MM's all important summer league game 1 grades

[OregonHuskerMan]

Yeah - I think they're miked up or something.

Doesn't make sense to me. Mike and Mike are in the studio - so they have 4 mic's? One on each anchor, and then 2 on the hoops/in the gym that all relay at the same time?

 

[Ed O]

And Novak got benched in the playoffs.

And then the Knicks re-signed him for $15m over four years. So what?

and Ryan Anderson is superior to Babbitt, also Ryan Anderson isn't a trap door on defense. He doesn't get absolutely manhandled by shitty players. He actually does decently against PF's.

Babbitt "gets manhandled by shitty players"? Where?

I think that's pretty much purely your opinion. Which is OK, but I don't think that you're right.

All Babbitt has to do is be something close to average defensively, and I think with his rebounding capabilities he's not that far away.

Ed O.

 

[Ed O]

Doesn't make sense to me. Mike and Mike are in the studio - so they have 4 mic's? One on each anchor, and then 2 on the hoops/in the gym that all relay at the same time?

The game was being broadcast on NBATV, and presumably they had ambient sounds captured. Whether it was floor level or at the hoop level (or both) there were definitely sounds from the game in addition to the sounds from the studio.

I would think that HCP could talk to this most intelligently.

Ed O.

 

[Nikolokolus]

OregonHuskerMan I really have no idea where you're getting the CP3 comparison ... that doesn't mean he looked bad (he looked great in the second half particularly) but slow your roll.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

And then the Knicks re-signed him for $15m over four years. So what?

Babbitt "gets manhandled by shitty players"? Where?

I think that's pretty much purely your opinion. Which is OK, but I don't think that you're right.

All Babbitt has to do is be something close to average defensively, and I think with his rebounding capabilities he's not that far away.

Ed O.

So many easy buckets the Hornets got last night were because of Babbitt. Babbitt can't guard even shitty players and he'll never be something close to average defensively.

 

[OregonHuskerMan]

OregonHuskerMan I really have no idea where you're getting the CP3 comparison ... that doesn't mean he looked bad (he looked great in the second half particularly) but slow your roll.

I'm not saying he is CP3 or that he is even close to being as good as him. But the way he plays reminds me of CP3. Looked to get people involved, played at his pace, had the defense collapse on him, kicked it out, made good decisions. Mixes up his paces, knows when to slow it down, has moves to get by you, and can score when he needs to.

 

[Nikolokolus]

I disagree with the stylistic comparison. Paul is a sublime passer and has really never been a "drive and kick" point guard. If you want to compare him to a past or present player that's your prerogative, but like I said I just don't see Paul's game in him ... if you insist on making a comparison I could see a Porter or Chauncey argument.

 

[OregonHuskerMan]

And then the Knicks re-signed him for $15m over four years. So what?

Babbitt "gets manhandled by shitty players"? Where?

I think that's pretty much purely your opinion. Which is OK, but I don't think that you're right.

All Babbitt has to do is be something close to average defensively, and I think with his rebounding capabilities he's not that far away.

Ed O.

So a little less than 4 mill a year, because he can shoot 3s, knows his role, and isn't a complete shit hole on D.

Those 2 players also have two of the best centers (defensively) in the game to cover up their mistakes, which Babbitt does not have that luxury. Those 2 also play within their means and don't try to take people off the dribble and stumble around and lose the ball.

Did you not watch SL last night? Lance Thomas abused him (who is far from an offensive juggernaut), among other random people of whom I don't even know the names of. Honestly, if he just sat in the corner and shot 3s and could stay in front of his man on D, I'd be perfectly ok with him as a backup SF/PF whatever the fuck you want to call him, but even the most basic moves completely flabbergast him defensively. Unfortunately for Babbitt, PF/SF is one of the more stacked positions in the NBA. And when he is scouted properly, people won't leave him and he'll be good for a few points a game, a few fouls and some horrible D. Unless he improves his D, I can't justify him being on the court for more than about 5 minutes if a team goes zone.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

The game was being broadcast on NBATV, and presumably they had ambient sounds captured. Whether it was floor level or at the hoop level (or both) there were definitely sounds from the game in addition to the sounds from the studio.

I would think that HCP could talk to this most intelligently.

Ed O.

Well, he can certainly talk the most.... Intelligently? Debatable.

 

[Ed O]

Did you not watch SL last night? Lance Thomas abused him (who is far from an offensive juggernaut), among other random people of whom I don't even know the names of.

