Nets close to acquiring Keyon Dooling.

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The New Jersey Nets acquired guard Keyon Dooling from the Orlando Magic for cash considerations, pending league approval, according to sources.

Dooling will receive a three-year deal, averaging about $3 million per year. Only the first two years are guaranteed.

Stephen A. Smith is a columnist for ESPN.com and ESPN The Magazine.

Its official.

Dooling isnt even a legit PG.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kievitt @ Jul 20 2008, 05:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Would have preferred just drafting Bayless over Lopez.</div>

The biggest (only?) misstep of the offseason.

I agree they needed a low post scorer, but I have strong doubts that Lopez will be good enough at that to justify passing up a star like Bayless.

I like all the other moves, so I'm willing to live with that one.

Hopefully Lopez comes through and it makes everyone else better.
 
Exactly ghoti, I love the offseason so far, but I think Bayless would have made it perfect. He's going to be a special player. Could have still drafted a low post scorer in Darrel Arthur at 21 while passing on Brook at 10.
 
I dunno what all the bye bye Marcus fuss is about. Dooling seems to be an injury stopgap, a vetern roleplayer who adds depth and stability at 2 positions. He can spell Devin in ways that Marcus can't. So it would seem that Marcus will have to earn his way into the rotation as a playmaker, not a Starbury. Plus, I don't think his value is all that high anyhow.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jerkstore @ Jul 20 2008, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I dunno what all the bye bye Marcus fuss is about. Dooling seems to be an injury stopgap, a vetern roleplayer who adds depth and stability at 2 positions. He can spell Devin in ways that Marcus can't. So it would seem that Marcus will have to earn his way into the rotation as a playmaker, not a Starbury. Plus, I don't think his value is all that high anyhow.</div>

At the beginning of his rookie season, Marcus was a pure playmaker and he was very exciting.

After that, though, he has been thoroughly terrible in just about every possible way.

I agree he has no value. I still prefer he not be around all the new/young players.

I know what it's like to be undermined by an employee, and he is just the kind of whiny asshat that will bring everybody down and throw a wrench in what appears to be great new chemistry.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jul 20 2008, 04:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jerkstore @ Jul 20 2008, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I dunno what all the bye bye Marcus fuss is about. Dooling seems to be an injury stopgap, a vetern roleplayer who adds depth and stability at 2 positions. He can spell Devin in ways that Marcus can't. So it would seem that Marcus will have to earn his way into the rotation as a playmaker, not a Starbury. Plus, I don't think his value is all that high anyhow.</div>

At the beginning of his rookie season, Marcus was a pure playmaker and he was very exciting.

After that, though, he has been thoroughly terrible in just about every possible way.

I agree he has no value. I still prefer he not be around all the new/young players.

I know what it's like to be undermined by an employee, and he is just the kind of whiny asshat that will bring everybody down and throw a wrench in what appears to be great new chemistry.
</div>

I don't get how you and others are so sure that he's "whiny" or that he's complained. Do you have reliable "inside" sources telling you that? Cause I can't recall ANYTHING to that effect being reported by the major beat writers at any time.

They've reported he's out of shape at times. They've reported that Frank and others want him to show more emotion when he plays (why I have no friggin' clue since it's clearly just not his nature). They've reported that the brass has serious doubts about his ability to defend and recapture the early confidence he showed. But please point me to a specific, reliable reference for the notion that he is whiny or a trouble maker.

I, for one, hope he stays another year. He had major injury problems to begin last season which put his conditioning way behind where it needed to be when he did start playing. To boot, his "mentor" was the real frickin asshat and major team cancer while a new, young PG was brought in and handed the team reins, giving Marcus a new position to adjust to psychologically. So, yes, Marcus had a disappointing sophmore year, due partly to factors beyond his control and partly to some major team changes. He still had a few games where he was absolutely brilliant offensively, enough to make it foolish to trade him this year when he's so cheap, when he is the ONLY distributing PG option behind Harris, and when, at 22, he's just entering his 3rd season, a time when most PGs are only beginning to really "get" that position. As long as he's doing what the coaches ask this offseason (and he certainly appears to be) and is comporting himself professionally in other ways, it's not smart to trade him right now unless you know you can acquire another PG prospect with at least as much talent, and that's highly unlikely.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FOMW @ Jul 20 2008, 08:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jul 20 2008, 04:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jerkstore @ Jul 20 2008, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I dunno what all the bye bye Marcus fuss is about. Dooling seems to be an injury stopgap, a vetern roleplayer who adds depth and stability at 2 positions. He can spell Devin in ways that Marcus can't. So it would seem that Marcus will have to earn his way into the rotation as a playmaker, not a Starbury. Plus, I don't think his value is all that high anyhow.</div>

At the beginning of his rookie season, Marcus was a pure playmaker and he was very exciting.

