/Crabbe/harkless then it is worth a shot as you are basically take your eggs out of their baskets and putting them in the PG basket.
 
Only trade for PG13 if you're getting rid of bad contracts.

If they want all 3 picks, Turner, Meyers, and Crabbe for PG, then yes, because you can create more cap space to sign someone decent. However, Indy won't do that.
 
CJ knows that it would be pointless for us to trade for Paul George if he is included in the deal. It would have to be for Vonleh and picks and anyone else they want not named Dame/Nurk
 
I think PG is unrealistic if we have to trade for him, can't see him coming as a FA either (and don't think we'd have the money).
With that said, there are other options to pursue that are more realistic. I would probably get criticised for saying this but I wouldn't mind rolling the dice on Carmelo Anthony.
With all his faults (he isn't much of a defender which isn't ideal next to Dame and CJ and his time in NY certainly raises questions about his desire and motivation but this is what could make him available) I think if he accepts a trade he could maybe find a renewed interest in actually winning some games and to not be remembered as a complete waste of talent.
I can't guarantee that being traded to Portland would rejuvenate his career but I think it could happen. It's certainly a gamble cause Melo could also infect the other players with his apathy but if he can be the player he was in Denver, with Dame, CJ, Nurkic alongside him, it can payoff big time
 
OK, guys, let's think about this a bit.

If PG comes here he's playing the 3, just about exclusively. Dame and Nurk aren't going anywhere, b/c there's almost literally no way you can replace those 2 on the roster with our available assets, even if you wanted to. So that leaves the other wings (CJ, Turner, Crabbe) as the obvious building blocks of the trade. You can't have 4 wings making over 18M apiece. And, as stated above, you still haven't accounted for Aminu and Mo, who are 3's who can play smallball 4. That's almost 100M in just your 6 wing players. (more to the point, that's 80M for the other 58mpg at the wings that PG isn't going to play, plus whatever smallball 4 you can pull off)

But let's just say that you picked one of those 3 as your building block and needed to add "goodies". Let's just say that IND accepts Vonleh as a goodie. Now we're back where we're counting on Davis/Hark/Aminu to play the 4 for 48mpg. And you still don't have a backup for Nurk outside of Leonard. But since you probably traded some serious draft capital for PG, you don't have cheap guys to develop.

The way the roster is currently constructed requires a couple of things to make a serious leap. 1) clearing up the expensive SG logjam. In order I'd probably send away Turner, then Crabbe, then CJ. But I'm pretty sure their values to other teams are opposite of that. 2) adding in "pipeline" talent. You can pay stars if you have useful 5-10 roster spots on cheap contracts. Since vet mins generally don't come here, that leaves draft picks and young Undrafted Free Agents. 3) Health (duh.) 4) More defensive-skilled players. Whoever brought up the part about bringing in guys with long arms, short necks, intuitive rebounders, etc was close to the mark. Similarly to how some baseball analytics gurus have started pegging metadata like spin rate for targeting undervalued talent, grabbing guys with physical tangibles that help out their innate defensive mindset would be useful pieces to plug in around Dame and Nurk. 6) An increased level of accountability and attitude adjustment.

There will likely be a part 2 to this, but I gotta do some work first.
 
Blazer4ever said:
I think PG is unrealistic if we have to trade for him, can't see him coming as a FA either (and don't think we'd have the money).
With that said, there are other options to pursue that are more realistic. I would probably get criticised for saying this but I wouldn't mind rolling the dice on Carmelo Anthony.
With all his faults (he isn't much of a defender which isn't ideal next to Dame and CJ and his time in NY certainly raises questions about his desire and motivation but this is what could make him available) I think if he accepts a trade he could maybe find a renewed interest in actually winning some games and to not be remembered as a complete waste of talent.
I can't guarantee that being traded to Portland would rejuvenate his career but I think it could happen. It's certainly a gamble cause Melo could also infect the other players with his apathy but if he can be the player he was in Denver, with Dame, CJ, Nurkic alongside him, it can payoff big time
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you would be betting the farm not on 2007 Melo, but the 2012 Olympic Melo. And I don't know that a) that Melo still exists and b) Dame , Nurk and Cj (if still around) will make him think he's playing with LBJ, Wade and Boogie.
 
If Lakers get their pick this year it means they lose the one in 2018 and have zero reason to tank next season. They could try to get George for a package including one of Ingram, Russell or Randle plus a future first rounder (would have to be 2020 though which is not really valuable). Then again Lakers would actually be able to re-sign him.
 
So the options this board wants is to pursue is an old washed up Carmelo and a dude who will surely leave us after a year? Oh brother.
 
BrianFromWA said:
you would be betting the farm not on 2007 Melo, but the 2012 Olympic Melo. And I don't know that a) that Melo still exists and b) Dame , Nurk and Cj (if still around) will make him think he's playing with LBJ, Wade and Boogie.
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I think a change of scenery could do him good. I thought of typing "would" and changed it to "could" so it is as I said, a gamble.
I think there's no doubt his time with the Knicks is/was a big disappointment but I think it is possible that with another team in another city he could regain at least some of his fire and respectability
 
BrianFromWA said:
you would be betting the farm not on 2007 Melo, but the 2012 Olympic Melo. And I don't know that a) that Melo still exists and b) Dame , Nurk and Cj (if still around) will make him think he's playing with LBJ, Wade and Boogie.
Click to expand...