I did see the game, yes. I recorded it, too, but have only watched it once so far.

Thomas "abused" him to the tune of 12 points in 33 minutes (on 3 of 7 shooting). I can live with that kind of abuse, for sure.

Bowles had a big game, but he was playing the 5 for most of it as far as I could tell.

Ed O.

 

[OregonHuskerMan]

I disagree with the stylistic comparison. Paul is a sublime passer and has really never been a "drive and kick" point guard. If you want to compare him to a past or present player that's your prerogative, but like I said I just don't see Paul's game in him ... if you insist on making a comparison I could see a Porter or Chauncey argument.

Layup, layup, layup, layup, PnR point guard.



Alley oop (off the PnR)



Layups, shooting, PnR...

Body size, pace, demeanor. Obviously Lillard isn't the passer CP3 is, but I think they are incredibly similar. Both love the PnR.

 

[OregonHuskerMan]

I did see the game, yes. I recorded it, too, but have only watched it once so far.

Thomas "abused" him to the tune of 12 points in 33 minutes (on 3 of 7 shooting). I can live with that kind of abuse, for sure.

Bowles had a big game, but he was playing the 5 for most of it as far as I could tell.

Ed O.

Lance probably had double digit rebounds as well - and I remember Bryant-Amaning and Bowles both getting buckets on Babbitt, or being fouled by him. Or Babbitt allowing his man to cut (to get fouled), or being slow on the rotation, or not stopping Xavier Henry. (And lets not forget, the refs were atrocious - everyone probably had a couple more fouls than they were really called for, specifically Xavier got DECKED by Meyers/Babbitt for a no call).

 

[Ed O]

Lance probably had double digit rebounds as well - and I remember Bryant-Amaning and Bowles both getting buckets on Babbitt, or being fouled by him. Or Babbitt allowing his man to cut (to get fouled), or being slow on the rotation, or not stopping Xavier Henry. (And lets not forget, the refs were atrocious - everyone probably had a couple more fouls than they were really called for, specifically Xavier got DECKED by Meyers/Babbitt for a no call).

Do you think that giving up 12 points in 33 minutes is getting abused?

Ed O.

 

[PapaG]

I don't really recall anyone berating him. But people do make fun of him. Boo-fucking-hoo.

Well OK then. Just don't get pissy when people get called out for ripping a guy who actually has proven to have a valued NBA skill solely because he doesn't have the all-around game of LeBron James.

Then again, plenty of people here still rip on LMA because he's not Tim Duncan in terms of all-around game.

I guess I'm just learning to accept the limitations of players and try to emphasize their strengths (which is what good coaches do, for the most part), since if every player in the NBA was LeBron James, then LeBron James wouldn't be a special player. Mocking Babbitt because he's not Scottie Pippen-esque says more to me about the NBA knowledge of that particular fan than it tells me about Luke Babbitt's game.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

Do you think that giving up 12 points in 33 minutes is getting abused?

Ed O.

He gave up more than 12 points. A lot of wide open dunks by other players were his fault. He is terrible at rotating defensively when guys help off their man.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

Well OK then. Just don't get pissy when people get called out for ripping a guy who actually has proven to have a valued NBA skill solely because he doesn't have the all-around game of LeBron James.

Then again, plenty of people here still rip on LMA because he's not Tim Duncan in terms of all-around game.

I guess I'm just learning to accept the limitations of players and try to emphasize their strengths (which is what good coaches do, for the most part), since if every player in the NBA was LeBron James, then LeBron James wouldn't be a special player. Mocking Babbitt because he's not Scottie Pippen-esque says more to me about the NBA knowledge of that particular fan than it tells me about Luke Babbitt's game.

Where was anyone ever saying he should be LeBron James or be Pippen-esque?

 

[OregonHuskerMan]

To Lance Thomas, who has no offensive game whatsoever? Yeah, I'd consider that abused. Also - his defense probably gave up more than that. I remember Bowles getting a FT rebound over him for instance. I also remember a couple of Meyers fouls being a direct result of Babbitt playing atrocious D. Xavier Henry got to the FT line at least once directly because of Babbitt, same can be said of Bryant-Amaning. Also, he bit on the awful 18 foot pump fake and fouled some guy. He didn't properly stop the ball, nor did he properly stay in front of his man. I can't believe you're defending his defense.

