No Comments on the "Dream Act" Passing the House last night?

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And do you think that's reasonable? What did your relatives gain by waiting over a decade? What did the US gain? What did anyone gain? Why is that not just a fucking stupid waste of time?

barfo

No. Its probably not reasonable. But its the way it is. Eventually, the paperwork gets processed. I have had 7 relatives who had just gotten approved and moved here this year legally from the Philippines. Not the entire family (some were too old, some were married). Other relatives moved to Canada, where it is likely easier to get citizenship. They wanted to live in the US, so they took the time and waited to go through the proper channels. Its an absolute slap in the face to anyone going through this process when someone from mexico/central america can just run across the border, live in America, make money, steal identities and remain here and be tolerated and largely ignored by the legal system.

The way I see it, every illegal immigrant that comes to the US hurts the chances of legal immigrants from entering this country. There is inevitable confusion of who is and isn't a legal resident. There are stolen social security numbers. The flood gates are open, and immigration control likely has to factor a number of immigrants who enter the country illegally as a function of limits on immigrants who go through the proper channels.
 
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Dems control the house, have 59 votes in the senate. Lame Duck.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101209/ap_on_go_co/us_immigration_students

Democrats delay action on young immigrants bill

WASHINGTON – The Senate moved Thursday to delay a politically charged showdown vote on legislation carving out a path to legal status for foreign-born youngsters brought to this country illegally, putting off but probably not preventing the measure's demise.
 
I don't think it's fair for someone who is in the country illegally to get federally subsidized scholarship money for college when there are millions of kids who have parents who pay taxes in this country but can't get a dime. I don't care if you're here illegally from Mexico, Asian, or Canada. I don't think it's fair that they're getting federal tax dollars to help pay for college.
 
Let me ask again. Why should tens of millions of Latinos move to the head of the line over hundreds of millions that would like to come here? Because they are willing to break our laws? Why?

Go Blazers
 
Let me ask again. Why should tens of millions of Latinos move to the head of the line over hundreds of millions that would like to come here? Because they are willing to break our laws? Why?

Go Blazers

Because they were kids when they came here and didn't have a choice.
 
So now they have the choice to go home, right?

Go Blazers

If they were kids when they came here, they probably consider this home.

barfo
 
Home is wherever barfo's grandmother is.
 
Once upon a time, Columbus (Re)"Discovered" a New World. Europeans fled their nations to this New World, to seek mostly religious freedom not afforded them in their home nations, or to exploit the natural wonders of this New World. European nations and corporations colonized the New World. When there were famines in Europe, the people came here to survive.

Africans were enslaved and imported to do the heavy lifting in the agricultural regions.

The Spanish came and slaughtered the native people they found here. The land that the native people lived on for millenia was taken from them through the establishment of courts and land deeds, and they were forced to migrate to lands chosen for them that weren't so easy to exploit. When they left the reservations and their culture conflicted with ours, we massacred them

Chinese were imported to build the rail roads and then we enacted immigration laws to prevent any more from coming here.

We drew arbitrary lines in the sand and called them borders, which is fine. But now that we're here, we want to keep out people who want to come here for the same reasons our ancestors came. We made it onto the boat, time to bring up the ladder behind us.

These "illegals" are american indians. They and their families have lived here, in California when it wasn't part of the USA, in Texas when it wasn't part of the USA, in Arizona when it wasn't part of the uSA. They've lived here all along.

So we legislate it so they're "illegal" and want to put them back on their reservations.

Sure, we did a lot of bad things along the way, but this is still a melting pot. Our society is the product of those African slaves and their "contributed" labor. It's the product of those Chinese who built those railroads that gave everyone such prosperity. It's the product of those Indians, if you consider Illinois is an Indian word (for Onion) and most of the streets there are Indian words and names, or here in California the towns are named El Cajon and streets have names like El Camino Real.

And this is now, when the whole world is supposed to be much more enlightened. In those days, wars were fought until the enemy was entirely killed to the last man, woman and child. Today we try to avoid collateral damage because our view has changed to care about peoples. We enter into treaties with nations of the world (Geneva Conventions) to (try to) assure we treat one another with some minimal and reasonably enlightened sort of dignity in time of war or conflict.

It is an international crime against humanity to force the mass migration of people, so we're not going to be forcing 10M+ indigenous people to move out.

The constitution gives the govt. the power to regulate CITIZENSHIP. I don't see the point in refusing people citizenship who want it, or restricting the number for whatever reason. Though the government can (and should) place any reasonable QUALIFICATIONS on people to become citizens.

And that is just what the government is trying to do. The qualifications are pretty clear in this proposal - graduate from a high school here, attend at least 2 years of college or served in the military 2 years, and of high moral character (no arrests). Fine by me.
 
Once upon a time, Columbus (Re)"Discovered" a New World. Europeans fled their nations to this New World, to seek mostly religious freedom not afforded them in their home nations, or to exploit the natural wonders of this New World. European nations and corporations colonized the New World. When there were famines in Europe, the people came here to survive.