Also, I think the gamble is not on who we'd have to trade because I think the Knicks would take our 2nd level players and even our high-priced role-players for him, I think they really want him out.
The question is what his impact on the team would be because if he wants to still be the man and doesn't become more of a team player and conform to a team concept his impact could be negative
 
BrianFromWA said:
OK, guys, let's think about this a bit.

If PG comes here he's playing the 3, just about exclusively. Dame and Nurk aren't going anywhere, b/c there's almost literally no way you can replace those 2 on the roster with our available assets, even if you wanted to. So that leaves the other wings (CJ, Turner, Crabbe) as the obvious building blocks of the trade. You can't have 4 wings making over 18M apiece. And, as stated above, you still haven't accounted for Aminu and Mo, who are 3's who can play smallball 4. That's almost 100M in just your 6 wing players. (more to the point, that's 80M for the other 58mpg at the wings that PG isn't going to play, plus whatever smallball 4 you can pull off)

But let's just say that you picked one of those 3 as your building block and needed to add "goodies". Let's just say that IND accepts Vonleh as a goodie. Now we're back where we're counting on Davis/Hark/Aminu to play the 4 for 48mpg. And you still don't have a backup for Nurk outside of Leonard. But since you probably traded some serious draft capital for PG, you don't have cheap guys to develop.

The way the roster is currently constructed requires a couple of things to make a serious leap. 1) clearing up the expensive SG logjam. In order I'd probably send away Turner, then Crabbe, then CJ. But I'm pretty sure their values to other teams are opposite of that. 2) adding in "pipeline" talent. You can pay stars if you have useful 5-10 roster spots on cheap contracts. Since vet mins generally don't come here, that leaves draft picks and young Undrafted Free Agents. 3) Health (duh.) 4) More defensive-skilled players. Whoever brought up the part about bringing in guys with long arms, short necks, intuitive rebounders, etc was close to the mark. Similarly to how some baseball analytics gurus have started pegging metadata like spin rate for targeting undervalued talent, grabbing guys with physical tangibles that help out their innate defensive mindset would be useful pieces to plug in around Dame and Nurk. 6) An increased level of accountability and attitude adjustment.

There will likely be a part 2 to this, but I gotta do some work first.
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Boom! Exactly right!

To go on a tangent to some of what you wrote, trading either Harkless or Vonleh puts us in a very tricky situation, unless they are being traded for their replacement. Shipping either out without receiving a corresponding starting SF/PF puts us in the position of having to play Aminu, which will negate much of what we gained in the trade.

Any trades utilizing our draft picks need to be built around Turner/Crabbe/Aminu/Davis, which means we either need to find a stupid GM with a good player, or we're just not going to get a very good player back in the trade. Which means we should just use our draft picks, or trade some for future draft picks.
 
Fez Von Savage said:
br-who-says-no-yes-we-know-trades-are-more-15611529.png
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Damian Lillard
 
BigGameDamian said:
I know CJ wants PG to join him and Dame in Portland. Get ready to cream your shorts!
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Well if that's what CJ wants, there is no doubt PG will demand that it happens.

Shorts creamed!
 
I'll propose Crabbe, Harkless, Vonleh and Napier, all really young except for Crabbe and he's not that old. Back comes PG, Jefferson and Ellis. Jefferson and Ellis are 31 and 32 with two years left on their contracts. We give them out 3 picks or else 2 this year and one next year.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=lhnral8
 
BonesJones said:
So the options this board wants is to pursue is an old washed up Carmelo and a dude who will surely leave us after a year? Oh brother.
Click to expand...
I don't like Carmelo, and for sure George would be a gamble that he'd want to re-sign here, but this idea that this team can't (or shouldn't) take big risks to dramatically improve is an illusion. What are they risking? Right now they are about 2 tiers below the conference elite Warriors (even with Nurkic). All they risk is going from a middling treadmill team with a bloated salary, to a lottery team (with a bloated salary) if George decided to bolt; the Blazers would certainly be worse off in the wins-losses column, but at least they'd shed 20 million a year in guaranteed money (assuming CJ is the player being swapped) that threatens to put them into the repeat offender category of teams over the cap.

George is a talent worth pursuing because he has the talent to make a difference -- a player who can actually defend on the wing and be legit number 1 or 2 scoring threat. Without that kind of trade, the Blazers are no threat to the Warriors.
 
HolyBackboard said:
Neil is not trading Dame or CJ. If it wasn't clear before Tuesday's press conference, it is now!

If we get PG13, Melo, or whoever, they will be coming here to play with Dame, CJ, and Nurk.
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You can't afford to pay PG, CJ, Damian and Nurkic. Pick three. Also, nevermind the fact, that Indy is going to have richer trade offers than we can give them if we refuse to consider CJ, or Damian in the package.
 
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