After that, though, he has been thoroughly terrible in just about every possible way.

I agree he has no value. I still prefer he not be around all the new/young players.

I know what it's like to be undermined by an employee, and he is just the kind of whiny asshat that will bring everybody down and throw a wrench in what appears to be great new chemistry.
</div>

I don't get how you and others are so sure that he's "whiny" or that he's complained. Do you have reliable "inside" sources telling you that? Cause I can't recall ANYTHING to that effect being reported by the major beat writers at any time.

</div>

I find it hilarious.

The guy doesn't show emotion. So what? The guy doesn't scream and yell like a lunatic. So what? The guy doesn't pat his teammates on their ass. So what? The only fault he has is the fact that he doesn't play defense. Half the players in the NBA don't play defense. He is a 22 year old kid. Chauncey Billups didn't get "it" until he went to Detroit. Steve Nash didn't get "it" until he went to Phoenix. If you want to trash a 22 year old kid just to make yourself look bigger, go right ahead. I would personally rather root for him and hope he turns into the player I think he can become.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ak30 @ Jul 20 2008, 08:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>The only fault he has is the fact that he doesn't play defense.</div>

That's a pretty big fault. Especially with our coach, and the type of team we're trying to put together for that coach.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Jul 20 2008, 07:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ak30 @ Jul 20 2008, 08:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>The only fault he has is the fact that he doesn't play defense.</div>

That's a pretty big fault. Especially with our coach, and the type of team we're trying to put together for that coach.
</div>

Well I think at first he lacked the defensive know how, and the drive, I think he lacked the footspeed in the second season. With a little luck, maybe he could become a mediocre defender this year.
 
You have your opinion and I have mine.

1. He has been one of the most inconsistent and often worst players in the league during his two seasons here. He's gotten far more court time than he's earned to this point.

2. I have watched him and I believe him to be a cancer with a terrible, pouting, selfish attitude who blames others for his own failures.

If you don't feel that way, good for you. I'd prefer he were someone else's problem, and it appears the Nets feel the same way.
 
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ak30 @ Jul 20 2008, 08:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I would personally rather root for him and hope he turns into the player I think he can become.</div>

I'm trying to root for this dude.

Give me some reasons, because all I've seen so far is a heaping helping of suckage.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jul 20 2008, 11:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value=""></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object></div>



wow i took a while for me to figure what was going on but i never realized that he was that bad of a asshole
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jul 20 2008, 11:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'></div>

I prefer this one:

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It's definitely my favorite Nets youtube video.
 
There was another one where he had a great series of plays and Frank came off the bench to give him some encouragement and Marcus just walked right by him like he wasn't there.
 
The Nets have definitely been the most active team this year, signing so many different players.
 
I'm no Dooling expert, but from what I hear and have seen he sounds like a Devin Harris version of a shooting guard (still without much range). Fast as hell, great in transition, pretty athletic, decent midrange J, and tenacious on D.

Sounds like he has a tendency to play a little to fast to the point that his decision making gets a little cloudy- isn't that what harris what criticized of in his early years in Dallas? Not saying that Dooling is any Harris (or ever going to be), but imagine how much potential there is for a ridiculous fast break when Harris and Dooling are on the court together. only if there was someone else who could run with them..like the Kenyon of old (good times).

Fastest guards in the league (add to this list if I'm missing someone):
-harris
-leandro
-TJ ford
-Iverson
-tony parker
-boykins
-chris paul
-dooling
 
Notice in the youtube clip that Marcus gives and accepts a very muted "low 5" from Boone after the play. Then RJ comes charging in like a ram to chest butt him, and Marcus wanted no part of it. If the clip had continued past the point where Carter comes over, you'd have seen that Marcus was amused when he turned around, presumably after explaining himself to Carter. Since he's had to publicly defend the fact that he's just not a "rah, rah" guy prone to thumping his chest after every decent play, I suspect that he was light-heartedly expressing his individuality in that moment, letting his older teammates know that he doesn't think an "and 1" in the middle of a regular season Hawks game is a pinnacle achievement worth risking cracked ribs over. I actually think it showed a refreshing bit of autonomy and willingness for him to be his own person and not to have to conform to idiotic standards of what it means to be "intense" about the game.