Africans were enslaved and imported to do the heavy lifting in the agricultural regions.

The Spanish came and slaughtered the native people they found here. The land that the native people lived on for millenia was taken from them through the establishment of courts and land deeds, and they were forced to migrate to lands chosen for them that weren't so easy to exploit. When they left the reservations and their culture conflicted with ours, we massacred them

Chinese were imported to build the rail roads and then we enacted immigration laws to prevent any more from coming here.

We drew arbitrary lines in the sand and called them borders, which is fine. But now that we're here, we want to keep out people who want to come here for the same reasons our ancestors came. We made it onto the boat, time to bring up the ladder behind us.

These "illegals" are american indians. They and their families have lived here, in California when it wasn't part of the USA, in Texas when it wasn't part of the USA, in Arizona when it wasn't part of the uSA. They've lived here all along.

So we legislate it so they're "illegal" and want to put them back on their reservations.

Sure, we did a lot of bad things along the way, but this is still a melting pot. Our society is the product of those African slaves and their "contributed" labor. It's the product of those Chinese who built those railroads that gave everyone such prosperity. It's the product of those Indians, if you consider Illinois is an Indian word (for Onion) and most of the streets there are Indian words and names, or here in California the towns are named El Cajon and streets have names like El Camino Real.

And this is now, when the whole world is supposed to be much more enlightened. In those days, wars were fought until the enemy was entirely killed to the last man, woman and child. Today we try to avoid collateral damage because our view has changed to care about peoples. We enter into treaties with nations of the world (Geneva Conventions) to (try to) assure we treat one another with some minimal and reasonably enlightened sort of dignity in time of war or conflict.

It is an international crime against humanity to force the mass migration of people, so we're not going to be forcing 10M+ indigenous people to move out.

The constitution gives the govt. the power to regulate CITIZENSHIP. I don't see the point in refusing people citizenship who want it, or restricting the number for whatever reason. Though the government can (and should) place any reasonable QUALIFICATIONS on people to become citizens.

And that is just what the government is trying to do. The qualifications are pretty clear in this proposal - graduate from a high school here, attend at least 2 years of college or served in the military 2 years, and of high moral character (no arrests). Fine by me.

repped
 
Your whole premise is ridiculous. We are a nation of laws and when people break the law, they should not be rewarded. "International crime against humanity"? If a bunch of squatter started living in your house and eating your food, using your showers for free, and watching television, you'd want them the fuck out.

You're simply enforcing the federal law, namely, people who entered the country illegally...should not be here. Why even have customs enforcement? Let everyone through the flood gates.
 
Your whole premise is ridiculous. We are a nation of laws and when people break the law, they should not be rewarded. "International crime against humanity"? If a bunch of squatter started living in your house and eating your food, using your showers for free, and watching television, you'd want them the fuck out.

You're simply enforcing the federal law, namely, people who entered the country illegally...should not be here. Why even have customs enforcement? Let everyone through the flood gates.

My premise is that is is WE who are the squatters, and we've historically invited in all our friends and relatives.
 
We drew arbitrary lines in the sand and called them borders, which is fine. But now that we're here, we want to keep out people who want to come here for the same reasons our ancestors came. We made it onto the boat, time to bring up the ladder behind us.

Do you own property, Denny?
 
Do you own property, Denny?

Yes I do. Though I don't know of any actual squatters in any number who are living in peoples' owned property against those owners' will.

What's your point?
 
Yes I do. Though I don't know of any actual squatters in any number who are living in peoples' owned property against those owners' will.

What's your point?

So you wouldn't mind if I squatted between your arbitrary lines drawn in the sand?
 
So you wouldn't mind if I squatted between your arbitrary lines drawn in the sand?

I don't mind if you squat on public land. The government owns too much of that as it is.

Again, you're not making a point that I can see. The people you say are "illegals" are paying rent or owning their own property.
 
That wasn't the question.

Do you mind if I squat between your arbitrary lines drawn in the sand?

Apples and oranges, and a strawman at that.

If you're getting at the borders mean something, they do. Right up to those arbitrary lines in the sand, the government can tax people and is supposed to protect them from foreign military invasion. What makes it apples/oranges is that there's nobody squatting on land you personally own.
 
Apples and oranges, and a strawman at that.

If you're getting at the borders mean something, they do. Right up to those arbitrary lines in the sand, the government can tax people and is supposed to protect them from foreign military invasion. What makes it apples/oranges is that there's nobody squatting on land you personally own.

This is so ridiculously contradictory to your original ramblings it hurts to read it.
 
This is so ridiculously contradictory to your original ramblings it hurts to read it.

There is a lot of property for sale these days, and no law against non-citizens owning it.

I've written nothing inconsistent with my first post.
 
So Denny, would you open up immigration to anyone that wants to come here? Green cards for all?
 

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