 

[PapaG]

Same as a lot of guys. When Nate was fired, players played freely and with confidence, knowing that mistakes were acceptable.

...and then they went 8-15 while losing 7 games by at least 12 points.

 

[PapaG]

He gave up more than 12 points. A lot of wide open dunks by other players were his fault. He is terrible at rotating defensively when guys help off their man.

He ended up at +14 for the game.

Apparently his horrific defense didn't hurt his team while he was on the court last night.

 

[magnifier661]

...and then they went 8-15 while losing 7 games by at least 12 points.

Well in all fairness Canales was propelled into head coaching on a shortened season, without any significant practices. Also, E Will got injured and Crawful and Failton aren't on this team any longer.

 

[PapaG]

So many easy buckets the Hornets got last night were because of Babbitt. Babbitt can't guard even shitty players and he'll never be something close to average defensively.

So what? He wasn't drafted for his defense.

 

[OregonHuskerMan]

Where was anyone ever saying he should be LeBron James or be Pippen-esque?

I'd be perfectly fine if he had 1 great skill (3 pt shooting) and an even slightly below average skill in defense.It's not like I'm asking for him to be on the all defensive team.

 

[PapaG]

Well in all fairness Canales was propelled into head coaching on a shortened season, without any significant practices. Also, E Will got injured and Crawful and Failton aren't on this team any longer.

I'm just saying that playing loose didn't exactly translate into wins.

I'm 100% opposed to Canales as the head coach for next year, btw. A team this young needs somebody who has been around the league for a while, if not as a head coach, then as a lead assistant in a winning organization.

 

[PapaG]

Where was anyone ever saying he should be LeBron James or be Pippen-esque?

I meant in terms of all-around game and being multi-faceted instead of just a one or two-tool player.

Seems odd to me to bash a guy who was drafted as a shooter for not being good on defense. Unfair, almost.

 

[OregonHuskerMan]

He ended up at +14 for the game.

Apparently his horrific defense didn't hurt his team while he was on the court last night.

Or it's because Austin Rivers slowly tried to start doing way too much (reverted to his scoring ways) and single handedly dropped NOH shooting percentage from like 50%+ to low 40's (I believe is what they said at the end of the game). Or because NOH didn't have a true PG to run an offense.

Meyers Leonard was a -3, wasn't he? No way we win without him... +/- is a flawed statistic.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

I meant in terms of all-around game and being multi-faceted instead of just a one or two-tool player.

Seems odd to me to bash a guy who was drafted as a shooter for not being good on defense. Unfair, almost.

I am not of the opinion that he was drafted only to be able to shoot threes.

 

[Ed O]

To Lance Thomas, who has no offensive game whatsoever? Yeah, I'd consider that abused. Also - his defense probably gave up more than that. I remember Bowles getting a FT rebound over him for instance. I also remember a couple of Meyers fouls being a direct result of Babbitt playing atrocious D. Xavier Henry got to the FT line at least once directly because of Babbitt, same can be said of Bryant-Amaning. Also, he bit on the awful 18 foot pump fake and fouled some guy. He didn't properly stop the ball, nor did he properly stay in front of his man. I can't believe you're defending his defense.

I can't believe that you're going by memory. How many times have you watched the game?

I think that giving up 12 points in 33 minutes is not being abused. I also think you're dramatically understating Thomas's capabilities. He scored in double digits several times as a rookie, including 18 points against the Nuggets, last year. He's not a great player--offensively or otherwise--but he's not a scrub, either, who hasn't sniffed the NBA.

Babbitt's not a good defender, but I can't help but defend him against accusations of him getting "manhandled by shitty players" and after I find your supporting evidence to be so flimsy for such an assertion.

Ed O.

 

[OregonHuskerMan]

You don't draft someone in the mid teens to just 3's. You draft someone like that in the 20's, I.E. John Jenkins, in my opinion.

 

[magnifier661]

I'm just saying that playing loose didn't exactly translate into wins.

I'm 100% opposed to Canales as the head coach for next year, btw. A team this young needs somebody who has been around the league for a while, if not as a head coach, then as a lead assistant in a winning organization.

I agree with you buddy. I just wanted to put all the cards on the table.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

You don't draft someone in the mid teens to just 3's. You draft someone like that in the 20's, I.E. John Jenkins, in my opinion.

And Jenkins is much more dynamic than Babbitt already as well.