I watched Larry Bird his entire career, and I can count on one hand the number of times he ever did more than offer a "5" to a teammate with "matter of fact" demeanor. Ditto for Robert Parish, Reggie Lewis, and practically every other player on those Celtics teams up through the mid 90s. Of course this orgy of self-congratulations that is on display in every NBA game nowadays is a relatively modern phenomenon, and Marcus is, in this and other respects, a true "throwback". There's nothing inherently wrong with that. He should not have to have his square personality force fed into a round hole any more than a chest thumper like Garnett should be expected to adopt the on-court demeanor of John Stockton or any more than Vince Carter should be forced to get tatoos.

ghoti, you aren't present at Nets practices. You aren't in their locker room. You aren't in their huddles. You have no clue as to the nature of the personal exchanges between the players in the myriad hours they spend together in hotels, restaurants, planes, and other places, and you are afforded only a visual glimpse at their interactions in actual games (and then only what cameras reveal to you.) You are taking one or two oncourt interractions, which unambiguously only prove that Williams isn't excitable on the court, and are attempting to make sweeping character assessments of him in areas that have no logical connection to those behaviors or predilections. How on earth can you say that because he eschews a chest bump that he "blames others for his failures"???? Why does being low key have to mean that he is "selfish and pouting" instead of that he is simply not comfortable with ostentatious emotion? Based on what we can see of games over television, has he ever isolated himself on the bench (as many players have done) when he's been removed from the game? (No.) Has he ever ignored his coaches when they've been presumably conveying something to him about the actual game? (No.) Does he make eye contact with them and appear to listen when they are talking to him? (Yes.) Has he ever been in anyone's face in a game or on the bench? (No.) Does he offer and accept low-key 5s to players returning to the bench or when he returns there himself? (Yes.)

He's not your kind of guy, obviously, and that's fine. But you are grossly overreaching when you draw character conclusions such as you've drawn based on the scant evidence before you.

I won't spend time on the patently absurd notion that he has often been one of the leagues' worst players the past two years. You need to watch more games if you think that's the case.

And, finally, nothing in in this article from today supports your position. Quite the opposite, in fact.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FOMW @ Jul 21 2008, 12:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>ghoti, you aren't present at Nets practices. You aren't in their locker room. You aren't in their huddles. You have no clue as to the nature of the personal exchanges between the players in the myriad hours they spend together in hotels, restaurants, planes, and other places, and you are afforded only a visual glimpse at their interactions in actual games (and then only what cameras reveal to you.)</div>

Neither are you. I think he's a problem and you don't. Seems like we have about the same amount of information. Let's see what Frank and Thorn decide.

And LOL @ comparing him in any way to Larry Bird.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jul 21 2008, 11:54 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Neither are you. I think he's a problem and you don't. Seems like we have about the same amount of information. Let's see what Frank and Thorn decide.

And LOL @ comparing him in any way to Larry Bird.</div>

If they trade him tomorrow for a bag of chips, that won't necessarily mean that it's because they thought he was a "problem" in the way that you do. It might simply mean that they think his confidence is shot and that they believe he is unlikely to get it back while playing for the same coach (this, in fact, is what Dave D wrote when reading between the lines of something a Nets front office guy told him earlier this year).

Oh, and by the way. I know I'm not privy to the inside workings of the team. But then I'm not the one making bold assertions of fact about certain players or members of the organization.
 
look i kno everybody hates on marcus... but i really believe he can still be a solid nba player... lets see what he does this season
 
I'm surprised the offical announcment hasn't been made yet...unless NBA offices decided to take a 3 day weekend
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FOMW @ Jul 21 2008, 12:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Oh, and by the way. I know I'm not privy to the inside workings of the team. But then I'm not the one making bold assertions of fact about certain players or members of the organization.</div>

I only wrote about twenty times in "bold" black and white that it's my opinion. I believe I'm right, though.

And who does Marcus blame for his "lost confidence" (boo hoo)? Himself?
 
What I find hilarious is how much certain people are overlooking how big of a fan ghoti was of Marcus going into that draft. ghoti isn't someone that never gave the kid a chance.
 
marcus is a very skilled player but he does not fit frank's vision for the team...we have to build identity and get everyone to buy into it but marcus is just a bad defensive player with no intensity nor hustle in him...frank's requirements for a bench/young player at least...he would definitely flourish in the suns, warriors and raptors' system though...
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jirohkanzaki @ Jul 21 2008, 02:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>marcus is a very skilled player but he does not fit frank's vision for the team...we have to build identity and get everyone to buy into it but marcus is just a bad defensive player with no intensity nor hustle in him...frank's requirements for a bench/young player at least...he would definitely flourish in the suns, warriors and raptors' system though...</div>

Uptempo systems require hustle
 
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